Anyone loading .45-75 with Pyrodex?

Hobie · December 06, 2007, 06:15:58 PM

I haven't read where anyone is using Pyrodex. If you are would you post? If you're not, why not?

I haven't gotten to it yet.

Hobie · December 06, 2007, 08:33:13 PM

Let me add that non-fireformed cases have a capacity of 43 gr. (by weight) of Pyrodex RS settled by vibration or drop-tube to allow for slight compression with a seated bullet. I don't use or have 777 because of my belief that 777 can have untoward pressure spikes.

Grizzly Adams · December 06, 2007, 08:56:03 PM

Quote from: Hobie on December 06, 2007, 08:33:13 PM
Let me add that non-fireformed cases have a capacity of 43 gr. (by weight) of Pyrodex RS settled by vibration or drop-tube to allow for slight compression with a seated bullet. I don't use or have 777 because of my belief that 777 can have untoward pressure spikes.

I agree, that 777 can produce pressure spikes way beyond what I want to see in these rifles, or in traditional BP designs in general. 777 was developed for use in modern in-line muzzle loaders. Too hot for me!

Goex Pinnacle is my sub of choice.

Hobie · December 07, 2007, 08:22:46 PM

Ok, I suppose I should not have been sarcastic. It happens even to me. I believe and have seen that 777 sometimes has attained some unexpected peak pressures and that the pressure curve isn't necessarily appropriate to the cartridge. I believe also, that it is temperature sensitive and creates some untoward phenomenon. Dittos TrailBoss which was also recommended.

I am not familiar with Pinnacle but do know a bit about Pyrodex. I'm not surprised that some users of BP subs are looking for smokeless powder residue characteristics and not simply a easily obtainable sub for what can be a hard (perhaps inconvenient is a better word) to acquire BP.

Buffboy · December 07, 2007, 10:56:50 PM

As you know Hobie, I started with smokeless (4198 and CoW data) and had pretty dismal results. I then just dumped as much Pyrodex P as I could get in the case of my Starline 45-70 cases converted to 40-60(35.5 gr IIRC). There was about 1/4" of compression. The results were very good. Consistent, accurate, and the velocities right in line with expectations. Cleanup wasn't really a problem. In fact I've found that my smokeless load makes more difficult cleaning $:-\$ . I don't think you could get enough Pyrodex in the case without damaging the case or the bullet from compression to hurt the firearm.

Since, I've come up with a load at about the same velocity with 3031(about 50fps faster) that shoots real well.

Hobie · December 08, 2007, 07:22:57 AM

Buffboy,

Do your Pyrodex loads produce velocities similar or equivalent to the original loadings?

Buffboy · December 08, 2007, 08:41:22 AM

Hobie, I felt it was just exactly the same as what I could expect with black powder. CoW shows an original BP load with the 210gr bullet at 1562 FPS(unknown barrel length), my 35.5gr pyrodex(50gr measure), 245gr bullet was running 1320fps(15' in front of the muzzle, 26" barrel). Considering the different firearms, the 35gr heavier bullet, less volume of the converted 45-70 case, and method of cronographing, I felt that was right in line with what I should be getting. I later tapped the case to get more powder in, used a little more compression and got 37.0gr in the case but I never cronoed that load

. I did shoot that load quite a bit, it gave excellent accuracy and was easy to clean up.

Grizzly Adams · December 08, 2007, 11:39:23 AM

Quote from: Hobie on December 07, 2007, 08:22:46 PM
I am not familiar with Pinnacle but do know a bit about Pyrodex. I'm not surprised that some users of BP subs are looking for smokeless powder residue characteristics and not simply a easily obtainable sub for what can be a hard (perhaps inconvenient is a better word) to acquire BP.

Pinnacle will give you slightly lower velocities than an equal volume and granulation of pyrodex. It will also produce much less hard fouling than pyrodex. In fact, I can shoot 50 rounds without ever having to swab the bore, and it cleans up in three patches. It is also much less corrosive than pyrodex - which, by the way, is more corrosive than the Holy Black.

Another nice feature of the Pinnacle powder is that it does not require any special BP lube. Smokeless lube, or NO lube on the bullets works just fine!

Hobie · December 08, 2007, 01:40:41 PM

Well, I have 4 test rounds loaded with Pyrodex RS (much easier to get locally) and hope to grab the Chrony for a quick session next week. All my test loads are using the Lee 457-325FN (I think that's the proper mold designation) which actually comes out lubed and sized at 340 gr. I still have a few of Grizzly's original mold castings to try a bit later. That has been about the best bullet I've tried so far.