Money Belt ?

[Buck Stinson]

Slim,
Actually the design was almost fool proof.  Unless the wearer was standing on his head with the long flap open, it would be very difficult to loose any dust.  The small individual pouches also served a practical purpose.  It contained dust in small areas rather than having it shift like sand, from one end of an open tube to the other.

Adios,
Buck

[dbrown3]

I would like to make a cartridge belt out of a similar material as this.(not a shotgun belt)
Can anyone give me an idea what type leather it is and what weight it might be.

[Boot]

It looks like suede or roughout leather, but doesn't resemble anything from the Old West.
It looks similar to the John Wayne/True Grit belt discussed else where.

Boot.

[Buck Stinson]

Boot is right.  The leather used for the belt body is roughout/suede material.  I would think any Leather Factory outlet would have what you need.  In my opinion, 4 to 5 oz. leather would work best but remember, roughout will not support a lot of holster and pistol weight unless it's fairly heavy. 

Adios,
Buck

[Doc Arroyo]

Buck: Well that was a hell of an impractical design. Why not just have a solid tube belt with one end open, and then you coud pour out what you wanted? With all those mini pockets and flaps to hold it in I bet a lot of dust was lost.

Nope, not impractical at all.  The pockets in the belt allowed the wearer to spread the load, and to remove a bit of money or coin without having to remove alyers of clothing, or the belt.  Just reach inside the vest, into a pocket on the belt, and pull out a small poke of dust.  Made it alot easier to hide just how much money a person was carrying.

[Springfield Slim]

Doc: Doesn't sound like that would work so well with the gold dust,which is what it was designed for. From the sound of it the flap that kept the dust in was one long flap, thus disallowing you to remove anything from one pouch at a time. I still think that if I had a bunch of gold dust I would want it sealed up pretty tight. Hate to fall off my horse and knock the flap loose and have all my riches end up in the dust. Kinda hard to recover. Stuff happens.

[Buck Stinson]

As I stated in an earlier reply, the long flap over the individual pockets was worn against the body.  when tightened, the flap was snug against the body and could not be opened unless the belt was removed.  The type of belt we are discussing was not worn on a regular everyday basis.  It certainly was not what a miner would wear while working at the diggings or during a night out on the town.  They were more generally used to transport larger amounts of dust or nuggets for deposit in the bank or at the general store.  Often times, when these camps were small, the safe at the general store was the camp bank.   In the case of everyday use, the "gold poke" was the common way of carrying small cash amounts.  The word "poke" came from the prospector wetting his finger and "poking" it into a small leather pouch which contained some gold dust.  What ever came up on the wet finger tip would buy anything from a cigar to a drink at the bar.

Adios,
Buck

[Springfield Slim]

OK, so I am taking my new panned riches down to the local bank/safe. I take off my belt and when I start to hand it to the banker/clerk/storekeeper, I trip and fall and all my gold goes down between the floorboards. Come on, didn't you ever see "Paint your Wagon"!?

[Buck Stinson]

I've seen "Paint Your Wagon" many times and loved it.  It's pure Hollywood but very enjoyable.  I think if I worked as hard as the real '49rs did for their dust, I would be far more careful about how I kept track of it.

Adios,
Buck

[St. George]

If you think about it - human skin oils/grease/sweat would act as a 'glue' in holding that flap down - effectively acting as a seal.

The originals I've seen weren't pristine, and the darkened evidence of heavy sweat stains was still there, as it should be.

The miner wouldn't be taking it off before he got up to the counter, anyway, and when he did - he'd've been careful.

You can 'what if' all you want - but ascribing the actions of today to those of the era can lead to misconceptions.

The old original belts seen in collections and displays were what was used - made exactly as described - and they worked well enough so that they survived the times.

If there'd've been a better way - they'd've used it at that time - but there wasn't, so they didn't.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Buck Stinson]

Well put, St. George.

Adios,
Buck

[Springfield Slim]

Just 'cause something was used for a while doesn't mean it was the best way to do it. They rode lots of horses back then too but you don't see them around much anymore. Or C&B pistols as main match guns. Or wool clothes. Or people who didn't bathe more than once a month. They did a lot of theings back then that sucked. And there is always more thatn one way to do things. 

[Boot]

If that is the case, then we might as well say that all things in modern use are great and work perfectly and everything from the past was impracticall and had major design faults.
I don't believe this to be the case, most everything from the later half of the 19th century was extreamly practicall for the hard use it was given.
If we were to be transported back in time I can think of very few items to take along that would we be much use at all.
Our lifestyles have changed and we no longer rely on horses for transportation and in our world of cars and computers it may become unclear to see the advantages of some very simple practical pieces of equipment, but if we have any interest in history at all it should not become impossible.

Boot.

[Buck Stinson]

I'm not sure, but I think we're still talking about the California Gold Rush period and a method used to carry gold dust.  I don't see that much of anything from that era can be translated into how we do things today.  I for one, don't know anyone who carries gold dust.  I have spent 45 years collecting and studying artifacts and accounts of how westerners lived and worked on the frontier.  I have to say that everything those folks did to survive and every item they used, had a practical value.  It was not just someones whim.  This was especially true of the items they made themselves.  If it didn't work and work well for it's intended purpose, it was redesigned until it did work or the idea was scraped.  I personally don't see what the big deal is.  All I did was mention a practical way that gold dust was carried during that period.  I didn't say this was the only way the '49er carried his dust but from the number of surviving examples, it was certainly one of the most common.  These belts had a practical, common sense way of working and they did.    If they hadn't worked well,  I doubt we would see examples from every "gold rush" area in the West and without much design change, I might add.  Necessity has always been the mother of invention.

Adios,
Buck

[St. George]

When viewing history - 'woulda if they coulda' is merely wishful thinking and viewed with hindsight.

They couldn't - so they didn't - and that fact was what led to advancements all across the board - in weaponry, transportation, manufacturing, business - and so on and so forth.

Life is a continual 'product improvement' process, and what our forebears were doing was making it easier as they went along, both for themselves and for those who would follow.

That early work is what makes today easier.

Going back to that money belt - it's design served well into the 20th Century - seeing service in the Klondike, along with the wool clothing and all.

Must've worked...


Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Dalton Masterson]

Hey I shoot C&B as main match pistols!! This has been an interesting, if not somewhat argumentative, topic.
I cant see there only being one way of doing things like making a belt. Look at the holsters. There are slim jims, cheyenne, west texas, 2 loop, 3 loop, 1 loop. Jeeez, its what people do. They make things the way they want or need to and use whatever it is they have at hand.
Nice belts all of you. DM

[Springfield Slim]

I'm not saying they didn't work, but then as now, I'm sure people bought what was available and got along with it. I tend to examine things a bit more than some, I guess. For example, look at all the people who buy RCBS and Lyman bullet sizers, when the Star is so much better(but more expensive). Sometimes ya just don't know no better. Or just put up with it 'cause ya already bought it and can't afford or can't be bothered to get something better. He who doesn't study history is doomed to repeat mistakes of the past. If I personally had to make a belt to transport gold dust I wouldn't want it having the whole top with a potential to open up, period. Seal that baby up and be sure of it. Back when I used to ride a motorcycle everywhere I would always put my wallet in a zippered pocket in my jacket, even though I had never lost a wallet out of my back pocket. Just to make sure.

[Hank Rugerman]

I really can appreciate folks take on what is or isn't the REAL TRUTH or why...it's always food for thought..

Put yourself in the shoes of the first guys who decided what he wanted...small pockets or one big pocket...
I bet just like here there were a few idea's out there..

And now comes my question, and I realize this is almost ludicrous in regards to the posts reagarding "Gold Dust" storage...but.

As I really don't have any Gold Dust to tote around, but I do have a reason to be comfortable..
And I like performance out of what I would build....

Would those that have built these belts ever consider partially glueing these shut?

I had an idea that using the lighter OZ leather would give the comfort that you speak of...But especially in the area of holster carry, substantiate the leather by adding a leather insert. Glueing and possibly some decorative sewing specifically in that area..

[Slowhand Bob]

Hank, the last several I've made were sewn closed and had sewn through bullet loops.  At least one of the major makers actually glues them solid, I think it is there faux Duke belt.  All practical options to suit yourself.