.32 S&W Black Powder

[Datsun40146]

I just inherited a .32 S&W break-top revolver. Specifically its a 2nd Model 4th Variation H&R top break. My research places the gun right around 1898-1899. When I brought it home, nothing functioned on the gun. I stripped it down, ran it through my electrolysis machine to clean the rust and then reassembled it. I ordered new grips and all new springs from Numrich. However, I still need the rounds for it now that its back together. I do not reload and I know that the new commercial rounds even if lightly loaded still carry smokeless powder which this weapon was not designed to handle.  I have heard quite a few horror stories about modern rounds blowing up these older guns and I just got it back together. I don't want to take any chances, with my fingers or the gun. Does anyone know where one can find black powder .32 s&w? I called an outfit named stars and stripes buy they were asking a very high price with a very long lead time.

Note: After looking over several notes on case dimensions. Could one use primed .32 ACP brass. Pull the bullets, reload the primed case with cast lead and black powder? I could buy a bullet puller, and reloading the brass with black powder consists of filling of the case and compressing the powder slightly. I don't think re-seating would be too much of a problem either.

.32ACP dimensions
Case type Semi-rimmed, straight
Bullet diameter .309 in (7.8 mm)
Neck diameter .336 in (8.5 mm)
Base diameter .337 in (8.6 mm)
Rim diameter .358 in (9.1 mm)
Rim thickness .045 in (1.1 mm)
Case length .680 in (17.3 mm)
Overall length .984 in (25.0 mm)

.32S&W dimensions
Bullet diameter .312 in (7.9 mm)
Neck diameter .334 in (8.5 mm)
Base diameter .335 in (8.5 mm)
Rim diameter .375 in (9.5 mm)
Rim thickness .045 in (1.1 mm)
Case length .61 in (15 mm)
Overall length .92 in (23 mm)

The only problem would be the rim diameter. The rounds might not eject every time. But I'm doing this more for the fun than for the speed.

[rickk]

32 S&W brass is readily available.

It is possible to get set up to reload for not a heck of a lot of money. New presses can be had for under $40 bucks, and there is always ebay. New dies are under 30 bucks, and once again, they show up on ebay a lot.

A cheapo LEE dipper set will measure black powder reasonably well.

Compare those costs against the cost of loaded ammo and see how many rounds would pay for the press. I suspect "not many".

Funny thing about reloading, no matter how much stuff you have, there is always something else you wish you had, but a simple press and dies and a means of measuring powder are really all that are needed to make them go pop.

[litl rooster]

 bought my dies used for around $20 on line

I've been loading .31 round ball over a case full of fffg they are pretty accurate at 15 feet, I haven't tired a knockdown with them, but feel confident they would knock a target down.
WARNING Some argue this is not a safe load. So use the info as it works for me.  Load what you feel is safe for you


rickk is correct about always needing something else

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I have tried .32 ACP cases, and they went BANG!  The trouble is, while they are semi-rimmed and don't drop right in, the rim is thinner which leaves you with an excess headspace situation.  With very light loads this may not be dangerous in most cases.

Ammo mix-ups in weak revolvers are also a concern.

I'd go with the proper brass.

[rickk]

I'm looking at ebay right now... no deals atm on dies. They want more for dies on there than Midway does.

Several Lee C presses, which would be more than adequate for what you want to do, in the 20-30 dollar range.

lil rooster... don't scare Datsun away with the word "need". It is more like "want", but you convince yourself you "need " it

And new 32 S&W cases run about 20 cents a piece.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I do still use LEE .32 ACP dies with a shell holder for the .223 (I think - I picked one from my collection that worked!)  I have a couple of boxes of R-P .32 short ammo and reload the empties.  Some of the cases have excessively large flash holes, but they are about 20 years old and I don't use very many.

[litl rooster]

your right rickk


I am pretty damn tite  with a $$$ I have waited till the right deal comes along.  Someone cleaning a closet out. I've bought almost new sets of dies for as low as $15. Because someone "wanted" something they didn't "need" to start with.


Sir Charles had probably addressed it. How many rounds will one actually shoot in a year? Is it cheaper to buy the priced ammo at the store or a gun show.

[rickk]

Finding 32 s&w commercially loaded with black powder at ANY price is going to be a challenge.

(ANY price i think will = about a buck a round.)


"Plan B" might be finding someone who already reloads and pop in with a 6 pack of decent beer so as you can spend some time in their basement. Unless your friend already reloads 32, you might have to spring for a set of dies.

[Dick Dastardly]

I hand load .32 S&W for my lil .31 spur trigger Remington with Kirst Konverter cylinder.  I did have to buy dies, but the round is so easy to load that you may get by with a hand press and do your loading if front of the TV. . .

I load the .32Cal. DD-32-80 bullet lubed with PL-II and it shoots like a champ.

DD-DLoS

[Stu Kettle]

I just inherited a .32 S&W break-top revolver. ... I still need the rounds for it now that its back together. I do not reload...

Perfect reason to start. Here is what I would recommend based on a quick search of my favorite online store, but please shop where you choose.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1657447545
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1657447545
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=832053
http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=650614

By the time you add a can of powder & some primers, you will be a little over $1 for the first 100, but the next batch will seem almost free.  Next you'll probably want to start casting your own bullets, then they will be almost free.
I do like the hand press, do all of my rifle ammo with one in my easy chair, but I turn off the TV because I am easily distracted.

[Datsun40146]

OK so if I wanted to start loading black powder .32 S&W then I need to make sure I have everything I will need. I don't plan on loading the rounds in a large scale, maybe 100 rounds every so often. Here is what I plan to get.

LEE HAND PRESS KIT
LEE HAND PRESS KIT LESS DIES - Prairie Arms Web Store

RCBS .32 long/ .32 short Dies
RCBS cowboy dies .32 S&W long - eBay (item 270695511443 end time Jan-27-11 16:38:51 PST)

RCBS #10 shell holder. fits .221 to 380 acp
RCBS - Shell Holder #10 - .221, .222, .223 .380 Auto - eBay (item 170442054306 end time Jan-30-11 15:35:33 PST)

I have plenty of fffg black powder, 71 to 85 grain .32 lead bullets are no issue. Brass can be had either by cutting down long brass or by using expensive .32 s&w brass. Do I have everything?

[pony express]

Do you have a way to measure powder? You won't need a scale for this job(as long as you stay with black powder). But some kind of dipper would be handy. Could be as simple as a case cut a bit shorter, with a wire twisted on it for a handle. But a set of Lee powder dippers would be handy. A loading block makes it an easier job too, but you could just use a 1x4 or 1x6 piece of board with aome appropriate size holes drilled in it. don't drill too deep, though, those .32 cases are pretty short.

[Datsun40146]

According to the Lee Hand Prime kit, it comes with a powder dipper, is that what I want. Or should I buy a more specific tool? I have heard about using a case with a handle brazed onto it to measure a charge. I'll probably do that anyway, as it seems the easiest.

[rickk]

You would want to get the "LEE Powder Measure Kit", which has 15 different sized measures and a slide rule thingy that tells you how much of what kind of powder each dipper holds. The slide rule thing does include black powder in it's list of powders. It should run about 10 bucks or so.

If you want to make your own measure, you would want something to calibrate it against. If you have a suitable scale you can turn various size pistol cases into powder measures.

http://www.cabelas.com/tumblers-scales-lee-powder-measure-kit.shtml

While you can measure powder with the LEE measure kit, at some point in time an adjustable powder measure and a powder scale will be handy. They are things that you don't "need", but will probably "want" if you start loading a lot of stuff. They would be near the top of the "want" list, at least they were for me.

[Stu Kettle]

According to the Lee Hand Prime kit, it comes with a powder dipper, is that what I want. Or should I buy a more specific tool? I have heard about using a case with a handle brazed onto it to measure a charge. I'll probably do that anyway, as it seems the easiest.

The Lee hand prime kit does not come with a dipper, the Lee dies do.  It's probably not going to be the one you want for black powder, but then again it might be.  For about $20 you can get the full set of Lee dippers with a charge chart(as suggested by Rikk while I was typing this).  The Lee dies also come with the shell holder, all for less than the price of the RCBS dies.

[Stu Kettle]

If you want to make your own measure, you would want something to calibrate it against. If you have a suitable scale you can turn various size pistol cases into powder measures.

This is really only necessary if you want to know how much your charge weighs.  For black powder loads I put in enough to fill the case to just above where the base of the bullet will be when seated.  Make sure there is no air space between the powder and bullet - a little compression of the powder is good.

[Datsun40146]

Here is my final shopping list. I also order 500 CCI small pistol primers, and a pound of fffg Black powder. There is a Ram prime attachment as well, however it is not pictured. I went with the C press and I thought it would be more versatile and quicker if I wanted to load other calibers.

[Stu Kettle]

That's a good start.  Coulda save yourself $7.09 though, your Lee dies will come with a shell holder.

[rickk]

Datsun, you should be in business soon!

The C-Press will work fine. If some day you move up to a fancier press, you will find that the C-Press will still come in handy for odd ancillary functions.

At some time not too far away you will want to be able to know how much powder you are putting in. If you don't already have a scale, reasonably functional electronic scales can be found on Ebay for under 10 bucks. Make sure the scale measures in "grains" as well as other things. Most of them do.

One thing that might frustrate you eventually is the locking rings on the LEE dies. They are designed to be "easily adjusted". They snug up with an O-Ring on the underside, and are easy to turn until the O-Ring snugs up. This sounds like a cool feature, and on a turret press where the dies never get removed once they are installed it can be a nice feature.

On the C-Press you will be changing dies for each operation. Both Lyman and RCBS make lock rings that can be locked in a particular spot with an allen wrench. This means that you can set the dies up, adjust the lock ring, lock the lock ring in place, and then remove and replace the dies without any need to check the adjustment.  The Lyman and RCBS rings are both sold separately and will fit the LEE dies perfectly

This is just one of those little features that you don't "need", but might someday "want".  

[Stu Kettle]

Both Lyman and RCBS make lock rings that can be locked in a particular spot with an allen wrench. This means that you can set the dies up, adjust the lock ring, lock the lock ring in place, and then remove and replace the dies without any need to check the adjustment.  The Lyman and RCBS rings are both sold separately and will fit the LEE dies perfectly

This is just one of those little features that you don't "need", but might someday "want".  

That's something I want too - are these lock ring available individually, or must one buy the dies to get them?