Uberti Springfield Trapdoor Carbine opinions

[Drydock]

Texicans LUV to show off their toys . . . 

[Grapeshot]

I shoot an H&R Trapdoor Carbine and it works great and is not near as expensive as the Pedersoli models.

H&R stopped making the Trapdoors years ago.  I picked up a Carbine back in 1973 for $154.00 from my local sporting goods store.  I haven't seen any since 1980 except in gun magazines.  If they have reinstated their manufacture of them it's news to me.

[Drydock]

They're talking about the original run of H&Rs.  Unfortunatly they've recently developed something of a collector market themselves.   Depending on condition, price runs right up there with originals and new Pedersoli's.

[StrawHat]

Originals available here.

http://www.trapdoors.com/gallery.php?area=guns

[Doug.38PR]

I'm going to try to get me one sometime after April  

[Montanashooter]

This just a alternate thought, there numerous already cutdown trapdoor infantry can be had significantly cheaper then repros or all complete infantry rifles even.  Trapdoors Galore sales converted stocks (though i feel they cost enough and can be done by onesself) , barrels changes are easy and carbine length barrels are real common on onlinie auction sites etc.  due to the muzzle is usually the worse part if cleaning rods got a little to agressive.  Some may say you need a gunsmith for everything but i dont feel any of this cant be done by a capable person that has some common sense,patience and slight tool skillls.  Barrels are usually a direct interchange just dont use a pipe wrench, barrel vices are pretty simple to make if you have a welder and a couple small pieces or hard wood for vice "jaws" so to speak.

[Doug.38PR]

Most people make a big to do about repeating rifles that won the west.   No doubt the Winchester/Henry/Yellowboy did indeed offer a considerable advantage.....but you could do far worse if you were in a hole with a dead horse next to you surrounded by Indians if you had a Trapdoor Carbine in your hands along with your pistol.   It may be a single shot rifle, but it has FAR more powerful and heavier load than a .44-40 or .45 Long Colt with it's .40-70 load.   Reloading is a heck of a lot faster than a muzzle loader or ball and cap breech loading carbine. 
If I remember my history correct, the Buffalo Hunters at Adobe Walls came out on top holding the Comanche at bay using single shot Sharps rifles.

[Montanashooter]

i find it hard to believe that everyone had a winchester above there fire place as late as the 1870s  i figure there were still a number of muzzleloaders and single shot weaponary prob floating around homesteads and such.  I recall finding a civil war springfield bayonet in the walls of a old barn once when i was quite young....  Im personally a single shot fan myself as i find i like the rollers, sharps and springfields better though i dabble with all.  I fired half a dozen shots from my 50-90 Sharps awhile back and could here the load BOOOOM  then picked up my 92 44-40 look alike and it sounded like ping ping lol.   I would like to here some real actual numbers (or close as one can get) as to how many people actually possessed the cartridge fed repeaters of the day as no one made a lot of cash in the west and it was dang scarce by our standards cost of a winchester in 1873 sounds cheap but it wasnt to them.  I also dont believe every westerner got in a gun fight in the street, fired a shot at a indian even, though it prob wasnt totally uncommon either and it certainly makes movies more interesting.

[cpt dan blodgett]

Don't worry. I always try to seek good advice before trying something like this     Thanks for the healthy advice!  I'll take it.

.45-70 is a pretty tough load isn't it?  Didn't the buffalo hunters use it to take down Buffalo?

The scene in Lonesome Dove where the Kiowas, halfbreeds and Comancheros have Augustus MacCrae pinned down behind his horse with a long range buffalo gun comes to mind  

(on the side, I don't know what Larry McMurtry was on when he decided to make the "prequels" and "sequels" to this....not to mention Bareback Mountain....or maybe he had a dang good ghostwriter when he "wrote" this

Gus was actaully armed with a Henry in that scene.

[Doug.38PR]

I know Gus was using a Henry, but I mean the Comanchero that Gus shoots in the gut, that guy was using a .45-70 sharps buffalo gun right?

[Pitspitr]

  I thought Gus got shot in the leg with an arrow. I guess I'll have to watch it again sometime.

[Niederlander]

I know Gus was using a Henry, but I mean the Comanchero that Gus shoots in the gut, that guy was using a .45-70 sharps buffalo gun right?

He was using some sort of Sharps with a scope, but wasn't very good with it.  In reality, I should think a bullet from any caliber the Sharps was chambered in would probably go THROUGH the dead horse at least some of the time.  Ballistically, the Henry cartridge wasn't a whole lot better than the 1860 Army load, so it would be hard to believe it would carry that far and do any damage.  Still a great scene, though!

[Doug.38PR]

I thought Gus got shot in the leg with an arrow. I guess I'll have to watch it again sometime.

That was a later scene when they were in Montana being chased by different Indians (tribe unknown as they "didn't introduce themselves")

[Evelyn Canarvon]

http://www.bpcr.net/site_docs-results_schedules/documents/pedersoli_proof_rules_and_allowable_limits_09-04.htm

Read the Pedersoli proof remarks on the trapdoor

[Doug.38PR]

WOW!  I want one!   

How much do they go for?  I've seen them as high as 1600...that seems kinda high.  I've seen then as low as 1200.  I figured I can haggle for $1000 if I put cash on the counter. 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Doug, did you get your Trapdoor yet?

If so, have fun ... I'm sure you love it.

You were interested in a light load earlier and asked about 45 Colt.  As said already, DON'T try shooting one in your rifle.  I have fired primer-powered 45 Colt WAX bullets (inside-the-garage practice shooting ONLY) but that is the ONLY type I'd bother with. 

As you may know already, the Carbine load was a reduced load from the standard.  They eventually had a load using a 405 gr. bullet or a 300-350 gr. (I don't remember exactly) powered by 55 grs. of BP, but that's as low as they got.

(On a side note, the Military NEVER officially bought ANY Winchester repeating rifles after the few Henrys purchased during the [un]Civil War.  [POSSIBLY some for testing, but not issue.]  Despite what you'll find from the "John Ford Reference Library." {Hollyweird}  Any Winchesters used, and there WERE some, were privately purchased.  I THINK that the first actual repeating rifle purchased by the Army - not sure about the Navy, or when they got their Lees - was the Krag-Jorgenson.  Actual experts like Drydock, Pispitr, River City John can correct me here.)

Back to the topic at hand.  If you reload, there's nothing stopping you from buying some 200-250 gr. bullets (make sure they're sized from .457"-.460") and making a load using 40 grs. of BP WITH fillers or wads to make sure of NO airspace under the bullet and making your own Gallery load.  BP is very forgiving that way ... IF there is no airspace under the bullet!

I envy you - I've wanted one of those H&Rs or even the later Peder-Trapdoors for DECADES!  (I saw my first H&R about 1972, and longed for one since then!)  Unfortunately, my wife thought she needed a second dress or something frivolous like that, so no T-Door for me.





 

Have fun!

[Pitspitr]

Hey Jeff
If you can figure out a way to get to Central Nebraska July 29-31th I'll make sure you can play with one of mine. 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Hey Jeff
If you can figure out a way to get to Central Nebraska July 29-31th I'll make sure you can play with one of mine. 

Darn friendly of you, Sir!

If only ...

SOMEDAY I'll be able to drag Jed and maybe another pard or 2 and we'll join you at one of your musterds ... er, musters.  We've BOTH lamented numerous times at our inability to get there.

Thanks for the offer.  If I DO get to come, would you mind if I try out some of my Gallery and/or Guard loads from your rifle?  (BP, naturally)  I've about given up trying to get my Sharps Buff Rifle to shoot BP loads dependably.  It'll shoot them-there heathen-fad smokeyless jacketed loads jes fine, but not BP.


(Probably my biggest problem is NOT having somewhere past 75-100 yds. to shoot regularly and do a proper work-up.)

[Pitspitr]

Thanks for the offer.  If I DO get to come, would you mind if I try out some of my Gallery and/or Guard loads from your rifle?  (BP, naturally)  I've about given up trying to get my Sharps Buff Rifle to shoot BP loads dependably.  It'll shoot them-there heathen-fad smokeyless jacketed loads jes fine, but not BP.


(Probably my biggest problem is NOT having somewhere past 75-100 yds. to shoot regularly and do a proper work-up.)

Absolutely! and bring your buff rifle with you. There will absolutely be plenty of places you can shoot in excess of 100 yards. You just name your poison. 100, 200, 300, 400, 800, 1200 yds. I got them all.

[Steel Horse Bailey]