MAKING A COLT CAP AND BALL REVOLVER WORK

[Hedley Lamarr]

As seen in the September 2008 Cowboy Chronicle, reproduced here with bigger photos!

http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=5744

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[Fingers McGee]

Thanks for the posting Hedley

Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee

[Alabama]

Ditto , thanks 
Interesting reading , but that's where that's going to stay , on paper for me . Not doin that to my revolvers , no way .
Those pictures are a sure fire reason to not let children play with power tools  And or your already great working Colts .
Looks like there might be 20% of the hammer left that hits the cap ? That can't be good . I think in time the only fragments are going to be your hammer , whats left of it . 
The pin looks like it would work in theory though , although my mousetraps are already good mousetraps . Hard to re-invent the wheel . I wish I had a beater gun to try it though .
Am sure someone will , please post your current results with your very clean machining too , unlike the pictures we have of this idea .

Thanks again , Alabama

[Angel_Eyes]

Have to agree with Alabama, i ain't doing that to my Walker, no way!! But other than that, it is a very practical solution, although crudely portrayed in the article, if you want to try it.

[Cuts Crooked]

Interesting concept!

I note that the author did indicate that the work was similar to what a cowboy might be able to accomplish with hand tools, under a shade tree, (or something to that affect). So... I forgive the crudeness of the work based on that premis, and realize that under shop conditions a much more professional appearence could be achieved.

Thanx Hedley for providing the link! I appreciate the professional courtesy a lot...yer a good pard!

[Noz]

I agree that that is an interesting concept, but I don't thik I'll do it either. I have my Piettas running well right now and don't want to mess with a good thing.
Treso nipples and adjusted the powder charge down until I had no more "blow offs". Right now running about 25 grs of GOEX.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Looks like there might be 20% of the hammer left that hits the cap ? That can't be good .

Ditto.

[Fingers McGee]

I agree that that is an interesting concept, but I don't thik I'll do it either. I have my Piettas running well right now and don't want to mess with a good thing.
Treso nipples and adjusted the powder charge down until I had no more "blow offs". Right now running about 25 grs of GOEX.

I'm about the same way with all of my Navies.  Tresos on all of them running a 20 gr charge

Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee

[Pettifogger]

Tried it using a milling machine and very precise cuts and hole drilling.  Did it on a C series 2nd Gen Colt.  On its mate i simply welded up the safety pin slot altogether and milled the hammer nose flat.  Mixed results.  After 60 rounds the pin was bent back.  Replaced the pin (which was drill rod like suggested in the article) with piano wire.  After 100 rounds the piano wire pin was bent, but only a tiny bit compared with the drill rod pin.  Also fired 100 rounds out of the gun with the welded up safety notch.  Both guns ran pretty good.  I did find a cap fragment BEHIND the pin in the hammer nose.  Fragments will still fly around to unusual places and do unusual things no matter what you do to a cap and ball, it's the nature of the beast.  I'm going to shoot both guns in a few more matches to see how they do.

[Roosterman]

This is something I'd not do to any of my guns. I just don't have cap fragment problems. I shot C&B pistols in SASS matches all summer long, 3 weekends out of every month, and never had a malfunction, from cap fragments or anything else. They performed as well as any cartridge gun. TRESO nipples and reasonable powder charges do the trick. 19gr in .36's and 24gr in 44's Real BP of course. I have found smashed cap fragments between the frame and hammer, but they have never caused a malfunction. I run my mainsprings at full strength, never lightened them, so cap frags don't bother the hammers.
When I get to the unloading bench, usually there are only 2 - 4 spent caps on the nipples. Where the rest go I don't know, but I suspect they fall off when the cylinder rotates to the right, jumping off at the cut out.

[Gun Butcher]

Been shooting C&B for 20 years and like Roosterman I always figured a little malfunction was normal. The Treso nipples and a reasonable charge of powder is the way to go to minimize your trouble.  Although, I have been known to add just a touch for the enjoyment factor
                                  GB

[Flint]

Another point is that this works with a cylinder that has no safety index pins, my Ubertis, to have the cap stopping pin in place clear of the safety pins, would locate that pin so far back it would more likely trap the cap and jam the cylinder than not.

[Alabama]

Good point Flint  Hmmm ?

I also wonder if anyone back then actually would even think of this mod , let alone be able to do it unless they happened to own some real equiptment , Colt employee or Remington employee
Is a standard Cow-Pokey going to sit under a tree with his mechanical Brace ( Drill ) and drill into his new fangled revolver of the times ? Highly unlikely I would say . Plus caps back then were thinner and probably were less annoying than ours , but that's just me speculating . Also without actuall factory milling equiptment at his or her disposal how would he go about making the cut-out anyway Swiss file I suppose ? I doubt many if any carried those handy or even knew what they were unless they happened to be watchmakers too .
Just got me thinkin is all , thought I would share that out loud 

Alabama

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Back then, the caps were considerably thinner - some were almost like foil.  The Colts had few cap-into-the-works problems, but with the thin caps back then the Remingtons were prone to it.

Now, our caps are made of much stouter, thicker copper.  Colts have the bad reputation for cap-jams and the Remingtons less so.

Funny how that worked out, eh?