Burnside Spencer Serial Number

[gundogman]

Two Flints,

New to SSS, and recent Spencer owner.
I know Im at the right place as there seems to be a wealth of knowledge here.
The rifler I have is a carbine, and marked with the usual Spencer infor, but also states under that manuf,d at prov. R.I.
by Bunside Rifle Co. , as best I can make out.  Serial No. is: 11433, on the breech and a matching number under the forearm.
Ive read your disclaimer, and understand.

Looking for any information you might have that could place its date in time.  Its still a rimfire and am anxiious to to convert to centerfire.  Bore looks good and all in all the rifle is in pretty good shape.

thanks again

[Two Flints]

Hi Gundogman,

Sorry I can't help you if you have a Burnside Spencer.  My SRS books only have serial #s for the Spencers Manufactured by the Spencer Company.  The Burnside Spencers may have made it out West with civilians or were sold overseas.

Two Flints

[gundogman]

Thanks for the help,  anyway
Maybe someone out there might have some idea of the approximate date of manufacture.  Would you think Roy Marcot's book might be helpful, or does it deal mostly with military issued Spencers?

[Two Flints]

Gundogman,

The Burnside Rifle Company manufactured 30,502 model 1865 Spencer carbines that were delivered between April-October, 1865 to the US Ordinance Department.  The first 16,008 had no magazine cut-off switch, while the last 14,494 had the Stabler Cut-off installed. Because of production tardiness in the manufacture of the Burnside Spencers they were never delivered in time to be used in the Civil War.

The Marcot book devotes about 6 pages to the Burnside Spencers.

Two Flints

[gundogman]

Thanks again two Flints! 

[Two Flints]

Gundogman,

If you are looking for additional info on Burnside Spencers do a Google search and just type in Burnside Spencers.  There is a lot of info on the Internet, plus photos.  Give it a try.

Two Flints

[Herbert]

Your Burnside carbine was accepted by the goverment on July 11/1865. and would have most likly been placed in stores,the main 1865 Spencer issued to troops had the Stabler cut off fitted,if you read some old cavalry reports by serving troops in the early Indian wars you oftern com across refrences to troops refering to the Spencer as my Burnside carbine,as these troops were at the time issued with 1865 Spencer carbines it is obvious that some the Burnsides were used by the army in the Indian wars,but most went into stores were large lots were sold to France,the taken to Germany and gain sold on the surples market,all so large lots were sold through US surples dealers such as Bannermans for sale to any one who would by them,right up to the turn of the 20th centuray the were adds for new 1865 Spencers for sale by Sears & others

[Cross Draw Dave]

Herbert,
I haven't had a chance to post any pics of my recently acquired Burnside Spencer, but it's serial number 5471.
It was apparently in a fire and the forearm and buttstock were severly damaged. I'm working on cleaning it up and replacing stocks as the action and other metal are in fairly good shape.
I swear the receiver stamp says Model 1863 (not 1865), but Mfg. by Burnside Rifle in Providence RI. I know that Burnside only made 1865s, but I'm going to post pics this weekend of the reciever markings. I have yet to find any other proof or inspection marks.
It has fixed buckhorn style rear sights that look original. It has dovetails for both the buckorn style sight and ladder sights as well. Front sight, rear swivel and saddle bar staple/ring are missing.
Overall length is 37" and barrell is 22" This belonged to my father in-law who thought it was a junker, but it has real potential. A professor at SIU in Carbondale IL told him it was a .56 .56. The barrel mics at .52 cal which I believe is correct even for the .56.
The Prof. even made a beautiful round for it that I will post pics of as well.

Please let me know if you know anything about the serial number. OK?

Thanks buddy!

[Herbert]

Your Burnside 1865 carbine was acepted into stores on May 27,1865.It sounds like you have a gunsmith conversion of carbine into sporting carbine,to me these are more interesting than the original Spencers,some were done by famous gunsmiths of the time and are works of art,others are done by local smiths for customers wants and can be in many diffrent configerations,pictures would be very welcome,there needs to be a list of photos of these conversions for future reffrence

[Cross Draw Dave]

Thanks Herbert!
So, it was issued to the govt. Probably a take home by some union soldier and sporterized over the years.
I really wish the original forearm and stock were still intact. That would at least tell some more of the story.
Do you think I'll find any inspector's proof marks as I clean'er up? Any special place to look?
Any idea what state it went to? I live in Southern Illinois, but I know that doesn't necessarily mean the carbine was in this state originally.
I'm going to post some pictures this weekend. I want some before and after pics anyway.

Thanks again for your help.

[Herbert]

The Burnside spencers all went to stores after the cival war,the early ones without the cutt off were most likely never issued,but were sold as serplas in the 1870s,if it has a 22 inch barrel this is not original to the carbine as are the sights,this segest youse as a hunting rifle converted by a local gun smith and to me makes its history all the more interesting

[Cross Draw Dave]

Hey Pards,
Here's some pictures of my Christmas project. She's been through a fire which basically destroyed the stock and forearm.
Talked to Phil at S&S and he figures the heat from the fire melted the front sight brazing which allowed it to fall off. I tried to get some good shots of the buckhorn sight. Herbert? Whatta'ya think about that? Factory or Gunsmith?
It's amazing that the action still functions and the metal is in pretty good shape. I'm gonna start cleaning her up and trying to do a basic restoration over the Christmas holidays. My father in-law gave me this gun thinking it was pretty hopeless, but I think he's gonna be surprised when I get her done. One thing that's really unfortunate is that he had been burglarized in the early eighties, and the local sheriff convinced him to engrave his SSN on every gun he owned. Not real good advice, but I think it was pretty common at the time. Sooooo...his SSN is engraved on the left side of the receiver. If anyone has any ideas about correcting that let me know. The charred stock will be coming off this weekend and she's going in a kerosene dip for a few days to soften the crud (pre-cleaning). I've got a Dunlap buttstock coming, and the Pa -Inlaw had replaced the forearm years ago when he was at Dixie Gunworks. Ya'll wish me luck. It's gonna be a big job, but it will be worth it I'm sure. I don't think she'll ever be a shooter, but it will have a place of honor in my collection.

[Herbert]

Could you check the barrel lenth again ,it should be 20 inches not 22 inches,other than that is seems to be a standard carbine with a replacment sight and sling bare removed

[Cross Draw Dave]

Thanks Herbert.
When measuring the barrel. Do I measure barrel tip to breech or barrel tib to where it joins the receiver?
I think that's where my barrel length confusion may be.
Let me know.
Thanks!

[Herbert]

From breack to  crown,if the barrel is 22 inches it is a replacment barrel