Zoot Shooters-Ya got to be kiddin' me!

[Crow Choker]

Mr. Marshall Holloway, How in the world did this get on CAS, ie Cowboy Action Shooting. I don't know if you yourself are into 'Zoots', more power to ya if ya are. I am into a few other things besides CAS interests myself, but I would never make fellow shooters on a forum geared to 'old west' style shooting and dress suffer a new topic headliner with a period of US history that doesn't apply to what this forum (CAS) represents. (That's COWBOY ACTION SHOOTING, not Gangster Action Shooting). Start another forum for fellow 'Zooters', but don't make us suffer by seeing this on CAS. What's next, "1950 era B movie reenactments" using 1950 era cork guns that we who grew up in that time all had?? How about "Old Space Movie's" using era plastic rayguns that squirt real water, maybe I can find an old Flash Gordon suit in a junk shop! Sounds stuipid, yep, so does 1920 era 'gangster' dress up with "Flapper" girls and tommyguns. Do participants have to talk out of one side of their mouth only when "Zooting"? Mr. Marshall, ya got both of my thumbs and big toes "down" on this, throw in my 'nose down' too! Recently on the 'Darkside' section there was a lively discussion on whether using a two-handed hold vs a one handed hold in shooting a revolver was 'old west ' and authentic! Read alot of hot reactions and comments on that one. Noticed 'Cuts' must have 'deep-sixed' it due to some of the reactions by CAS members. Wonder what this will bring? Why don't you take a vote of CAS members and see what we think? As for me and my house----get rid of it!!!!!!!!    Yours, Crow Choker

[Deadeye Don]

Looks like fun.  Hey, it involves guns, friends getting together and fun.  It is not my cup of tea, but since this is a privately owned forum, I think the Marshall can start any forum he wishes.  If you don't want to participate, then dont open any threads on this particular forum.  For myself, this is a non-issue.  If the forum sparks an interest with alot of people, then I am sure it will stay open.  If nobody choses to participate, then it will probably be closed.  If this forum reaches your  "suffering" level, then you are truely living a charmed life.

[ChuteTheMall]

No wierder than Wild Bunch, where cowboy rifles meet trenchguns and 1911s, celebrating one WW1 era gangster movie about Mexico.

[ChuteTheMall]

Join the Miami Vicers, featuring narcs & smugglers & cops & hoods from the era after 1959 and before 1990!

Crime Story - Dirty Harry class (1960's-1970's) using 1911s, revolvers, M1 carbines, pump & sxs shotguns!

Miami Vice class (1980's, above plus Glocks & AKs & Uzis & even pistol-grip pumps)!

[Deadeye Dick]

Makes me wonder why we can't get an 1873 Winchester rifle forum topic, but we can get a cocamami topic like this one. Give me a break! Maybe the Marshall ought to change the name of his website. It certainly is straying away from CAS.
Deadeye Dick

[Marshal Deadwood]

Personally, I like reading about Zoot shooting. More power to any gun brothers !

MD

[Marshal Halloway]

I am sorry if anyone gets a little upset about this addition to the forum. I add boards upon requests and have done so over the last 15 years and will continue to do so. Same rule apply here as on any other board.... if it is not in your interest, simply ignore it. Don't waste any online time and aggression on it....  Life's too short .

Seriously....

We have received several requests about boards that goes past the time period cowboy action shooting covers, but involves reenactment or activities that combine history and firearms. Wild Bunch was of course a natural addition since it is approved by SASS. The plainsmen board we added a few weeks back covering the 1840-1860 time period was another.

We started receiving requests about a Zoot Shoot board last year and like many of these requests, I allow myself to think about it for awhile unless it is directly related to CAS.

Last weekend, I traveled to Denver on behalf of Outdoor Channel to get a closer look at what this is all about. Is it cowboy action shooting? No, but it is another shooting sport that embraces a dress code and period correct firearms. To my surprise, I noticed that around half of the competitors are actually cowboy action shooters and some are as engaged in this sport as they are in CAS, both in terms of firearms and costumes.

I am not involved in Zoot Shooters, but I do applaud their effort to give us another alternative or addition to the mix, the same way as I applaud any effort to encourage people to get involved in our sport, regardless of the time period hat they are using.

CAS city will never have boards covering "regular shooting sports" like IDPA and USPSA, but any sport and activity which embraces the fun and package deals cowboy action shooting gives to those involved.

[RickB]

Anything that will let me shoot a Tommy gun or an old BAR full auto would sure get my interest. Not too wild about zoot suits really, but the guns are cool and I don't mind looking at a couple of cute flappers while I'm waiting for my turn to shoot. 

[Marshal Halloway]

Here's a pic from last weekend's match at Colorado Rifle Club.

The timer operator is in SASS circles better known as Bat Masterson, SASS #2919 and NCOWS #530.

In this match he is G Man, AZSA #11.

He is wearing a police uniform from the 1930's.

[Grizzly Skinner]

Howdy all.

Thanks Marshal for giving this new type shooting a try out here!

I have been a SASS member and CAS shooter for quite a few years. Like many of us, I have a bunch of older style guns that don't quite fit into CAS. When we heard about the zooters starting out in Colorado, a few of us jumped on board and started the first branch of this type shooting on the east coast. The folks that shoot with us are 90% CAS folks who were looking for an excuse to shoot some of those old pencil barreled revolvers that have been sitting in the safe!

We have had a lot of fun with this, and hope that the participation grows over time. Like you said, it is a fun way to go back in time and send lead down range. All I am doing is switching hats from a Stetson to a Fedora, using a snub nose Det. Special instead of an old west pocket pistol, and blasting away with a tommy gun instead of my '73!

To make it friendly for all, we have a levergun class for those who prefer them, with round counts that are suitable.



Grizz

[Old Top]

Marshal,

I have seen other things on Zoot Suiters, I am looking forward to learning more.

Old Top

[Texas Lawdog]

I've got a couple of old Colt DA's, a 1911, and a Browning Auto-5 riot gun(made in 1938). I would love to have an Auto-Ordance Tommy gun to shoot. Maybe sometime down the road, when money is available. I would love to get an old police uniform from the 30s to wear.

[Deadeye Don]

Here's a pic from last weekend's match at Colorado Rifle Club.

The timer operator is in SASS circles better known as Bat Masterson, SASS #2919 and NCOWS #530.

In this match he is G Man, AZSA #11.

He is wearing a police uniform from the 1930's.

Wow.  What a cool costume.  He really put effort into that. 

Marshall,  I just wanted to thank you for running a great board and giving all of us an opportunity to participate in those forums we are interested in. 

[Crow Choker]

     Yup, I'll agree with some of what some of you have said, "Looks like fun'! I'll agree with what was said of Marshall Holloway, that he can start any forum topic he wishes, He's the man, it's his forum. Some of you stated you have non-cowboy firearms you'd like to shoot in some form of competition, I sure do, as most of you likely do. I agree to what was said about "more power to gun brothers"! I support any form of firearm shooting and support their right to do so. I'm a strong supporter of 2nd Amendment  gun rights, the right to own and shoot. Ya, I agree the Wild Bunch topic and shooting sport is after the 1900's, post-cowboy, turn of the century, but it's at least a 1st cousin. I shoot 45 acp, but most likely will never shoot 'Wild Bunch'. Yes, I know I can ignore the 'Zoot Shooting' topic, just pretend it doesn't exhist. I know I can decide not to read, review, or post on it, but there is 'alot of buts' to consider.

    I can turn myself off from the 'Zoot' topic, ie not decide to read or post any threads, I'm not just out of high school  my friends and need to be explained the do's and don'ts of life and how to live it.  I can ignore the Zoot topic' just as I do 'trash' TV, movies, music, etc. Not saying the Zoot shooting is trash, just not what I'm into OR joined this forum for, as most who have. If a person is or gets into Zoot shooting, join and read a Zoot forum. I started reading and joined this forum, the "Cowboy Action Shooting" forum, ie CAS City, because I like to shoot single action revolvers and lever guns. Love the old west history-love western movies and television (good ones). I joined because of the 'information highway' aspect of learning new ways of doing things or new things period. I'm not a 100% authentic cowboy shooter, in other words, if something I shoot or use isnot 100% the way it was done prior to 1900 or 100% anything, I don't get worried about it or look down at someone who is either. Nor do I have qualms with someone who is, just don't blast me for not being so.

    As I stated, I have firearms that are 'not cowboy'. I'm equally happy to shoot police related firearms and shooting courses that are tied in. I used to shoot PPC and police combat courses with glee. I could pump six .357 Mag rounds into a target and cover em' with my hand. I collect and shoot WWI and WWII bolt action rifles, cast my own bullets and would be happy to shoot them in some sort of mid and long range competition. I am a member of a forum that is for military rifles only. I am a member of another forum that deals with all forms of revolvers and auto-pistols. One thing I don't see on them are posts that relate to CAS. If I would start to ask questions on reloading and shooting a 30/06, 8mm, or .303, what kind of reaction would I get on this forum?  Most likely be told to go to forums that deal with such issues. I see that there are 'Zooter' forums on the web. Let 'Zooters', and military highpower shooters, etc have theirs, let those interested in cowboy, old west, etc, shooting have theirs.

    I  have seen myself what happens to clubs, the media, organizations, groups, etc., when the 'fences are let down' and ideas and beliefs are compromized. Look at television. Once upon a time, all the major networks ran programs that any age group could watch. Now the majority of them all are not fit for human consumption of any age group. Same with most movies and alot of recorded music.  Once you let things into any organization that has nothing to do with the main purpose of that group, your opening things up for change. Look at what political correctness has done to this country. Again I'm not saying or advocating that Zoot Shooting or their participates are sinister, evil, or to be shunned. It's just that Zoot shooting and cowboy type shooting are far apart in both history and firearms. If Zoot shooting is allowed on a forum that is based on western, pre-1900 attire and guns, then the door should be open for the WW2 reenactors shooting WW2 firearms, and any other group, let em all in to CAS City.

    Marshall Holloway, I don't disagree with your right to add additional shooting topic's to CAS, I do disagree when it has nothing to do with CAS and indicated it in my first post and am doing so with this one. Some of the guys who posted relpies seem to be all giggly about the addition. That's fine, but if they want more info on it or want to participate, my thoughts are download a "Zoot' forum. I really like CAS City, but I don't base my life on what I read here. If for some reason you would 'shut er down', I would miss it and be dissapointed, but I could live on. You indicated some of the shooters at a Zoot shoot were SASS members, no problem, but I don't see where that is a 'go ahead' to include that style of shooting in one that is 'cowboy/old west' based. If some of the members here want to shoot Zoot, they'll more in likely still shoot 'CAS'. From what I read, SASS is a shadow of it's former self due to the changing of rules to make everyone happy. Quess I am more NCOWS minded. Allowing alternative shooting styles into a forum based on cowboy shooting could have the same of effect on that forum.  I to have other interests besides shooting. I collect and play guitars alot. On one forum that is based on the playing of acoustic guitars, once in a while someone will post a question referring to electric guitars. Quess the question asker didn't notice the forum said "Acoustic Guitar Forum".

    Well, I've said my piece for the day. You guys can 'Oh and Ah' over the Zoot topic. I'm gonna just ignore it and hope it dies a fast death here at the "City', don't see much interest so far other than the 'Oh's and Ah's' some of ya proclaimed. Maybe ya were just try'in to 'brown-nose' the Marshall. Anyway Marshall Holloway, I still thank ya for creating and puttin the City on the Internet HIghway, even though AL Gore created the internet. I'm still of the mindset to get rid of it and I'm stickin to it. I'm going to shy away from the 'Zooters' topic after I post this, so "Boy's, ya can have at it throwin rocks at me for what I have said"! Have a good day or night to all as to whenever you are reading this. Yers, Crow Choker      

[Koyote]

Here's a pic from last weekend's match at Colorado Rifle Club.

The timer operator is in SASS circles better known as Bat Masterson, SASS #2919 and NCOWS #530.

In this match he is G Man, AZSA #11.

He is wearing a police uniform from the 1930's.

Hey  glad to see some info on here about the Zoot Suiters on here.
I have heard of them before. Thought it was great to see another era represented in a shooting sport.
And I have a few guns that would fit right in, but no Tommy!!!

Anyone not wanting to read about ZOOT SHOOTERS only has to not click on the link!!!
Keep up the great work Marshal!!!
Koyote

[Forty Rod]

Makes me wonder why we can't get an 1873 Winchester rifle forum topic, but we can get a cocamami topic like this one. Give me a break! Maybe the Marshall ought to change the name of HIS website. It certainly is straying away from CAS.
Deadeye Dick

When it's YOUR website you can do it any way you want to.  In the meantime, suck it up and read something else.

[Major 2]

4dRods is spot on....

Nothing at all wrong with posting Zoot Suiters here....adds spice to stew as it were 

I'd would not mind , cutting loose with a 100 round drum Thompson.....

Maybe going to a Speak Easy.... This was my Folks shinning era they married in 1929, 
I remember the stories they told....

[Deadeye Don]

I guess there is no reason to comment further about Crow Choker's last long comments since he won't be reading any replies to his last contribution.  

I am just glad to see that some of us can still get "giggly" about "trash".  

[Mogorilla]

Hey Marshall,
This is your BBQ, and it is all good!
I would love to try this out, especially if they had guns for you to try.  Shot a Tommy gun when I was 10, I really liked it!  It was a military one that someone brought home.  In case any of you were not aware, look up any time frame, and I mean any from Paleo to future (trekkies) and you will find reenactors.  Seriously I know some who do Alexander the Great's time frame, Trojan War, Roman Empire, WWII. 

[Pitspitr]

Zoot Shooters?!!! Yea.... I'm AZSA #15. Love my Tommy and my 1911! Someday I'll get to a match.