RCBS Lead Furnace

[rickk]

UPS delivered me a new RCBS 20# PRO-MELT furnace today.

I haven't tried it out yet, but it just looks way better than my pair of LEE drip-O-matic's. It's supposed to rain all weekend so  I should be able to hide in my shed at some time over the weekend to try it out, along with a new DD Big-Lube mold.

Is there any subtle oddities about it that I should know about?  It took me quite a while to get over all the nuisances of the LEE's - hopefully there won't be any issues with this new toy.

For what it's worth, the biggest reason for putting the LEE's aside is that the heating elements are leaking electric current to the chassis.

I had two LEE's before the two that I have now, and they went away for the same reason. 

The LEE's only have a two wire plug, so unless you go out of your way to ground them, they become a shock hazard when the elements go bad. I supposed they could be repaired but I don't see that as being worth the cost.

For what it's worth, grounding a lead furnace is probably a good thing to do.

The RCBS furnace has a 3 wire plug, so grounding is taken care of.

I put a ground fault receptacle in my shed when I built it, just for this reason.

[August]

Some times my Pro Melt trips the GFI and sometimes it doesn't.

Be sure to follow the directions about using the pot for the first time:  15 minutes at lowest setting with no lead in pot !  Then, gradually get an inch and a half of lead melted by putting it as close to the sides of the pot as you can get it.  Then, and only then, turn up the temp and add lead.

Good spout, doesn't drip.  Good thermostat.  Large capacity allows for returning sprue without affecting melt temperature.  Will receive muffing tin ingots without problem.  Has enough lead to make a session worth while.

I'm guessing you're gonna like it.

Be sure to clean and smoke your dd bl mold thoroughly.  I'm having some trouble with one of my new ones and think it's due to some burrs at/around the joint.  I'm gonna put the magnifier on it before using it again.

[Patrick Henry Brown]

Got my new RCBS Pro-Melt a couple of weeks ago, but haven't had a chance to do anything but put it together. I'm also planning on trying it out this weekend. Like you, I'm retiring the two Lee Pots I've got.

[w44wcf]

rickk,
You're going to love it!   I have two RCBS pots, one of which is dated 1986 and it's still going strong!

Since the pressure / flow on the spout decreases as the pot is emptied, I do not lock the adjustment screw in place since I adjust it several times from a full pot down until there is about an inch of alloy left. To preserve the life of the heating element,  I do not let the alloy level get below 1".

I start by adjusting the screw so that the alloy is at a fast drip then turning it jjust  slightly until the drip becomes a stream. After about inch of alloy reduction I again make an adjustment.  I have found that by opening the spout too much, lower quality bullets are the result. 

Have fun!

w44wcf 

[rickk]

August and w44wcf, I appreciate the advice.

When I only had one LEE pot, I would try to keep it topped off all the time with new ingots to keep the level up. When I switched to having two of them I would run one about 1/2 empty while the other one was melting added lead.

I will probably start off by trying to keep it topped off. I am hoping that with a 20+ # capacity that it will hardly notice adding a pound at a time, especially if I keep the ingots up on the rim of the pot to pre-warm them up a bit.

[Springfield Slim]

Keeping a pot topped of is an easier way to keep the lead stream consistant, at least for me. My RCBS can take a 1 lb ingot in stride. As for  the "shocking" LEE pots, check and make sure the heating element doesn't touch the frame where it comes out of the thermostat housing. Worked for me, might be good backup pots or something to use with pure lead when casting balls.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I bought a used one.  About THIRTY YEARS AGO!  I,ve found it easy to use with some reading and some common sense.  I,ve never hankered for a different pot.

It is still going strong.  I,ve had to do some minor repairs along the way, about 10 - 15 years apart.  Both times a call on the RCBS 1-800 number had the trouble identified and parts in the mail; - FREE!

[rickk]

Well, I had a dentist appointment in the middle of the day yesterday to screw up a perfect day, but I did manage to cast a few hundred 250 grain "Big-Lube" 45 bullets with the new mold and the new pot.

Everything went OK, but there were some minor annoyances typical of a casting session.

The sprue plate hinge bolt on the mold kept loosening up. I am not sure if this mold is a LEE mold or one made on the LEE pattern, but that is a classic problem with the LEE molds. Other manufacturers have taken to putting a set screw in there to stop it from happening. As it is too hot of an application for Lock-Tite, in the past I have fixed this with other molds by putting gasket cement into the threaded hole. I will try that on this one as well.

Once the mold warmed up the bullets looked nice. It seemed to prefer lead on the hotter side. The best ones had that "frosted" look typical of a hot pour.

As far as the RCBS furnace, well, the first thing that happened was that it kept tripping the ground fault protected outlet every 10 or so minutes. At least it is grounded so I'm not going to get zapped like I would with the LEE pots. While I was messing with it I looked all over the unit and the manual for a UL label. None to be found.  I don't think LEE does a UL on theirs either, as if they did there would at least be a UL Listed three pin plug on it.  So, apparently electrical leakage is something we have to live with no matter who makes it.

It is possible that the ground fault issue would have gone away once it totally heated up and drove out any moisture, but I haven't tested that possibility out yet... maybe I will run some more this afternoon. For now though I am using a non-protected outlet.

It took about an hour roughly to get the entire pot filled with molten lead at casting temperature. The temperature markings on the dial agreed closely with my thermometer. As I was casting, I would keep a couple of ingots on the top of the pot to warm them up a bit before adding them... mostly to drive off any moisture so I would not have an explosion when I added them.  There were no instances of spout freeze when adding one ingot at a time. I did have it freeze up for a few seconds when I added 3-4 pounds of sprue plate cutoffs, but the issue fixed itself pretty quickly.

I liked the mold guide mostly. It kept the mold aimed at the spout, and I did not have to hold the mold up while pouring. The only issue I had with it was that one of the two set screw collars used to position the mold kept sliding and had to be repositioned and re tightened every once in a while. I think they carry them at my local hardware store so I am going to pick up a couple and double up on them.

Most importantly, it was a pleasure to work without fighting with the spout. No drips, no clogs.

So, I give the pot a subjective 90/100 so far ... not a perfect score, but not bad. I think I would give a LEE pot a 50/100.

Hopefully I will have the same luck as everyone else seems to be having and it will still be a 90/100 in 10 years.


Rick

[rickk]

Well, I ran to the hardware store, got some  shaft collars, doubled up on the ones that were on the mold guide.

I put gasket cement on both sprue plate bolts.

The doubled up shaft collars stayed in place, and the sprue plate bolts also stayed in place.

So, no aggravation allowed me to focus on casting.

I came to a realization that yesterday I was casting with a 20# pot using a 10# pot mindset.

Yesterday I kept taking the time to return the sprue cut-offs to the pot, and top it off with ingots whenever I could.

Today I simply got the mold hot, returning the scrap generated during that exercise  every so often (about 10 casts - 60 bullets), and then when the mold started turning out good bullets I stopped messing with keeping the pot full and simply made bullets until I got down to only about 5# left.  I am guessing I made about 300 bullets in less than 1/2 hour once I got serious about casting.

And W44wcf, I see what you mean about leaving the flow adjustment screw loose... as the level dropped I found myself loosing it up to compensate. Maybe I need a little T-handle on there.

I had the heat set to 800 degrees. I think this was a bit too high. Next time, once the mold starts making good bullets I will try turning it down to 750.

I did notice that once the mold got hot that it got easier to get the bullets out. I had to whack the side of the handles with a stick to open the blocks, but when it opened most of the bullets were loose and ready to fall out on their own.

Also, this being the first time I ever had a mold guide, I noticed after a while that if I kept the mold handles slightly angled up as I filled the mold cavities back-to-front, I was able to prevent any lead from running into the next fill hole before it was time to do so. I am sure that if a drip or two goes in a few seconds before intentionally filling a cavity that there would be a less than perfect pour. With the old LEE pot I was more focused on simply holding the mold up to worry about much else.

Now W44wcf, I am sitting here thinking what it would be like to have 2 of THESE suckers like you have 

[Springfield Slim]

I like to whack the pivot bolt on the handles. If shoving in 1 ingot at a time works why let the level go down at all? Just for reference, with one 6 cavity mould with this same mould I can usually do 1000 bullet an hour, more like 1400 when I use 2 moulds at a time, which I usualy so with the 250 grain BL bullet. You might be waiting too long for the bullets to cool, keeping them warm helps the release.

[rickk]

Slim,

Thanks for the response !

When I am serious about casting I use 2 Lee 6 cavity molds at once.

I'm sure you have seen them overheat if you go to town too long with just one mold.

Anyway, I'm just playin' right now.

I tried different timings for release. Between the new pot and the new mold I still have some learning.

Once things got up to temp, I found that if I opened the sprue plate as soon as it got solid I would have some smearing under the sprue plate. I waited untill it got solid and counted to 10, cut the sprue, and then opened the blocks up right away.  After I opened the blocks I let it wait for maybe 10 seconds to make sure the bullets were not too soft before I knocked them out.

I do think I might be running the furnace a bit too hot. I will drop it down 50 degrees next time and see what happens.

I have big piles of bullets in boxes still from all my other molds, so I don't really need to crank up a second one right now.

However, I did just get in the mail today a LEE "OO" buckshot mold. That mold uses the 6 cavity blocks as well. I am still waiting for the handles to arrive. Next time I heat things up I will work that "OO" mold into the sequence and see what happens.
 

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

If I am using two moulds I try to use markedly different ones to make sorting easier.  However, if the two moulds drop substantially different weight bullets you might have to use slightly different timings as they solidify differently.

[August]

O.K.  I've just gotta ask, how does a guy use two molds at once ??

And, how do you produce 1000 bullets in a hour.

I usually end up with about five hundred after three hours.

You guys gotta help me.  Thanks!!!!

[Mako]

O.K.  I've just gotta ask, how does a guy use two molds at once ??

And, how do you produce 1000 bullets in a hour.

I usually end up with about five hundred after three hours.

You guys gotta help me.  Thanks!!!!

You alternate.  Pour one, set it down, pour the second, set it down, pick up the first and knock it, then pour it again, set it down, knock the second.  Now you are alternating one then the other.  Lets the lead harden with warmed molds, you don't get ahead of yourself and cut the sprues too early or try and drop the cast bullets before the harden and shrink slightly.

I don't have two of any one type, so I have cast two different bullets, or balls and bullets at the same time.  I had some other casters show me that technique.

I can't begin to approach 1,000 and hour... but there are some who probably can using two or more six cavity tools.

Oh, and I use a warmer to set the molds on so they don't cool if I set them down for a bit.  Keeps the "wrinkleees" or frosted bullets at bay.  Some people just remelt the first few molds worth to get the molds back to temperature.

~Mako

[rickk]

Just like Mako said.

I personally dump them all in the same cardboard box and sort them out at sizing time.  It is probably best if you cast two totally different bullets to make it easier to sort them out.

If you go too long at too high a rate with an aluminum mold, it will overheat and you will have problems. The biggest problem is that it won't close correctly and you will get lots flashing on the bullets where the block halves meet.  Running two molds keeps the production rate on each mold down to where that won't happen.

[fourfingersofdeath]

I bought mine in the early mid 80s and love it. The thing cost me an arm and a leg then.

The only suggestion I can make is to either keep it as full as you can, but if you want to run the 'head' of lead down, the flow will slow as the level of lead drops and you need to adjust the screw at the top to allow more lead out. If the flow starts to slow, ease the screw out a bit and it will increase. It will be obvious when it starts to happen. You need to adjust it anyway because if it is open too much, lead will splash and squirt everywhere. You need a bit of pressure to fill out the mould. Don't sweat it, you will work it out easily. I have disobedient fingers and I was even able to get mine operating beautifully.

Other than that, I can't think of anything. A very satisfying machine, great quality, I love it. I get a warm glow when I fire mine up!

[Springfield Slim]

OK, I gotta admit, having a 40 lb 1500 watt Magma pot helps quite a bit with the high output. I just put 2 ingots on top to pre-warm them and just drop them in as the level lowers. Keeps the spout flow consistant and doesn't create any dead time for the moulds to cool off and mess things up. Also, and this isn't well known, Magma pots have the option of having TWO pour spouts. So my fill time is cut in half of what you guys have. Otherwise 1000 an hour is all I could do with my LEE/RCBS single spout pots. And with anything over 250 grains I sometimes outran the pot and had to re-fill and wait when I was doing a large batch, meaning 2-3000 bullets in a setting. I used to have a LEE and an RCBS runing at the same time and would fill the RCBS with melted lead from the LEE. That worked also but was a PIA, so I got the larger pot. And I have cast 2 different bullets at the same time, but I found I was better off to just cast one and then the other, as sorting took more time than the time saved in casting.

[Patrick Henry Brown]

Finally got the time yesterday to try this new pot. AWESOME!! I should have spent the money years ago and saved a lot of frustration. 

[fourfingersofdeath]

Finally got the time yesterday to try this new pot. AWESOME!! I should have spent the money years ago and saved a lot of frustration. 

Nothing quite like getting something that really works out well! Congrats.

[Wagon Box Willy]

Howdy,

On a related topic, where do you all get your lead?  I'm too busy to be scrounging it.  Is it worth making your own boolits if you have to buy your lead?

-Willy