Extremely Rare Photo of Billy the Kid

Shotgun Steve · January 27, 2010, 11:41:08 AM

Extremely rare photo of Billy when captured at Stinking Springs, December 24th 1880.

Pat Garrett is clearly recognisable extreme left and Bob Olinger is next to him. Billy is on the extreme right where a deputy aims a Colt revolver at Billy's head.

One of Billy's compadres, Charlie Bowdre, had been killed in the encounter.

Although the this is suppose to be an authentic photo I have not been able to
verifiy it one way or the other.

Shotgun Steve

Skeeter Lewis · January 27, 2010, 11:57:46 AM

It would be great to get a digitally-enhanced blow-up of the Kid - if it is.

Ol Gabe · January 27, 2010, 05:00:48 PM

"Billy is on the extreme right where a deputy aims a Colt revolver at Billy's head...Although this is suppose to be an authentic photo I have not been able to verifiy it one way or the other. Shotgun Steve"

Actually S.S., I think it is possible, maybe, perhaps & perchance, that you might have stumbled upon an 'ancient', read photo-shopped, pic of our favorite NCOWS Texican, Pancho!
If you take a really, really close look at the feller on the extreme right, and since as you say there is no definitive data on the pic, it could possilbly, most likely, be Pancho! Right?
Best regards and good researching!
'Ol Gabe
P.S. Pancho, it really does look like you and I can't wait to meet you at the Convention!

Skeeter Lewis · January 27, 2010, 05:12:44 PM

I've heard doubt cast on this picture before, but the set of the jaw (insofar as one can tell from such an image) does resemble the famous photo of the Kid. Maybe.

Skeeter Lewis · January 27, 2010, 05:58:38 PM

If you scroll down, you'll see a blow-up of this picture of the 'Kid'.

http://www.angelfire.com/nm/boybanditking/pageStinkingSprings.html

Shotgun Franklin · January 27, 2010, 07:41:59 PM

Although the photo quality when enlarged is rough, a Forensic Photographer can tell for sure if it's not BTK. Very many of the 'claimed' photos posted here need to be checked by a Forensic Lab to at least get a strong probably. Without Provenance or a good Lab report all they are is a 'looks like' someone photo.

Shotgun Steve · January 28, 2010, 09:32:05 AM

"Very many of the 'claimed' photos posted here need to be checked by a Forensic Lab to at least get a strong probably. Without Provenance or a good Lab report all they are is a 'looks like' someone photo."

Franklin... there are "NOT" that many photos posted here that need that kind of Scrutiny! I don't post that many photos without
some kind of information to accompany the photo. Yes sometimes it is wrong but then again you people have keyboards in front of you the same as I do. If you don't think something is right then I suggest you folks GOOGLE!! I try to post accurate photos and info for folks to enjoy. I do not intentionally try to mislead anyone....what would be the point in that. So instead of claiming most photos here are in need of research I suggest YOU post some for a change!!

Shotgun Steve

Marshal Deadwood · January 28, 2010, 06:17:27 PM

At least SS is posting interesting photos, he's not whinning.

MD

Mad River Frank · January 28, 2010, 06:49:53 PM

I studied the Billy the Kid legend about 15 years ago, and came to the conclusion there's only one sure photo of the Kid and that's the tintype photo we all are familiar with. The Pat Garret image in the photo looks like him, but also looks like Bat Masterson. I can't tell much from the Bob Ollinger image. Ollinger did wear a sombrero like that worn by the man id'd in the photo as Ollinger.

I got caught up in the film "Young Guns II" theory that the Kid wasn't killed by Pat Garrett, and that someone else's body (or a bunch of rocks) occupy the casket intended for the Kid. I also subscribed to the notion that Brushy Bill Roberts was the Kid. But since former Gov. Richardson of New Mexico refused to exhume the remains of the casket supposedly Billy's, I've put that theory to rest.

As I understand it, Billy didn't have any full blood brothers or sisters--I believe he had a half-sister and half-brother. And after his mother passed away, he was raised by his mother's sister. Her remains are in New Mexico, but finding a solid DNA match between the Kid and his aunt are not that easy as they'd be dealing with mitochondrial DNA--much less suitable marker for a man than the "Y" chromosone passed on by his father. Well that's pretty windy for a post, and I suppose I was actually "hoorahing". The legend of the Kid is very interesting, as is the Kid himself--he was very well read and quite literate, for a 19th century outlaw.

Ottawa Creek Bill · January 28, 2010, 07:15:01 PM

Quote from: Shotgun Steve on January 28, 2010, 09:32:05 AM
"Very many of the 'claimed' photos posted here need to be checked by a Forensic Lab to at least get a strong probably. Without Provenance or a good Lab report all they are is a 'looks like' someone photo."

Franklin... there are "NOT" that many photos posted here that need that kind of Scrutiny! I don't post that many photos without
some kind of information to accompany the photo. Yes sometimes it is wrong but then again you people have keyboards in front of you the same as I do. If you don't think something is right then I suggest you folks GOOGLE!! I try to post accurate photos and info for folks to enjoy. I do not intentionally try to mislead anyone....what would be the point in that. So instead of claiming most photos here are in need of research I suggest YOU post some for a change!!

Shotgun Steve

Thats the way to go Steve...give em hell! If they don't like the research...have them do it themselves. Keep up the posts...one of the more interesting things on this board.

Bill

Tjackstephens · January 29, 2010, 06:26:03 PM

Shotgun Steve, I really enjoy the pictures that you post. For whatever it's worth they bring us a lot of pleasure. I look forward to looking at them. It's been a cold winter here in Kentucky, snowing to beat the band right now. Keep up the good work. Tj

Who cares if it's Billy or not, it's worth viewing, evening if he is on the worse horse. Tj

Rowdy Fulcher · January 29, 2010, 06:41:34 PM

Shotgun Steve
I love those old photo's , Keep up the Good work . How about some pictures of Vintage Hunters with 1876 rifles . Thanks again .

Charlie Bowdre · January 29, 2010, 08:44:36 PM

SS
I've said it before , I enjoy your photos and the accompanying 'history lesson'.
Appreciate your time and efforts.
Dutchy

Will Ketchum · January 29, 2010, 09:03:47 PM

Steve I agree. I know that you can only post what you find and in no way are responsible for the accuracy of what is there.

You have made that abundantly clear several times. Those who choose to ignore what you have made so clear only have themselves to blame. If they get too tiresome I'll remove their posts.

Semper Fi my friend.

Will Ketchum

Major 2 · January 30, 2010, 07:19:36 AM

Quote from: Ottawa Creek Bill on January 28, 2010, 07:15:01 PM
Thats the way to go Steve...give em hell! If they don't like the research...have them do it themselves. Keep up the posts...one of the more interesting things on this board.

Bill

DITTO !

Delmonico · January 30, 2010, 09:01:07 AM

What iis really interesting is I've also heard that the other picture of Billy the Kid, may not be him. At this point I doubt we'll ever know 100% for sure.

Funny thing is, few have seen the original of the other, only touched up versions.

Shotgun Franklin · January 30, 2010, 10:13:25 AM

No one has ever said that these aren't nice old pictures. No one was launched a personal attack. It's just that everything put forth as an historic item should be checked out. If those photos are actually what they appear to be then they have great historic and monetary value. I hope they are real, they would add greatly to our knowledge.

Delmonico · January 30, 2010, 01:35:53 PM

All Steve is doing is offering pictures with the information supplied with them. I figger anyone that wants can feel free do do more research on them, most of us would be happy to see it. Truth is I see very little of that.

Shotgun Franklin · January 30, 2010, 11:44:47 PM

Well, send me the photos and I can get several area museums to look at them. Of course they'll want some kind of compensation. My forensic training was toward getting latent prints off of forged instruments. So I'm not the guy for this job. BTW, Police Agencies are far to swamped to handle this kind of work. I'd suggest Sul Ross State University in Alpine, Texas.

ChuckBurrows · January 31, 2010, 01:07:04 AM

With all due respect Mr Franklin, but the photos posted above are well known and verified as being the real by McCoy by experts in the field - the only question is whether the people being represented are in fact those claimed to be.
Most of the old time photos that Steve, as well as others have presented are in the same league - most have in fact been verified as in fact being period photos by experts in the field or by provenance and other evidence. These are not photos that Steve or anyone else is pulling out of their hat and offering them here for the first time.
Perhaps a bit more research into the history of the west on your part might be called for before offering opinions...........