BP shot shell loading & gas checks

[Irish Ike]

I just visited the Ballistic Products site and they had 1/4" thick plastic gas checks for shotgun shells. Has anyone tried these in plastic hulls or brass in lieu of a fiber wad?
Ike

[hellgate]

I am a big believer in plastic cup shaped gas seals for both smokeless and BP. My reasoning for using them with BP in lieu of cards is the plastic will spring back and flare out to better seal the combustion chamber to prevent blowby of the hot gases. When you use a card over powder wad the card gets compressed to a smaller diameter as it is seated in the tapered molded plastic cases (Remington and AA) resulting in a smaller diameter card that can't expand outward when the round is fired. You will get leakage. I remember way back when I first started reloading, the manuals would give the smokeless loading data and then state: you must reduce the powder charge by 10% if you use a plastic one piece wad. The card and filler wads were designed to be used in straight walled paper hulls in chambers with short forcing cones. Newer guns have longer more tapered forcing cones for the thinner mouthed plastic hulls so there is ample room for blowby with card & fiber wads. The PGS (Plastic Gas Seal) type wads keep all the power under the load as the lips of the cupped wad flare out to fit the changing contour of the case, chamber and barrel. The hard card & fiber wads can't do that so well. You might not even notice the difference but I occasionally hear some real funky loads from BP shooters using card wads over the powder. I will use a double ended brush wad and cut it across the middle in order to get two PGS wads out of it. I frequently load the PGS wad under fiber wads for the better seal. If you have straight walled cases and an old shotgun the card & filler wads do fine since they were designed for that wad column but you'd best use a thick walled hull. Some of the thin walled "off brand" and Federal hulls have very thin walls and the wads fit  pretty loosely. A PGS wad will prevent blowby. One piece plastic wads usually have a deep enough cup for good sealing in any case.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Hellgate, using PLASTIC wads with real Holy Black?    You've left me no other choice Hellgate but to enforce the following:

[Mako]

Hellgate, using PLASTIC wads with real Holy Black?    You've left me no other choice Hellgate but to enforce the following:

I use plastic wads as well, and..."you'll have to pry my MANCARD out of my cold dead fingers." I addition you'll have to peel at least two red wads off of the wounds on the individuals who showed up to revoke my card. 

Actually Hellgate should be held in awe, there are several well known individuals who frequent this part of the forum who are either afraid to use plastic wads, or claim they are too much work to clean up after.  Both claims don't sound very "manly" to me.  Hellgate has chosen the manly course and laughs at plastic fouling in his tubes.  In fact he "laughs the plastic fouling to scorn" and it is so intimidted it shrivels up and falls free of his barrels without him ever having to run a brush or patch down the bore.  Now that's manly...now if only he could bottle that for those who seem to fear plastic.

The fear of plastic sounds rather sissy to me.

~Mako

[Fox Creek Kid]

It was an inside joke, Mako. 

[Mako]

It was an inside joke, Mako. 

As was mine... (though a bit outside and to the right)
~Mako

[hellgate]

I will redeem myself by passing on the revocation notice to selected deserved recipients. After which I shall come crawling back to this site of honor & awe.

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Do they have 11 ga. plastic wads for those of us who load/shoot 12ga.  MagTech shells? 

[Fox Creek Kid]

Do they have 11 ga. plastic wads for those of us who load/shoot 12ga.  MagTech shells? 

Just run the 12 ga. wads through the clothes dryer for about 20 mins. That ought to shrink 'em enough!! 

Just kiddin', Bailey!!    No one makes 11 ga. plastic wads to my knowledge.

[Abilene]

I've not used the plastic gas check wads (didn't know they existed) but I do use a nitro (hard cardboard) over-powder wad over the the powder and under the red plastic Winchester wad in my brass shells.  I have a variety of brass hulls but mostly use Alcans which are a little thicker than the Magtech/Winchester/Rem-UMC hulls, but not as thick as the Rocky Mountain Cartridge hulls.  A Circle-Fly 11 Ga. nitro card is a perfect fit in the Alcan hulls.  Since the cushion base of the red plastic wads are a tad loose in those brass hulls, I think the nitro card gives a better seal. 

[Wills Point Pete]

 I, too use the Mag Techs. I mostly shoot a one eighth inch nitro card wad under the Claybuster copy of the Winchester Red Wad. This makes for nice tight patterns as long as I don't go crazy with the powder scoop. The guys that worry about the fouling from BP and plastic have never bought a bottle of Windex with vinegar.
Spray the Windex down the barrels until it runs out the muzzles. Clean one revolver. Now push a half a paper towel down each barrel. The shotgun barrels are pretty well clean. Since Windex is cheap, resray the inside of the shotgun barrels and clean the other revolver. Repeat the half paper towel down each barrel.

Now, clean the rest of the shotgun, oil it and the barrels and put it back together. Clean the rifle. Now, wait five hours and tell all the fast smokeless shooters how hard you had to work so they'll stay on the smokeless side leaving us with a good chance for a plaque or certificate at the next match.

[Mako]

I, too use the Mag Techs. I mostly shoot a one eighth inch nitro card wad under the Claybuster copy of the Winchester Red Wad. This makes for nice tight patterns as long as I don't go crazy with the powder scoop. The guys that worry about the fouling from BP and plastic have never bought a bottle of Windex with vinegar.
Spray the Windex down the barrels until it runs out the muzzles. Clean one revolver. Now push a half a paper towel down each barrel. The shotgun barrels are pretty well clean. Since Windex is cheap, resray the inside of the shotgun barrels and clean the other revolver. Repeat the half paper towel down each barrel.

Now, clean the rest of the shotgun, oil it and the barrels and put it back together. Clean the rifle. Now, wait five hours and tell all the fast smokeless shooters how hard you had to work so they'll stay on the smokeless side leaving us with a good chance for a plaque or certificate at the next match.

Pete,
You are obviously delusional or confused...everyone knows that the plastic melts at such a high temperature it creates a molecular bond between the barrel walls and the residue.  To date there are still no sure fire ways of removing it, you can only mitigate it.  Once you have polymer gripitis it's pretty much something you have live with until they bury you with your guns.
 
Some have even tried removal with sulfuric acid preferring the perforation of the barrels to the shame of having polypropylene adulterated bores, but that showed only limited promise, the  plastic spackling only acted as a mask and allowed the steel to be eaten away leaving the dreaded plastic.

It's hopeless and the sooner we accept it the happier vegetable fiber wad companies will be.

Regards,
Mako

[Fox Creek Kid]

Pete,You are obviously delusional or confused

That's a little heavy handed, don't you think, Mr. Mako?    If I were Pete I'd be asking for an apology AND a retraction.

[Abilene]

But if he had put in the little winking smiley face, the smokeless guys might have caught on 

[Dick Dastardly]

I loaned my SxS 12ga to a pard in need.  He fired bp rounds with plastic wads in 'em.  Took Two weeks to get the barrels clean.  Never have, never do and never will use heathen plastic in bp shells again.  If it cleans up so darn easy with windex, mule pi$$, Ed's Red, or a whole list of other concoctions, why did it stick so bad in my barrels?  I now clean up with a spritz of Moosemilk and a tug of the boresnake.  My wads are nitro over powder followed by lubed fiber wad, shot and over shot card.  Cleanup should be so easy with heathen fad ammo. . .

DD-DLoS

[Mako]

I loaned my SxS 12ga to a pard in need.  He fired bp rounds with plastic wads in 'em.  Took Two weeks to get the barrels clean.  Never have, never do and never will use heathen plastic in bp shells again.  If it cleans up so darn easy with windex, mule pi$$, Ed's Red, or a whole list of other concoctions, why did it stick so bad in my barrels?  I now clean up with a spritz of Moosemilk and a tug of the boresnake.  My wads are nitro over powder followed by lubed fiber wad, shot and over shot card.  Cleanup should be so easy with heathen fad ammo. . .

DD-DLoS

Fox Creek Kid,
Now you get to see me use my "little winking smiley face" Abilene alluded to... 

Like I said on a nitrogen rich atmosphere  planet with a gravity field under 1.5 Gs it is almost impossible to clean a barrel adulterated with the heathen plastic short of grinding it down, separating the steel from the plastic via a magnet, re-melting the steel , rolling round stock, fully fabricating the barrels attaching them to the base block and  then brazing the whole mess back together  with the center ribs.

Now on the planet I'm from...We just spritz them with moosemilk and push half a paper towel through each barrel and then carefully gather the plastic "snake skin" for proper recycling.  Now if hellgate would only bottle some of his "plastic scorning laughter" I could shoot with y'all without being worried about curling up into a quivering ball of shame.

Time for my  "little winking smiley face" again in order not to confuse anyone.
Regards,
( Oops, I mean Mako)