Issue with new USFA 12/22

Appalachian Ed · November 26, 2009, 09:41:17 AM

I hate to say it, because I do own several USFA Single Actions, but with USFA's current communications, customer service, quality control, and service speed....Colt has nothing to fear.

-Ed

RRio · November 26, 2009, 10:37:53 PM

All the posts that were added to this topic after Appalachian Ed's post, were spit to it's own tread as they had nothing to do with the original threat.

drjdog5150 · December 01, 2009, 09:22:04 PM

Well I took the 12/22 to Bob James and he looked it over and said they must have replaced the screws with different ones since they dont fit properly...guess I should email Gary and see what he says. I am completly dissatisfied with USFA and hope he will offer to make it right. I also got the chance to compare it to another 12/22 they had their and the screws were slightly recesed and straight and the grips fit perfect.

On a good note he said the action was extreamly nice!

Anybody wanna buy a never fired not 100% perfect 12/22 for say $950...$400 bucks offless then I paid !!!!

Recon · December 02, 2009, 09:22:27 PM

Quote from: drjdog5150 on December 01, 2009, 09:22:04 PM

Anybody wanna buy a never fired not 100% perfect 12/22 for say $950...$400 bucks offless then I paid !!!!

I'd be tempted if it were blue.

Anyway, sorry to hear about your problems but I am very glad you shared them with us (me). I experienced a nightmare with Colt (I'm James_Riley1 at http://www.coltforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20834 and http://www.coltforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23099) and was looking to USFA as my next purchase. But now I'm beginning to understand that all companies, including my own, have issues. If you want a good weapon then you best see it first, with a magnifier glass, finger f it, and shoot it before you buy it. In other words, buy used because no one will let you work their unturned revolvers. I'd rather have a good gun that's been around the horn than a lemon and months of back and forth with a manufacturer of a $1,300.00 piece.

I've got a 7th Cav. Uberti that has WAY better fit than my Colt. The action can be tuned and the finish can be forgiven for what I paid for it. And the finish ain't all that bad. Bubbles popped; live and learn expensive lessons.

The whole point of $1,300.00 is perfection. That seems to be lost on some of the defenders of Colt and USFA. If you want to produce Saturday Night Specials, then do it. That's fine, but lower the damn price so we can buy a ton of them, shoot the hell out of them, throw them away and buy another. Otherwise, them Eyetalians are fine with me.

drjdog5150 · December 03, 2009, 07:43:59 PM

The whole point of $1,300.00 is perfection
Couldn't agreemore! That was the point of this purchase, to have a pistol that would last 100 years...if I could go back in time I would have passed on it and bought three other guns!

Also, sorry to here about the Colt issues...the funny thing is with all this happing I was gonna get a Colt this weekend and give up on USFA. I think I will go back to my old ways and only purchase older guns from the 60-70's that are almost new in box! And probaly will pass on buying guns without touching them!

Jason

Marshal Deadwood · December 03, 2009, 09:01:24 PM

Have you discussed a refund or a re-make with USFA ?

I think I'd consider talking to them about that.

MD

Gaucho Gringo · December 09, 2009, 12:54:54 AM

I would not consider buying any USFA gun now that I have read this story and others. For the price they want, I could buy 3 or 4 other Colt clones new or almost new. The Colt clone i have cost me $350.00 new and works flawlessly and has never given me a bit of trouble in almost 4 years of use.

Charlie Bison · December 09, 2009, 06:54:51 PM

I will buy USFA on the other hand. Great product and I have had nothing but great customer service. Looks like I am the odd man out in this topic.

Doc Sunrise · December 09, 2009, 09:56:14 PM

I certainly would not hesitate to buy a USFA firearm as I have had excellent results with them. There are several pages in this forum of happy USFA owners and shooters. If I were a first timer I don't believe I would turn away at this point.

Capt. John Fitzgerald · December 09, 2009, 11:19:13 PM

Count me in too! I own several USFA guns and am more than happy with all of them. I've never had a problem with customer service either (not that I have ever needed much - customer service isn't much of an issue when your gun is perfect right out of the box).

Marshal Deadwood · December 10, 2009, 12:32:44 AM

I've never seen a bad one, and should have my very own around Christmas,,or shortly there-after. I looked long and hard, and still think they are the best SAA made.

MD

Major 2 · December 10, 2009, 04:26:19 AM

I've been reading this thread, with interest and wondering what the position at USFA is.
It's to bad drjdog5150 did not or feels he did get what he expected.

I hope he gets the satisfaction he wants and deserves for his cash outlay ($1300 + with all the shipping is a good size nut)

Now, about USFA ..I have one just one, It is or was a prototype for the Shot Show in 93 I understand.
It is marked USPFA and is of Italian ancestry...that is a CLONE of the Richards Conversion.
It is perhaps the nicest & slickest Fit & Finish & action of all my guns Colts included.

I say this USPFA now USFA has raised the bar, I credit them, in forcing COLT to make a better SAA (I have seen some pretty dismal 3rd Gen. Colts.) in that cost range.
I also credit them (USFA is a Clone themselves) in the Market place, to get Uberti & Pietta to raise the bar with some of their
new offerings ( Smoke Wagon, Evil Roy, and Great Westerns )
I think, USFA may have tried to move perhaps to fast , and maybe there is some trouble.

But overall, I'm sure glad to own my USPFA

Hope drjdog5150 gets his 12/22 how he wants and should expect it to be...

Doc Sunrise · December 10, 2009, 05:59:15 AM

I totally agree with you Major 2.

USFA in the 90's forward has done to the market place what Ruger did in the 50's. It sparked new interest and cemented the fact that there is still a place for Single Actions, and they are not going to die anytime soon. It also made those few companies in that specific market wake up and reexamine what they were doing. Product quality increased across the board, product variations increased, product availability increased, and associated product markets increased. The "Bar" was definitely raised.

Unfortunately, just as Ruger had to, USFA is trying to find areas to maintain growth. In the business world, you grow or die. Also, in today's business world, a company is forced to to do more with less, and that usually means employees feel the grunt of growing pains. I truly believe USFA is bogged down with the pain of new product trials and a workload that may have overwhelmed its employees. In time I am confident USFA will get things worked out so that every customer is happy.

J.D. Yellowhammer · December 10, 2009, 08:25:02 AM

Quote from: Charlie Bison on December 09, 2009, 06:54:51 PM
I will buy USFA on the other hand. Great product and I have had nothing but great customer service. Looks like I am the odd man out in this topic.

No, you're not odd man out. Even though I'm one of the few people having problems, I've always had great experiences with USFA's and with the company. The odd man out is those of us who've recently experienced issues with customer service. Like I said, I'd expect difficulties with some importers and manufacturers, but not with USFA. Which is what makes this whole thing so perplexing and frustrating. (I still haven't received my Rodeos, or answers to my emails)

I'd put my .45 USFA Premium SA up against any out-of-the-box gun out there, and likely beat it for fit, finish and shooting. And I'd buy another in a heartbeat.

drjdog5150 · December 12, 2009, 12:28:25 AM

Well I emailed Gary and told him i was not satisfed with the firearm and asked him what he can do to make this right, its been a week or so and still waiting for him to reply...I think eventually USFA will get this issue squared away, just might be a year the way its going, but I'm pretty patient. Thanks all for your replys and PM's, I will post with any changes and hope at the end I will be able to report a happy ending.

Jason

Recon · December 12, 2009, 10:03:25 AM

Quote from: drjdog5150 on December 12, 2009, 12:28:25 AM
Well I emailed Gary and told him i was not satisfed with the firearm and asked him what he can do to make this right, its been a week or so and still waiting for him to reply...I think eventually USFA will get this issue squared away, just might be a year the way its going, but I'm pretty patient. Thanks all for your replys and PM's, I will post with any changes and hope at the end I will be able to report a happy ending.

Jason

I wish you luck. I could have pursued my issue with Colt, sending it back for a third time or demanding my money back and, probably, eventually, receiving "satisfaction." But after nearly a year and all the BS, I decided to eat it and write it off. My reasoning was as follows: Not only is the spread between $1,300.00 and $450.00 designed to obtain perfection from the start, it's also designed to prevent all the time and frustration involved in obtaining the satisfaction that you paid for in the first place.

The way I see it is this: They not only owe me a $1,300.00 gun, they owe me $500.00 to boot. And, since I'll never get that, I'm just going to cut my losses and never buy another gun from Colt.

On a side note, I wonder how many people who are satisfied with their weapons just have stars in their eyes from all the beautiful case colors and the things that are right with the gun; not seeing the things that are wrong with it until after the "new" wears off? Sure, there are some guys who know what to look for and got what they should have got, but I'd like to look at the guns of everyone else and see if I can't point out a few problems that a more knowledgeable person would see. Ignorance can be bliss. It's not that I want to pop any one's bubbles, but I think a lot of the adulation out there is from people who are just so happy to have a pretty new gun they don't see the problems.

J.D. Yellowhammer · December 13, 2009, 03:50:44 AM

I agree with you completely, Recon. And I think this is particularly true with Colt and here's why: Colt trades on its name. It has an authentic rep, it was the original "Peacemaker." You buy a Colt and you're supposedly buying history. Add some nice case coloring and you usually have a starry eyed owner. Minor defects or blemishes get swept under the rug. And Colt can get away with it because (almost) no one is demanding more from them.

USFA, on the other hand, had to repair its image. It had all the Colt fans saying it was inferior, and it had Italian parts. So the company had to earn its rep based on a changeover to all-US parts, superior workmanship and looks. And it did.

My Rodeos are back at the plant because of a .003 or .004 issue with headspace. That's something that a starry-eyed consumer wouldn't notice or wouldn't care about. But it caused me problems, so I sent 'em back (with USFA's blessings). My Premium SA, on the other hand, has perfect headspace. And it shoots well. Perfect timing. Smooth action. Never had a bolt back out. And it looks good, too. And I've owned it for a while and subjected it to the abuse of CAS shooting.

If you buy a revolver for $1,300, you aren't paying for high tech design or high cost materials. There are plenty of guns out there that cost less but have more moving parts, more critical tolerances, and which are subjected to higher stress. So what justifies the extra cost of the $1,300 revolver? In my book, it should cost more because it is hand-fit by superior craftsmen who demand perfection. Anything less is a failure or rip off. That's why I personally get distressed reading about your Colt experience or drjdog's USFA.

For some, that kind of cost is justified merely because a gun has a reputation and/or historical value. (I'm not necessarily knocking that, either--that's the reason people buy antique arms). And to be honest, if I was flush and had "disposable income," whatever that is, I'd buy a Colt SA just because it's a Colt. But I'd still expect/hope/demand that the big cost be justified by a piece of superior workmanship. And that's how I see it at 3:45 a.m., after being awoken (awakened?) by the dogs.

Major 2 · December 13, 2009, 05:40:29 AM

"...USFA, on the other hand, had to repair its image. It had all the Colt fans saying it was inferior, and it had Italian parts. So the company had to earn its rep based on a changeover to all-US parts, superior workmanship and looks. And it did. "

interesting.... Colt fan's so quickly have forgotten the factoty deal w/ Uberti and the Second gen BP Colts.
Or the failed, German import COLT Cowboy.
or the many years run of dismal 3 Gen, SAA.

I'm a Colt fan, and own several but no 3 Gen.s thanks until they repair THEIR image...

JD my comment is in no way directed to inflame your words , simply borrowing your quote .

Charlie Bison · December 13, 2009, 10:12:08 AM

I have to put in my two cents. I have both USFA's and Colt's. Love them both. I just received a pair of new Colt SAA's and they are a work of art in function, fit and finish. And I know what to look for, so I am not fooled by the pretty colors. Every bit is good ad my USFA's, or any 1st, or 2nd Gen I have ever seen.

I hate to hear these horror stories with Colt. I bought a supposedly "new" Nickel Colt SAA from an online dealer three months back. Received it and it was rusted and the hammer would not cock because of the rust. I informed Colt and they said they would fix it for free. Three days later I had a shipping label and they re-nickeled the Colt and its fit and function and finish are flawless.

If you ever have a problem with a Colt, I will give a wonderful contact. I have also found that if you want to get something done with both companies, get them on the phone. Never rely on email , or leaving a message. Get them on the phone tell them what you want done and badda bing badda boom. At least that has been my experience. Merry Christmas

J.D. Yellowhammer · December 13, 2009, 12:11:00 PM

Quote from: Major 2 on December 13, 2009, 05:40:29 AM
JD my comment is in no way directed to inflame your words , simply borrowing your quote .

Thanks, it's understood.

My wife knows there's a standing gift opportunity: should she ever hit the lotto or come into a bag of cash, I'm ready to receive my first Colt (or two). She even knows the caliber: .44WCF.