Brewing Up Some Brown

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Since I'll be making some new holsters, I figured this was as good a time as any to make some brown dye using Chuck's recipe for walnut hulls. What I have is English walnut hulls so the brown will probably be a little lighter than with the black walnut hulls. I've had them soaking in the sunlight for a couple days now and this morning and again this evening I brought the stuff to a boil and let it cool. It really looks medievil and smells like a forest floor. I'll post any developments on this thread as it comes along. Here's a pic of the brew. The cooking spoon won't ever be the same. It ought to make some good chili afterwards, though.

[Dalton Masterson]

Oh that gives me the shivers. 

I am working on a vinegaroon  holster right now, but I want to try the brown on one of my next sets. The black turned out really well, seeing as I didnt boil it or anything. Truth be known, I actually forgot about it on the back of my bench for about 2 months. It is black from the getgo, without adding EVOO. Cant wait until I oil it. Probably turn pink or something. 

Hey will Teflon pans effect the walnut dye cooking process?? Or do I need to find an old pot somewhere?
DM

[santee]

Interesting. I can't wait to try it! Thanks for the pic, Marshal.

[HorsePen Henry]

I brewed up a batch with american walnuts and used a cast iron kettle. Ya know the one that grandpa used to scald hogs in ? One a the gals that does natural herbal dyeing told me that the iron is the mordant for walnut dye. It will also make yer walnut dye darker and richer if that's the shade ya want. I used mine on brain tanned buckskin and it was real dark brown.

Ya have quite a brew a goin' there, Marshall!!

X Horse Pen

[Ace Lungger]

MW,
Can't wait to see how it turns out!!  I did like the color that Chuck got on his holster he done on his DVD! I can't wait to see how your's turn out!! It will be 4-5 months before I brew any up for me, I am going to wait till they hit the ground here and then I will have all I want, and be able to send you fellow all you need I think!! On my new set i am going to use TW special blend of home brew dye, I use it on a small piece the other day and rely love it color, and I might not ever change! i know that I will never used any other black than vingroon, i keep 2 gallons mixed up all the time, that is over kill for me, but when it cost $3.75 a gallon you are not out much money!!

Can't wait to see a finished product  I be looking 
ACE

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Hey will Teflon pans effect the walnut dye cooking process?? Or do I need to find an old pot somewhere?

This one came out of our motorhome. I hope it'll clean up before my wife sees it. 

So far the stuff isn't too effective. I expect the English walnut hulls aren't nearly as dark as would come from black walnuts. This is an experiment so I'll see where it goes. I will try it next in a cast iron pan like X-Pen mentioned. Of course, I can just dump an amount of the vinegaroon in it but we'll see. I think I'll boil a ball of steel wool into it. Double, double, toil and trouble... This is new territory, pards. I feel like a pioneer venturing forth in search of the Seven Cities of Cibola.

[santee]

So, currently it's too light? Does that come off as a grayish color rather than brown?

[Marshal Will Wingam]

It's brown, but really light. I'm cooking it up right now with a pad of steel wool in it, cleaned off like Chuck described for making vinegaroon.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

I brewed up a batch with american walnuts and used a cast iron kettle. Ya know the one that grandpa used to scald hogs in ? One a the gals that does natural herbal dyeing told me that the iron is the mordant for walnut dye. It will also make yer walnut dye darker and richer if that's the shade ya want. I used mine on brain tanned buckskin and it was real dark brown.

Ya have quite a brew a goin' there, Marshall!!

X Horse Pen

Howdy Gents

         Horse Pens friend is right about the iron , when i made mine a while back, i followed Chuck Burrows recipe, and i added a 1"x"x 6" piece of iron that i had laying around, i cooked for several hours the first day and then let it cool over night, i did the same thing the second day, untill it was thicking up, then i let it cool, then i poured it into a large plastic container, and i added a 1/2 cup of
alcohol for every qt. of liquid i had. then i put my finished holster and gun belt into the dye and left it there for 4 days, then i took it out , let it drip dry for a little bit , then i stuck my gun in the holster and did my shaping, after that i  let the leather dry, i did the same thing with my gun belt, while it's wet you want to straighten it out  , so it will dry the way you want it, then after dry dip it in a solution of 1/2 to 3/4 cup of baking soda to i qt. of water, after the leather throughly dry , dunk the leather in the BS/Water and swish it around a little, then take it out and it will darken further as it dries. after dry, i conditioned the leather with Lexoil, and let it dry for 2 hrs. then 3 light coats of EVOO and the sun in between coats, and a final 2 coats of Skidmores Leather Cream. And your thinking is right about the English walnuts Marshal Will, they come out lighter than the Black walnuts, at least they did for me.

        Browning Leather
 
      I stumbled on to something the other day while experimenting with my natural dyes, I had made a batch of Vinegaroon, and I had died a piece of scrap, and it came out the neatest and darkest black, and after drying i was in the process of treating the scrap in some 3/4 cup baking soda to 1 qt. water, when i put the leather in the BS/Water i went a little further than where the leather was died black , and i noticed that the undied leather was turning a real nice brown color, i thought this color would go away after drying , but it didn't it stayed this really nice brown color , so i conditioned the leather with Lexoil and EVOO , and the small section of brown looked even better. SO ?? i desided to experiment with some more pieces of scrap leather ( veg-tan only ) I made up another batch of BS/Water, and put the piece of leather in and swished it around, took it out , and nothing happened like it did before, SO ?? i thought about for a nano sec, the piece of dried vinegaroon black leather it worked on before worked like a champ, so i thought it may have been vinegaroon residue that might have caused all of this browning to happen, so I put a tablespoon in the BS/Water, and WhamO that was it, so  on my next rig i'm going to do this , the color is of an old saddle brown , not tan but brown, you can experiment with this as to how dark you want it by just adding more Vinegaroon dye , but just add very little at a time until you think you have what you want , one of the nice things about doing this is the leather gets colored through and through, and it's a natural and antiqued BROWN color. I let these pieces dry , and then i brushed all the dried Baking Soda off the leather, and then conditioned, Lexoil, EVOO'ed and Skidmored, and it came out beautiful. When i finish my next rig, i'll post a picture.


                                                 tEN wOLVES 

[ChuckBurrows]

For dying leather I find you need to keep cooking it - adding iron is the mordant for cloth, but on leather it doesn't seem to matter and turns it a grey brown. I cook covered for several hours, turn it off and let set overnight. Next day re-boil, cooll for several hours then pour off the liquid. Cook that liquid down to a medium thick syrup. Add an 1/8 cup of alcohol to keep from molding. The best is the fresh, green black walnuts.

For a more true brown, like TW I've been experimenting with baking soda and water - it's tough to get it just right - time in the bath (no more than a minute or so maximum) is everything - I've gotten a light tan to a dark, dark brown. It does dry the leather though so it will need to be well oiled.

I was looking through my 1875 harness making book last night and they also note that annato (a natural food coloring) makes a good tan to brown - I'll write up the recipe later....

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Thanks for the input, pards. It helps to know what to expect. Earlier tonight I pulled the steel wool out of the brew. When I tested it, the color is good but still a little light. Tomorrow I'll boil it again and let it cool. It'll be interesting to see what it does then. It's sure a nice brown, though. I oiled a test piece after it dried and it's almost the color I want. We'll see what tomorrow brings. Oh, Chuck, do you filter off the liquid at all or does that matter? I could run it through a funnel with a piece of sheet in it.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy Marshal Will

       What I did to keep the liquid clean, was to put the walnut hules in a ladys stocking and tieing it off , PUT IT IN THE POT  and away you go, this way when your done , you can just hang it up and let it dry out, then you can use it a couple more times , I learned this from Chuck also, I don't know why you couldn't filter it off useing the ladys stocking, by just fixing it over what ever you're going to pour it in, then pour it through the stocking, should take care of it in short order, the stocking really works great at keeping things clean.


                                                                 tEN wOLVES 

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Thanks for the tip, 10W. I'll look into that.

[crossdraw]

Marshal
Can't wait to see your mixture on leather. I have some old dry hulls that I was thinking about pounding into a powder and boiling in water just to see what that would produce.

I could pour the powder into the coffee pot filter and cycle some water through......But that will probably reduce my life expectancy considerably if the wife catches me.   

[ChuckBurrows]

If I don't use the stocking as TW noted then yes I filter it through a fine sieve - this leaves some "fines" so you have to shake well before using, but those fines add a bit something to the "look"...

Crossdraw your old hulls should work fine - for those that live in black wlanut country (I have a good friend who lives in Georgia and sends a batch every year  ) - get them while that mushy green outer hull is still on when possible - it has more of the dye stuff in it. If you have plenty you can let them air dry and then store in an something like a stocking - I don't even peel them just cook them and then when cool i rub off all the gunk. Clean and then take off the hard hull and let dry for future use.

[Marshal Will Wingam]

I'm still not gettting the color I want. The steel wool did darken it some, but it also greyed the color a bit like Chuck said. The color is exactly what I want when it's wet but after it dries, it's a no-go. I have a sample piece that I've put a coat of Fiebings russet on. If it works the way I expect, I may have the color I want. Next time I'll do it with black walnut hulls and that'll do much better, I'm sure.

I just finished making two of the stamps I need to do one of my new holsters. One more and that one can get tooled. The other one will use a stamp I made before so I don't need any new stuff for it. I did make a new stamp for it, but it sucked so I'll so something slightly different that will give the holster a similar look but different than the one I'm copying for the idea. Oh, yeah, there's another tool I need to make to cut a single bead along the center of the pattern then I'll be ready to roll with these puppies.

[Marshal Will Wingam]

OK, I dunked some scraps and lwt them dry. then I started experimenting with what to do next. The best results came from a coat of Fiebings russet over the walnut hull brew. That's probably what I'll use. I guess I need to strain this stuff off, soon. Need to get going on the holsters, too.

OK, I strained it off and stuck it in the fridge. That should keep for at least until I get the holsters made.

Well, next I'll try black walnut hulls to see if I can do better. Better defined as not needing to cheat with a coat of Fiebings. 

[Ace Lungger]

Howdy Pards,
Do the walnut hulls need to be black and dry before you use them? I am just trying to figure out what to expect this fall, if the old back don't give out completely, i should be able come fall to supply a lot of those hulls.

I would be great full for the answer to wheter you use them green or dry?
Thanks
ACE

[HorsePen Henry]

Green is best, Ace. It's the tannic acid in the walnuts that turns the leather brown and not that the hulls themselves are brown. Pick them up green for the best dye. It's kinda like a brown cow eats green grass and gives white milk with yellow butter. It don't make a lot a sense but it works out that way.

Cheers,

X Horse Pen

[Ace Lungger]

Thanks HP,
that means i won't have to wait as long, I been useing TW homemade brown and I like it, but i also looking for something that doesnlt get such a deep rich brown to do some mateing up a belt with a holster.
Thanks
ACE