Authentic holsters?

[Laura M Hayes]

I'm new and looking at gun leather. 

Found a ton out there.  I was was wondering if any of these http://www.westernleatherholster.com/historical-holsters/ would work for SASS and NCOWS? 
I know the Billy the Kid one is off slightly as it supposed had a "keeper"? (sorry- new to the techology).   

Was also looking at:
http://www.cochiseleather.com/high-rider-unlined-gunbelt-holster-set-hsu2007.aspx


Thanks.

[Cliff Fendley]

While they may work and be legal to use they are missing elements that make them authentic. For one open toe holsters were not very common pre 1900 and a few of the designs there should have toe plugs to be authentic. You generally wont find true authentic in todays store bought rigs. That's why I started building my own.

[Mogorilla]

I would suggest getting Rattenbury's "Packing Iron".  Pretty much a definitive collection of period gunleather photos and details.   Its not cheap, but a great reference book for guys like me and Mr. Fendley who make our own.   You can probably get it on a library loan to look through and get an idea of what fits with the time frame you are thinking about.    If buying, you might buy two, one copy will get ruined from drooling over the pictures. 

[Tascosa Joe]

Looking at the links, one thing to remember:  basket weave is more of a 20th century decoration. 

[River City John]

Laura,
Thanks for asking for guidance first. Short answer is any holster good for NCOWS will also be good for SASS.
Looking at the 'historical' holster section on Western Leather Holster site, most any of the ones shown in the upper half of the page would be acceptable for NCOWS. High riding holsters that capture the bulk of the cylinder are perfect, with the ones leaning towards the 'slim jim' look the best. Yes, there were holsters used in our era that were the type where a back flap was folded behind to form the belt loop and the toe of the pouch inserted through cut straps to retain the holster body.

Stay away from buscadero style; the styles designed for fast draw, where the cylinder is exposed and the frame basically rests on the top edge of the well; and possibly many designed for movies (although some are authentic, as created by Will Ghormley or David Carrico or Trailrider and others.)

As others mentioned, let the timeframe that appeals to you dictate your choice. Also, your sidearm choice will determine the style. Cap 'n' ball or conversion, lean towards slim jim, '72 Open Top or black powder frame Peacemaker(7 1/2" barrel), choose a transitional style; and then if you're using a Peacemaker or copies with shorter barrel lengths, the styles from the late 1880's on will do.
As TJoe said, generally the progression went from simpler designs to fancy embossing as the last quarter advanced to 1900.
Have fun.
RCJ

[Pancho Peacemaker]

Take a look at El Paso Saddlery's web site.

If you fiddle with their tabs, go the section under "Western" holsters and select the "authentic" section.

I've found their selection to be authentic, very well made, and backed up by excellent customer service.  I've been a customer there for over 17 years.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

River City John said:

Laura,
Thanks for asking for guidance first. Short answer is any holster good for NCOWS will also be good for SASS.

John is right in the statement above but NOT vica versa. Not all holsters good for SASS will work for NCOWS because of the period correct aspect of it. Just food for thought.  The first fella you listed http://www.westernleatherholster.com/historical-holsters/, has some nice stuff and it is researched.

Bill

[Cole Bluesteele]

Gotta agree with Pancho on this one.  I have several El Paso leather rigs and if you order an authentic rig it will be authentic.  Just as RCJ mentioned choose your period.  I have Slim Jims with toe plugs for cap & ball pistols.  Single loop closed toe transition for Open tops and conversions.  Pluse a really nice double loop Cheyenne style set for the Colt SAA's.

[Cliff Fendley]

Does El Paso saddlery stitch their authentic rigs with linen thread? Their items look about the most correct for the larger what I would call "store bought" suppliers but I've never studied one close.

I guess a lot also really depends on what a persons definition of correct is, whether your counting stitches or just want to look right across the room.

[Cole Bluesteele]

Cliff, 

Guess you'd have to ask El Paso that one. 

Cole

[St. George]

El Paso Saddlery uses nylon.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Cliff Fendley]

You can tell by looking I just never looked at one very close. I figured cause I don't know of any of the larger suppliers that use linen because they are using modern sewing machines to crank them out. You need a needle and awl machine or hand stitching to use linen and make it truly authentic. Plus you can just tell by looking at the stitch whether it is done by hand or needle and awl stitcher like were used in 19th century. Modern sewing machines make a different looking stitch, especially noticeable on the back side.

Most of the larger saddlers such as Meanea used stitching machines starting in the 1880's. A holster wouldl be stitched in the main seam with the machine and the toe plug sewn in by hand. Since few have needle and awl machines today most custom makers of authentic gun leather hand sew it all. I'd love to have a needle and awl stitcher for those money belts.

I have a pair of Meanea saddle bags that were sewn on an awl machine but you have to look to tell there are not hand stitched, very close tight stitching. I plan to make a copy of them when I get time.

[panhead pete]

Evenin' Laura,

There are many high quality leather workers on this site.  They are humble and shy about throwing their hat in the ring.  So I will name some and hope that I do not leave out anyone who is in the biz as well.  In no particular order they are: Will Ghormly, and David Carrico, The following names appear on the forum as follows, Cowboy WC, Ten wolves Fiveshooter, Chuck Barrows and  Kid Terico.  I have seen some of Cochise Leather's work in person and his quality is good as well.  I know I may have missed a couple so let's chime in for our pards. 

YMHOS,

Panhead Pete

[bowiemaker]

Don't forget Clff's work. He is as good as any I have seen for quality craftsmanship, authenticity and attention to detail. He is working on my rig now.

[Coal Creek Griff]

There's also Buck Stinson--Old West Reproductions.

Here's the link: http://www.oldwestreproductions.com/

Buck frequently contributes to CAS City.  He knows his stuff and makes very high-quality reproductions based upon his extensive collection (several of his items are pictured in Packing Iron.

(Edited to add the link and comments.)

[Laura M Hayes]

Thanks so much for all the great advice.  And here I thought I would start with holsters bec they seemed the easiest to get.   

Bottom line it sounds like the best is to find one in Packing Irons that fits the time & I like and have it custom made. 
Question is- is custom $$$?  I don't mind paying for quality but teachers aren't paid much.

Also, I don't care for the 2nd holster required for shotgun shells.  But from what I read the shotgun sleeve is not authentic.    Thoughts?

Thanks again.

Laura. 

[Cliff Fendley]

A belt can be built that has different cartridge sizes on it. Very common thing to do and would be authentic. I've seen pictures like that. not so much for shotgun but for large rifle and handgun ammo.

I don't believe shotgun sleeve is even allowed in NCOWS.

[River City John]

Thanks so much for all the great advice.  And here I thought I would start with holsters bec they seemed the easiest to get.  

Bottom line it sounds like the best is to find one in Packing Irons that fits the time & I like and have it custom made.  
Question is- is custom $$$?  I don't mind paying for quality but teachers aren't paid much.

Also, I don't care for the 2nd holster required for shotgun shells.  But from what I read the shotgun sleeve is not authentic.    Thoughts?

Thanks again.

Laura.  

Laura,
a shotgun belt in either leather or canvas, or combination, is NCOWS legal as long as the loops are singly spaced. Plenty of evidence that foragers or hunters used shotgun belts. A configuration where loops are paired to make it easier to pull two at a time is not authentic. The shotgun slide that rides over the gunbelt is also not period correct.
Some women shooters have used a pouch on the belt, like those used by the military for pistol cartridges. Some just tuck four or six shells behind the belt in front and retrieve them from there.
Many gentleman simply tuck shells upright in their lower left vest pocket for easy retrieval. I have seen many women whose outfits may incorporate a short zouave jacket or polonaise jacket that has similar horizontal slit pockets built into the design of the over-jacket to perform the same function. If you have creative control, use a somewhat stiffer lining for the pockets for strength and a certain stiffness to hold the shells upright, such as a buckram.

RCJ

[Will Ketchum]

Some Ladies put them in their decolletage.  Rose Marie comes to mind and their is no greater lady.

Will Ketchum

[pony express]

One lady that sometimes shoots at our club wears an apron with her outfit, keeps shotshells in the apron pocket.