My Next Project

[Seth Shaw]

Well I just finished my first attempt at a gun belt and some holsters. I made 3 holsters total - 1 single loop, 1 quick draw and a variation of my own on the quick draw that I modified for cross draw. I took pictures last night so I will post them for critque when I get home, I could use the input.

Each time I started on a new piece of leather, my work noticably improved. I learn SO much from each "mistake" I made. My patience increased exponentially after each item was completed.

So taking what I learned, I want to try a Buscadero style gun belt with a drop holster on either one or both sides. I want a drop holster on the strong side for sure because high riding holsters make me feel like I am being "chicken-winged" when I draw. Why I am hesitant about doing both holsters in a drop loop is that I prefer my left gun being in a cross draw holster. Unfortunately I am having trouble making a suitable cross draw holster. I can't get the holster sturdy enough or to sit at the right angle. I am also finding that my pistols are getting "hung-up" in the holster when I try and draw. This could be due to the location of the holstered gun on my body, or I may be wet moulding my guns improperly. Any tips on how to block the pistol to widen the opening so the holster holds the gun, but doesn't clamp onto it with a death-grip?

I ordered Will's Black Canyon Hollywood West holster/gunbelt pattern pack (I really like the look of the sample rig). My question is, can anyone offer advice/patterns/ideas on how I can improve my cross draw holster. It will be for an 1873 Cattleman in .45LC. Would I be better served going with 2 drop loop holsters in a Buscadero rig for my 1st setup?

Thank you all for your advice, I will get those pictures posted tonight.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy Seth 
          I  haven't seen your holsters yet , but I'm sure you did a nice job on them , and the more you do the better you get at it, I've made strong side and cross draw rigs , and I would rather just use a busadero with just one gun , this is what I have used for years . But to play the game they kinda want you to use a straight belt, which is what was comon in the 1800's , to get your gun to fit your holster better, and this is after you have wet molded your holster to your gun, ( or not) and let it dry for a couple days, you can take a piece of 3 or 4 ounce leather and cut a piece big enough to wrap around your cylinder, then put the gun in your holster and leave it in until you feel it is the way you want it, the holster should hold your gun snugly enough to keep it in the holster but loose enough that you can draw it out , without pulling the belt up too, this is what I do when I have an overly tight holster.
          I'm sending a picture of a rig I made, that might be what your after, I made a straight belt ,and a DROP holster for my strong left side holster, and a 28 degree cross draw holster, I used 5 to 7 ounce vegi tanned leather and I lined them with the same weight leather , if  you are trying to find the right angle , you can use an angle finder or a miter box or miter saw, to find your angle , I used a 28 degree angle on mine , your allowed no more than 30 degrees with SASS, This setup works real well for me , although, I think I'm going to stay with the two strong side holsters , just so I don't have to do the dance. I'll send a pictue of them too. Hope this was some help Seth, and if you want to talk some more give me a pm

                                       Happy Holidays 

                                                        Ten Wolves 

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

     Heres the cross draw

[Marshal Will Wingam]

It'll be nice to see the finished pics of your next project. Regarding wet molding, I put my pistols in two ziplocks to shape the holsters. That way there's just a slight oversize to the leather which will shrink slightly after it's fully dried. Here's a link to a good thread here on wet molding: http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,5106.0.html

[Seth Shaw]

Thanks for the replies pards! While I wait for my next pattern pack to arrive I will work on wet moulding and stretching the holsters I have made. I may need to integrate a lace tie into the strong side drop holster, as it looks prone to "flopping" when I draw, due to it hanging from a slit in the gun belt.

However it turns out, I learned a TON from making these 3 holsters and the ranger belt. That experience will go a long way towards ensuring that my next attempt comes out even better!

[Marshal Will Wingam]

However it turns out, I learned a TON from making these 3 holsters and the ranger belt. That experience will go a long way towards ensuring that my next attempt comes out even better!

I seldom make any holster the same twice. There is usually something I'd change the next time. I think it goes with the territory.

[Seth Shaw]

Here are the links to the pictures I took of my 1st leather working attempts. The pictures are rather large so bear with me.

http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Gunleather%20001.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Gunleather%20002.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Gunleather%20003.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Gunleather%20004.jpg

I was happy enough with the work for it having been my 1st try. I was a little too eagar to see the final result and as such I rushed some portions. Most of this work was done without ever having read a book on leatherworking before. I just made assumptions about how I thought it should be done and then ran with it. I didn't realize I needed to use a stitching groover ... or to bevel and burnish the edges of the leather. I didn't stitch down the lining on the belt So I missed alot of crucial items. BUT after reviewing what I did I learned alot from my mistakes. The new blank pieces of my next ranger belt look incredible. The lines are smoother (I bought a good pair of leather shears) and the edges are nice and round and smooth (I bought a bone folder for edge burnishing and I created a nice mix of white & yellow beeswax to impregnate the edges with). I have very high hopes for my next attempt.

I have a few questions though. Any tips on how to firm up the leather between the holster and the skirt? The part of the holster that hangs on the belt ... for me it always seems too malleable, causes my holster to move when I draw (this could also be a product of my needing to refine my wet moulding technique ... maybe putting some leather sealant into my warm water bath when I mould). Does anyone here steel line their holsters? If so, how do you go about doing so? Currently I use waxed animal sinew to hand sew my leather, what kind of thread to ya'll use for hand sewing? I'd like some color options in the future, but it seems to me that even heavy duty machine thread would be flimsy.

Thanks for the advice everyone!

[Dalton Masterson]

You know, that is one heck of a nice start to a lifelong hobby. Very good. I did pretty much the same thing as you, not beveling edges, etc. You learn as you go, and that is the whole point in life I think. Very good! Cant wait for more. DM

BTW, I usually use waxed thread from Tandy, called Nyltex, but have been trying some other more cordlike threads here lately. DM

[Marshal Will Wingam]

That's an ambitious first project. Good job on the tooling. It is balanced and even. Your stitch lines are straight for not having a stitch groove. Congrats. You're off to a great start. Keep it up. Thanks for the pics. Be sure to post pics of your next project.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy Seth

          Will Pard you did a bang up job , for this being your first rig  , you have the right idea ,now you can just refine it as you go along, what is nice about working with leather , is that you are constantly learning new things and ways of doing your craft , it only gets better.
          It looks like you already have some of the tools , stamps and what have ya , I use natural waxed linen thread, from Tandy, A stich grover, a 6 to 1" stiching marker, ( get the pkg. with several sizes )  I use a #2 and #3 beveling tool mostly for the rigs I make, I have a flat bone and a nylon burnishing tool , I also use a piece of 1/2" dowel, with a piece of old blue jean material wrapped and glued around it , this works real well also for burnishing the edges, this one is always a tongue twister for me , but here goes , I use Gum Tarachanth, or Fiebings edge coat ,in black or brown , if you want a more natural look on your edges , use the Gum Tarachanth , and finish burnishing with bees wax, you can also use the Gum T. to smooth out the wiskers on the rough side of your leather, wich is nice if you make an unlined belt or holster, use a piece of 11/2"x 3or4" plexey glass, and round off the edges on a belt sander or disc sander, use this with the Gum T. when smoothing the wiskers off rough side of your leather, you can then use a little oil , Neatsfoot , extra virgin oluve oil , or what I really like now that I've used it is Montana Pitch Blend, which is a last step for protection from the elements , (GREAT STUFF). finishing your leather is a personal thing , and there a lot of ways and products to do this.
           We all look forward to seeing more of your work , and if you have any questions , you have a whole bunch of pards out here that are willing to help you .

                           Have a great Holiday Season and stay tuned 

                                         Ten Wolves Five Shooter 

[Springfield Slim]

Seth: pitch the shears and go get a heavy duty razor knife from the hardware store, and then change the blades often. Just make sure you have a good cutting board underneath, like a poundo board from Tandy or a nylon cutting board from the kitchen store. For burnishing edges get a cocobolo edge burnisher from Hidecrafters. www.hidecrafter.com  #1272-03. I have used rolled up canvas, nylon, a few other things but these are the best and fastest. As for the leather being too soft, try not to use the belly portion of the hide. And use at least 9 oz leather.

[Dalton Masterson]

I might add, in addition to S. Slims ideas, that a nice thick piece of glass is good to cut on too when you are doing fine turning cuts like around the triggerguard. Little harder on knife tips, but a strop every so often helps. Just dont pound on it with you stamps. DM

[Seth Shaw]

I have a few heavy duty cutting blades I use. But for a really clean edge I found the shears to be more effective (especially when cutting a long belt).

Anyone have any recommendations for a good stitching awl? I bought the adjustable blade awl from Tandy (it has 2 diamond blade awls, 1 scratch awl and one lacing fid blade) but I find that the 2 diamond blade stitching awls are way WAY to wide/large for my stitching groove channels. In "The Art of Hand Sewing" it indicates that my lacing holes should not penetrate outside the groove channel. Would I be better off using a file to turn the point of my saddlers awl into a diamond shape and using that? Or is there another commercial awl that has a finer, thinner blade?

Thank you for all the encouragement and advice fellas, I really appreciate it. I'm dying to get off work and go home for a nice 4 day long weekend so I can get back to my latest belt/holster project. I have alot of great ideas I am looking forward to implementing!

Have a great holiday!

[Marshal Will Wingam]

I like to use a thin awl. No-one seems to make one to my liking so I re-shape them with a stone to bet the shape I want. Remember, sharp edges and polished flats will work the best. Make sure it has a super fine point, too. Expect an hour or more to shape it so it works right.

Here's the one I started with. It's a 38mm Vergez Blanchard VB3.904 Straight Blade Stitching Awl:



Here's where you get it (it's on the second page of this section):

http://www.siegelofca.com/view_cat_product.asp?id=8&curpage=2

[Seth Shaw]

True to my word, here are some pictures I have taken of my most recent project. This will be my primary rig for CAS/SASS competitions, it consists of a modified fast draw style holster with approx. a 3" drop and about a 10 degree muzzle forward cant. The belt is a Ranger belt I made using Will's "Cartridge Belts" pattern pack. I modified it myself to add 5 .45LC cartridge loops on the rear right portion of the belt as well as 3 double shotgun shell loops I modelled after a design I had seen on a website somewhere. My crossdraw holster is drying in the sun after I wet moulded it to my 4 3/4" .45LC Cattleman revolver. I'll get some pictures of that once it is finished.

http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20001.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20002.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20003.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20004.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20005.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20006.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20007.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20008.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20009.jpg
http://www.iammercy.net/dace/Cowboy/Drop%20Holster%20Rig%20010.jpg

I used a veiner and camouflage tool in a repeating pattern to create the border tooling. The holster and belt are fully lined with a chocolate brown suede. All the hand stitching was done with pre-waxed sinew I purchased from Centralia Hide & Leather (it's GREAT sewing sinew, I highly recommend it). The buckle is a solid brass California clipped corner style which I really love, and all the rivets are tarnished bronze colored. The buckle on the holster retaining strap is also brass (as will the buckle on the crossdraw holster).

On my previous strong side holster making attempts, I had noticed that at first, even after wet moulding, that the holster would bind up or catch on my pistol as I drew it and I would be unable to easily and consistently clear the gun of the holster. I figured that this was probably because I have ALOT to learn about wet moulding (as I refine my own technique) as well as how to properly draw (gotta practice practice practice to ingrain it in my muscle memory  ). But, just in case that wasn't the only reason I decided to try something new. I reinforced the backing of the holster skirt with an additional layer of 4-5oz veg tanned leather (same leather I use to make straps, cartridge loops etc). So the skirt as well as the portion of the holster that loops over the belt consist of Suede Lining -> 4-5oz Leather Backing -> 9-10oz Tooling Leather. Once it was all assembled and stitched I also briefly dunked it in some lukewarm water mixed with Fiebrings "Tan Kote", which I read here on Cascity can help stiffen leather.

SO! The end result if a drop holster with e VERY sturdy skirt which the holster is secured to with a strap/buckle combination. BUT! My question is this; I want it even MORE secure. I don't want the holster to shift on my belt AT ALL when I draw. I know that as I use the holster more it won't bind up my pistol as much, but I'd like to take chance out of the equation.

I have read on some professional gun leather crafters websites that they sometimes use a special type of screw that connects the back of the holster flap to the front JUST below the bottom edge of the belt. Does anyone have any idea as to what type of screw could accomplish this? I have attached a picture explaining where I would like securing point to be located. The text in the picture just says "Adjustable Retaning Screw Here"

Thanks for taking the time to check out my latest project! As always I welcome any feedback, advice and constructive criticism you more experienced pards can give to this young buck. Much appreciated!

[Seth Shaw]

I hate to reply to myself, but it looks like either a T-Nut or a Chicago Screw will accomplish what I am looking for in regards to securing the holster tightly around the belt so that there is no play or movement when drawing.

Guess I will need to head to the hardware store this week and experiment with various fasteners to see what works best.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Hello Seth
          I use chicago screws from Midway USA I use the hex head type , I find them to be much more user friendly, and you can use them in many different applications, their nice because you can go through a small hole in the back to tighten or loosen, if you were to choose a different type of connection. The next time you do this though, I would sugjest that you install the CS in the back of the holster , under your suede lining, this way it won't show , and rub on your holster, these screws are great for this, and any other securing problem you may have in the future, Your holster looks great , and you have made a big improvement in your work , in just a short time, your tooling is right on and even your cuts are straight , you burnished all your edges, and your dying looks great . you can be real proud of this work. You might want to try smooth leather for your holster lining, on your next holster, it will last longer, and it won't collect dirt like the suede does , suede looks nice, and it will be fine for awhile, but as it gets dusty , it is hard to get out of your holster, and can wear on your guns bluing, if your guns are stainless steel, you don't have to worry , it's funny , they started to use suede to protect the guns bluing, and maybe it's ok for concealed carry , but for cowboy action shooting it doesn't work to well, suede for your gun belt is another thing, and it works well in this application, to keep your belt where you want it. These are just my feelings on this , and I'm sure there will be others that will have different thoughts on the mater. I'm sending the numbers for these CS.
                                    GOOD WORK SETH and keep it up, like they say , you've only just begun.

The Outdoor Connection Chicago Screws Brass Package of 25
Product #: 154663
Status: Available
Our Price: $11.99  just go to www.midwayusa.com





                                                          Happy New Years

                                                      TenWolves

[Seth Shaw]

Thanks for the compliments Ten Wolves! And thanks for the info on the Chicago Screws. I am going to order 2 different varieties from Midway this week and give them a try. I am really glad I found a solution for this holster movement problem, that was the last item I needed to work out so I could complete this gun rig.

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Great job, Seth. 10 Wolves summed it up nicely. Your skill level has leapt forward many fold. It shows in this piece. I like it.

Another thing I've done to secure a holster so it won't move is to pinch the belt with an extra piece of leather held on with a Chicago screw. This way you can loosen it and move the holster to another spot and tighten it down again. I did that on my wife's crossdraw holster and it works really well. If she takes it off and uses a strong side, the belt isn't permanently punched through.

[Dalton Masterson]

Thats a great idea Marshall! And very nice job on that rig!
A nice "I gotta have it right now" source for chicago screws although not as cheap, is to buy one of the gun slings at Walmart. I have done that in a pinch when I have lost one on a trip, and replaced it on the sling later when I got home.
DM