30 shot Target made in 1875 by Doc Pardee

[w44wcf]

Some years ago I received a reproduction of an 1875 Winchester catalog. On page 24  there was a picture of a target containing 30 shots made with the 1873 Winchester rifle by E.H. Pardee, MD, from San Francisco, California.

In part he wrote:
"It affords me much pleasure to communicate to you the result of 30 consecutive shots at the distance of 110 yards, with one of the improved Winchester rifles (1873).

The firing was done without wiping, which proves the Winchester steady in her performance and gives  assurance to the sportsman that if he only performs his part in manipulation of the piece, he need not fear the California jaguar, or grizzly bear."   (......or protecting buffalo hunters from Indians)



The group measures about 4" which at 100 yards would equate to a 3.6" group. I decided to see if that could be equaled in this era using the original 44-40 bullet. I did not get the chance / focus to do so until recently (too many other projects).

My first attempt in May, 2011, resulted in a group measuring about 5" or so, but encouraging was the fact that 25 rounds did group inside of 4"

For my second attempt in June, 2011, I decided to mount a 4X scope on the rifle since I wanted it to be a true test of the rifle / ammunition combination rather than a test of the rifle / ammunition / and my aging eyesight . In my earlier years I could shoot iron sights as well as a scope, but not anymore.....

Here's the target with the ammunition recipe and a tribute to Doc Pardee who started me down this path.... Thank you Doc.
I drew the circle after the target was made.

 

I want to express my thanks to "Fairshake" who had ACCURATE MOLDS make a copy of the 427098 bullet design but with flat bottomed lube grooves like the original 44-40 factory lead bullets were and to specify that the mold drop bullets at .429" diameter which is a good fit for current 44-40 barrels. I used bullets from that ACCURATE MOLD for my testing.

Prior to the 1st 30 shot attempt, I did try Goex and Schuetzen powders with the 427098 to see if they would go the distance, but both "fouled out" in 15 rounds (hard ring of fouling from the muzzle back into the barrel a couple of inches) and the group(s) really opened up. Perhaps they would work ok in  20" and less barrels but they didn't in that extra 4" (24") on the Marlin Cowboy with the original 44-40 bullet.

As we all know, it is kind of neat to walk in the footsteps of the ones that have gone before us........

Happy Trails,
w44wcf

[Steel Horse Bailey]

I found this post AFTER I saw ... and posted on your other post regarding shots #31-#40.

Good stuff, pard.  And NOW I understand the use of a scope!  LoL!


I certainly understand about the aging eyesight!  ('Tho I happily can say that my latest vision test, in June '11 showed 20-20 in my R eye and 20-30 in my L - but that was at distance ... my arms aren't long enough anymore - I gotta use dollar-store reading glasses inside.  Not bad for 1 month(ish) short of 60, eh!)


Again, VERY nice reporting, Sir!

[Oregon Bill]

Yessir, nice work. I notice that your vertical dispersion is greater than the horizontal. Primer?

[w44wcf]

Steel Horse Bailey,
That's very good eyesight for your age! I'm almost 8 years further down the road.......
I can still shoot tang sights ok but not quite as well as using a 4X scope so... since I wanted to see what the true capabilities were of the rifle / ammunition combination........

Oregon Bill,
In testing the CCI300 primer seems to be the most mild and thus seems to work the best with SWISS.  Although the group is a bit taller than wide, it is somewhat rounded. Consistancy is key when attempting to shoot the best groups. I did attempt to place the rifle on the bags the same way each time with the same amount of pressure on my shoulder.  I do recall though do to some other distractions (other shooters) that I was not as consistant as I should have been.

w30wcf  
   

[Jamie]

This is just plain, flat cool.  Thanks for the efforts and for honoring someone long gone.  That's not just interesting, that's class.  I have to say, however, that while I might feel OK pursuing jaguar with a tube full of 44-40's, the grizzlies can feel absolutely safe... though I must admire Doc's confidence. (Or was that Winchester's quote?  If so, they must not have valued their customers much!)
Jamie

[cpt dan blodgett]

Back in the day short of a 45/70 in a single shot or something similar say the 40/65 or 45/75 model 76, the 44-40 was a hot cartridge especially when up against the 44 henry

[w44wcf]

Jamie,
Thank you for the kind words.  The thought process of the early users of repeating rifles was to use repeated shots as necessary to get the job done depending on the situation.  Buffalo Bill told of his experience with a bear in the black hills...... the bear charged him and he was able to hit the bruin with multiple shots "which was a little more lead than he could comfortably digest." 

w44wcf

[Fairshake]

John, I thank you for all the hard work and time that you took to prove my beliefs were true about the design of that bullet. I knew the basic shape was there but that it needed some tweaking to perform as we wanted it to. With my current health problems, it could have been much longer before I could do as you did. I am so elated you would laugh if you saw me looking at the targets. I use this bullet for all my 44-40 shooting now even the close range of SASS. It's the satisfaction I receive when I see the target hit dead center. We had a stage that was fired all revolvers with targets at 45 yards in. It was a blast to hear each ting when that 210 hit home. If things are good this fall then I will do some hunting with it. I used both NASA and SPG and saw no difference. My powder was also divided in that about half were Goex Cartridge and the remainder were 2F Swiss. I can't thank you enough for being such a good friend.

[Jamie]

Sorry, just got back to this - make no mistake, I'd a whole lot rather face an irate grizzly with my '73 in 44-40 than with a sharp stick!  On top of that, there are those who, no stranger to danger can stand there and without flinching punch in, with accuracy, more lead than a bear could easily and/or comfortably digest.  I'd love to believe that I might have that much, uh, ability, on the other hand, I'd be alot happier with my buddy's BLR which he put a .35 Whelen barrel on.    Still, while I might be a bit more circumspect as to my action with the '73, you'd better believe I'd be pumping lead! 
Jamie

[Steel Horse Bailey]

ABOUT any gun in ANY caliber will suffice ... IF  the shots are well placed.   While I would hesitate to recommend any specific caliber for any specific critter (I shoot paper, tin cans and such, and have only gone hunting 3 times - twice with a 22 for rabbit & squirrel, and once dressed in total 1870s period and shooting black powder 45 Colt rounds for deer) I',m only relating what I've heard over the years.

About 30 yrs. ago, I read an account by one of the editors of a shooting magazine.  I forget which one, now.  Anyway, he was out shooting jack rabbits and was armed with a 22 and nothing else, including a partner.  While stalking  the wily rabbit, he disturbed a mother black bear with her cub.  He knew better than to turn and run and she would not move away despite whatever yelling and/or antics he could do.  She stood and advanced on him.  Every time she opened her mouth to roar he shot up into her mouth, hoping to go 'thru the softer roof of her mouth and into her brain.  It worked (obviously, since he wrote about it!) but he wrote that it took all 17 rounds he had in the tube of his Marlin rifle!  Not all the rounds penetrated where needed, but apparently the last one did!

I'd say that was a pretty good indicator of a hunter who kept his "cool" and did what was needed to save his own life.

[Wolfgang]

Some gun writer  ( i'm fugettin' which one) wrote that in his early days he was meat hunting for some lumber or construction camp  . . . nothing around bigger than .22 caliber little critters to shoot for the pot, . . . he had a .22 cal. repeater rifle of some sort . . and along came a moose.  He needed that moose meat badly.  So he proceeded to pump the whole magazine of .22s into the moose. It worked Ok.  The camp had moose meat for a while.   

[Cal Fornia]

I wonder if Doc Pardee got that group at a bench, or whether he was standing on his own two legs.

[Bryan Austin]

I'm kinda thinking w44wcf needs to change his aka to "Doc Pardee"