Another Hat Question

GunClick Rick · February 05, 2011, 03:20:41 PM

See shows ya what i know,keep them bisquits warm too.

You get ashes in ma corned beef hash i'm gonna get shed of ya..

Deadeye Dick · February 05, 2011, 04:24:17 PM

My kind of fire. I think our elk hunting fires are bigger though. Kinda makes the sour mash go down easier and the lies er, story telling more believable.
Deadeye Dick

Delmonico · February 05, 2011, 04:58:00 PM

Quote from: Deadeye Dick on February 05, 2011, 04:24:17 PM
My kind of fire. I think our elk hunting fires are bigger though. Kinda makes the sour mash go down easier and the lies er, story telling more believable.
Deadeye Dick

Are you going for plain old heat?

The fire ring is about 2 1/2 feet tall and about 3 1/2 feet around. It's 1/4" thick, not the red glow around the vent holes. Nephew asked how hot I though it was in the center. By heat color I got a 3/8" iron bar to somewhere between 2200 and 2300 degrees. It could have been forge welded.

Osage Orange is the wood in question, burns hotter than some types of soft coal.

Deadeye Dick · February 05, 2011, 07:10:09 PM

Yours is probably hotter. I know Osage Orange is pretty dense stuff. Is that the same stuff that begets Hedge Apples? We burn primarily Ponderosa Pine and Tamarack and anything else we can drag up to the fire. When you're standing in 10 inches of snow it feels good to burn one side and freeze the other. Of course we do a lot of turning around.
Deadeye Dick

Cliff Fendley · February 05, 2011, 10:37:02 PM

Hedge apple-Osage orange=same thing. Talking about a big hot fire. Bulldoze up a pile of hedge apple about the size of a house and give it a little time to dry. You can roast a marsh mellow from a 100 yards

Makes great fence post if you can find a straight one and makes nice handles too. Do your sawing while it's green cause once it dries sparks will come off of the chainsaw.

shrapnel · February 08, 2011, 08:40:36 AM

Back to the original question about stretching hats. I have my father's Stetson hat that he bought back in the 1930's when Stetson was making real hats. The quality and rating of hats now days is somewhat suspect. My father told me a good hat will hold it's shape even with a soft brim. I never understood what he meant until I got this one.

It is a nice hat that was several sizes too small for me. I went to Rocky Mountain Hat co. here in Bozeman to see what they could do. John told me that to stretch a hat more than one to one and a half sizes is next to impossible. we discussed the hat and what it meant to me and he took on the project. I don't know how many sizes he stretched it, but he did get it stretched to fit. He told me he had never seen a hat of better quality in all the years he has been in business.

As you can see from the silk lining in the hat it is made of Nutria, not beaver. The last picture shows how much we had to let out the hatband after it was stretched.

I would say that unless the stretch was small and the hat was high quality, you aren't going to succeed and it wouldn't be worth it.

Delmonico · February 08, 2011, 10:03:32 AM

I have a old Stetson Open Road someone gave me that was a 7 and now fit's my 7 3/8 head. Now I went slow and went a little bit every day for several days and left it in the stretcher over night.

Nutria, mink and beaver are pretty much the same as quality, I've seen it argued about,, the beaver is of course the most traditional.

Not all three live in and around water as opposed to rabbits and hares. And if you've ever seen a wet sheep you know you don't want a hat made of one.

The clear-nutria term means it is natural fur, not died. The term means the same as Silver-belly in a beaver hat. Another term that means little in this day and age because most silver-bellies today, ain't. I don't think a true silver-belly could be bought new today for less than about $750. Your hat today would cost at least $500 or more. Hatco (Stetson,Resitol, Dobb and Charlie One Horse) ain't so free today with what they make them out of. Their rep managed to catch me at work one day while waitng for the buyer, ain't seen him since, he asked questions, I answered. I asked questions and didn't fare so well.

GunClick Rick · February 08, 2011, 10:51:52 PM

It don't get no better than that Shrapnel.

Havin your dads hat and makin it fit you and a fine looking hat it is!Very nice,i really like that one.

I found this the other day for 5 dollars and just reshaped it a bit.I put some indian feathers on it and that's about it,didn't want to mess with it very much..Givin this one to Kid Terico..

Stu Kettle · February 16, 2011, 04:57:49 PM

Hey Del,
I have yet another hat question:
Someone just gave me my first "straw" hat - it was made by American Hat Company Inc. in Texas The label says its a "Genuine Poli Rope" & the tag lists the style as "Poli-Rope" I went to their web site & the list Poli-Rope as the quality - does that mean the "straw" is really plastic?

Delmonico · February 16, 2011, 06:14:13 PM

Quote from: Stu Kettle on February 16, 2011, 04:57:49 PM
Hey Del,
I have yet another hat question:
Someone just gave me my first "straw" hat - it was made by American Hat Company Inc. in Texas The label says its a "Genuine Poli Rope" & the tag lists the style as "Poli-Rope" I went to their web site & the list Poli-Rope as the quality - does that mean the "straw" is really plastic?

Not sure, I'd guess, we have a few of those here in the hat dept, I need to go down and look at one and see what I can find out. Oh the new improved hat dept here in the Old West Shop is progressing nicely, would guess another week or two and they all will be up here with me, guess I'll be the Mad Hatter then.

Saves me from going downstairs to work on them.

GunClick Rick · February 16, 2011, 07:53:20 PM

If it's got polyester in it that would be a hot sucker in the summer.Would it not Del?

Delmonico · February 16, 2011, 08:54:04 PM

Quote from: GunClick Rick on February 16, 2011, 07:53:20 PM
If it's got polyester in it that would be a hot sucker in the summer.Would it not Del?

Yep, I got called to the work dept to help tonight and didn't get it checked. Most "straw" hats today ain't they are some sort of fake straw painted with alkyd enamel paint. That's what makes them feel like plastic, alkyd enamels is an older automotive finish developed in the 1920's from soy bean oil. It was used on all major American cars except GM from the 1930's to into around the early 1960's. Think the old cheap MAACO paint jobs from the 1970's. (I figured this out from working and shaping these hats, when you steam them the smell is that of alkyd enamels. Old Bodyman's nose I guess.)

Curley Cole · February 16, 2011, 09:06:26 PM

GunClick Ricky,
Ifn you ever find another hat similar to that one yer given to KT, I sure would be obliged.(I am about a 7 1/4)....Ya are gettin to be the hat man for sure..

This thread is gettin real interestin. I don't think I ever heard of Nutrina.....good to know.

I thought I had found me a good fairly new Stetson in a secondhand store in Riverside. got it fer a good price...but it was too small and I thought i could stretch it....well, nope, and ya know where it ended up? On this noggin:

curley

GunClick Rick · February 16, 2011, 09:13:19 PM

No problem Curly,the one i'm givin KT is a small size,he wear a small size,i wear a 7,That hat was just like i found it with all the charactor.The guy at the counter went ,your really buying that old dirty hat?

There are a few more there but ain't got no charactor.I am always lookin,i got ya covered :)Old top looks good in that one..

Delmonico · February 16, 2011, 09:24:21 PM

OK, I heard a good hat story tonight. Since my hat area ain't done and the hats are still down stairs I didn't end up working on a hat tonight for a regular store customer. One of the kids downstairs did it, just needed a good cleaning and reblock. Anyway seems the couple had a fire about a month ago, lost most everything including several hats. But the one he saved he put on his head as they were grabbing what they could on the way out, the hat he got married in 5 years ago.

Stu Kettle · February 17, 2011, 08:52:36 AM

Quote from: Delmonico on February 16, 2011, 08:54:04 PM
Yep, I got called to the work dept to help tonight and didn't get it checked. Most "straw" hats today ain't they are some sort of fake straw painted with alkyd enamel paint. That's what makes them feel like plastic, alkyd enamels is an older automotive finish developed in the 1920's from soy bean oil. It was used on all major American cars except GM from the 1930's to into around the early 1960's. Think the old cheap MAACO paint jobs from the 1970's. (I figured this out from working and shaping these hats, when you steam them the smell is that of alkyd enamels. Old Bodyman's nose I guess.)

I rummaged around the Internet a bit last night & found several hat makers refer to there straw hats as "poli" or "poly" & a couple of those also said they were "natural straw" so I took that to mean the paint you're talking about must be what they are calling "poli" - so other than the smell It shouldn't hurt anything to reshape it a bit?

Delmonico · February 17, 2011, 09:15:34 AM

Quote from: Stu Kettle on February 17, 2011, 08:52:36 AM
I rummaged around the Internet a bit last night & found several hat makers refer to there straw hats as "poli" or "poly" & a couple of those also said they were "natural straw" so I took that to mean the paint you're talking about must be what they are calling "poli" - so other than the smell It shouldn't hurt anything to reshape it a bit?

They reshape fine, I haven't seen an un-painted "straw" hat in years though. So some must still be real straw and some may be something else. I've not dealt with those type hats much but will be starting soon. The hat reps are going to be getting a lot of questions.

Four-Eyed Buck · February 17, 2011, 11:16:21 AM

Hey, Del, how about the old Earl Schieb paint jobs. Didn't think Maaco used that stuff, thought Schieb had that market cornered. "i'll paint your car for $49.95"!.....................

Delmonico · February 17, 2011, 11:23:56 AM

Quote from: Four-Eyed Buck on February 17, 2011, 11:16:21 AM
Hey, Del, how about the old Earl Schieb paint jobs. Didn't think Maaco used that stuff, thought Schieb had that market cornered. "i'll paint your car for $49.95"!.....................

Both, but we had MAACO here.

Deadeye Dick · March 02, 2011, 11:44:14 AM

Just purchased a copy of "The Cowboy Hat Book" by William Reynolds and Ritch Rand. Anyone considering the purchase of a new hat or how to care for a cowboy hat ought to read this book first. It is chock full of pictures and information on building, care and history of cowboy hats.List price is $19.99. I purchased mine new over ebay for $15.73 plus $3.99 shipping.
Do yourself a favor, purchase one, it's an interesting well thought out and quality made book. Lots of color pictures and interesting text.

Deadeye Dick