Flipped brim hats?

[Delmonico]

Del:

Why Del, I "represent" that remark...ahhhhh. Me and Old Top have been takin turns playin the "goofy sidekick" for nigh on 50 years.
You should see some of the head gear we have taken upon our knots...

curley

But Curly, it's only considered goofy by those who really don't know history, you know the kind that get it from the TV and the movies.

You ought to hear some of the comments from some of the know-nothing know-it-alls when I put this type on my head.

[Delmonico]

Use hot water. If you don't have another cowboy hat to wear while that one drys....you don't have enough cowboy hats. I find the shower the perfect place to shape my hat.

Do not use boiling water.... and steam can cook the fibers. These hats are made out of animal stuff......the same animals you can cook.

MD

An we hear yet from another one who really don't understand hats.  Saying you'll ruin or damage a hat by steaming it is like saying you'll ruin your guns by shooting them. 

So who in the hat business has any of you talked to that has told you this?  How many of the good custom hatters do you know?  Have any of you ever sat down and talked to a rep of on of the major hat companies, if so which company and which rep told you this? 

If either of you have ruined a hat by steaming it then put the hats down, take them to a pro, oh and don't play with power tools or anything you might hurt yourself with, I've seen fumble finger folks like that before, and I don't want to be with-in a mile of them, they are not safe in any endeavor.

[Marshal Deadwood]

Steamed hats wont hold the new shape as long or as well. It's treats the outer fibers quickly,,but fails to do good in the center...as it doesn't get consistently as 'wet nor as warm'. all the way thur. Soon,,you have to reshape again. .....I've done it both ways,,hot water is best. Period. Wet thur and thur, drys slowly but consistently.  Holds shape MUCH longer.

Steam is the 'quickie' way to satisfy an unknowing customer by 'setting' the outer fibers quickly.

Your ego in winning an argument won't change the facts one bit, Del.

MD

[Delmonico]

Steamed hats wont hold the new shape as long or as well. It's treats the outer fibers quickly,,but fails to do good in the center...as it doesn't get consistently as 'wet nor as warm'. all the way thur. Soon,,you have to reshape again. .....I've done it both ways,,hot water is best. Period. Wet thur and thur, drys slowly but consistently.  Holds shape MUCH longer.

Steam is the 'quickie' way to satisfy an unknowing customer by 'setting' the outer fibers quickly.

Your ego in winning an argument won't change the facts one bit, Del.

MD

Not ego, knowledge, you need to learn the differance.

[Marshal Deadwood]

Ruin ya hat, Del...I'd just laugh anyways. 

[Delmonico]

Ruin ya hat, Del...I'd just laugh anyways. 

I ain't ruined either my hat or 100's of customer's hats.  Have had fun, been showing this to some of my co-workers, I doubt you want to know what they thing of your knowledge or rather lack of it.  Besides dozen's of custom hatters can't be wrong or the factoriesthat make them.  Be better if you pass out bad info where there ain't folks who reconize BS whaen they see it.

[Delmonico]

BTW Deadwood, you and this other fella that's showed up, how many hats have you really ever worked on and how many folks travel great distance to have their's worked on by you?  If you look at the facts I must not be ruining hats by doing them the right way.

[JimBob]

So...........Anybody know a good way to reshape a hat?

[Marshal Deadwood]

Wet it with hot water and shape it. I've shaped only a few.

You don't work for that last best west group do you ? you sound like them.

  Why Halloway keeps you here and lots of  other folks that cant post for you jumping them leave his board,,,,,,,is beyond me. But,,it's his board. I'd have sent you packing  years ago for having that pissy attitude.

Id feel bad if you DID ke me,,,I'd figure there was something wrong with my character............but the way you talk to EVERYONE is uncalled for.

Cept for the time Chuck Burrows set you straight and you crawled like a puppy when HE corrected you.
I LOVED that exchange,,,,
MD

[Curley Cole]

Hows about another "fun" hat...??



And here is when I first "dropped by" and met the infamous GCR....had to put on a different hat for each pix we took..

curley

PS: And for what it is worth, every Cowboy store I have been to in the last 50+ years that had hats, and also, my good friend Bob "ALLHAT" uses steam to shape and bend hats. And Del comes from good stock... cc

[Delmonico]

Curley, I've seen the error of my ways, all us folks who shape hats for a living are doing it wrong.  I'm going to E-mail every western store in the country and explain it to them.

BTW, when they get our new improved Hat Dept built here at the store I'll have to send pictures, it's going to be great.  They are doing that because I'm so good at ruining hats.

[Tommy Moore]

You can shape a hat to look good but to shape a hat to fit there's only one way.  Soak it in a good rainstorm in the Fall, freeze it to your head in the winter, soak it again in the spring, bake it on your head in the summer.  Repeat.  I was about five years in on a good one before I found the one thing a hat won't take regardless of what quality.. A plow truck fire.  Guess how I know
Judging by Del's avatar I'd guess he's done the "worn" approach.  Nothing fits better than a broken in hat.   

[Delmonico]

You can shape a hat to look good but to shape a hat to fit there's only one way.  Soak it in a good rainstorm in the Fall, freeze it to your head in the winter, soak it again in the spring, bake it on your head in the summer.  Repeat.  I was about five years in on a good one before I found the one thing a hat won't take regardless of what quality.. A plow truck fire.  Guess how I know
Judging by Del's avatar I'd guess he's done the "worn" approach.  Nothing fits better than a broken in hat.   

One of many hats. Picture is a few years old, but the "Sunday going to meeting" hat is the same.  Old School 10X by Rand of Billings MT, 10X meaning 100% Beaver, Ritch Rand measured my head himself for size and shape, three months later when the hat arrived it was a perfect fit as expected.  Been cleaned a maintained, has had a little reshaping done, always with steam.  Ain't ruined yet, but will need to go back for a re-build some day, just because it is my good dress hat.  It will come back and be for the most part an brand new hat made out of the same piece of felt for a fraction of the original price.  $398.98 retail in 2000, they've went up a bit from that.  Each hat is custom ordered to customer specs.  This one don't have many bells and whistles, just the wide silk ribbon, and a slight pencil curl on the sides and a bottom bound edge of the same black color.

Few understand the bottom bound, there is a reason.

A good hatter can make the right size hat fit like a glove before you walk out of the store, if they know what they are doing.  I do it all the time.  Water won't hurt a hat if it is good quality, but it's not the way to go for most shaping, for many reasons.  Do I use it, yes I do, do I use it often, no.  It's fine for a major reshape but ain't worth a poop for detail work. 

[liten]

good sending all those emails will keep him busy for a whle   and the only reason  you put the  kettle on for is to make cupa tea

[Delmonico]

good sending all those emails will keep him busy for a whle   and the only reason  you put the  kettle on for is to make cupa tea

So, you want to show us what you can really do or you just going to keep BSin' us?  Would like to see some examples of the other guys work also.

[Drayton Calhoun]

Correct or not, I think I'll stick to my leather hat. Besides, I need the neck work out and my head to be well steamed! LOL

[Major 2]

You ought to hear some of the comments from some of the know-nothing know-it-alls when I put this type on my head.

I wonder if you get the same..."Dar bee's a pirate be ya ? " or some other dumb ass "Yo ho a sailer life for me" comment ?

[Delmonico]

Correct or not, I think I'll stick to my leather hat. Besides, I need the neck work out and my head to be well steamed! LOL

If I hadn't of traded off my chaps they might think I was a biker.

[Hangtown Frye]

The way I shaped my hat was the old-fashioned way: I wore it in the rain a lot. (Living in Western Washington State these days helps that.) When the sizing starts to get washed out, you have to push the brim up and out of the way or it flops in your face.  Likewise, as it dries you end up with the outside of the brim shrinking a bit more than the inner circle of the brim, so it's either going to flop up or down.  Since I like to see where I'm going, I opt for pushing the brim upwards.  You may note some of the older paintings and period photo's show a lace of rawhide or some such being laced to the outside rim of the brim too.  This is, I believe, for stiffening the brim, but also to tighten it a bit to keep it from flopping down in your eyes.  Again, it all comes from use, wearing it in the rain a lot, and doing what you need to do to keep the darned brim out of your eyes.

BTW, the hat in question started as a decent Stetson I bought in Raton, NM years ago. It finally gave up the ghost recently, as it's gotten just too darned floppy to deal with.  However, it reeks of "authenticity".   

For shaping a new hat or reshaping an older one, I do exactly as Delmonico suggests, and I use steam.  Definitely the best way to go.  I hadn't heard of the shellac trick though, I'll have to try it out on the old Stetson. Might breath some life into the old girl!

Cheers!

Gordon

[Delmonico]

If the felt is not torn it will work, the shellac is the same thing used in a new hat and is sold already mixed in gallons for a spay bottle and is also often sold in Western stores in and aresol or pump in a small can.  We buy ours at work by the gallon already mixed.