Is this a good deal?

[mtmarfield]

   Greetings, BHD!

   I tend to blow all of my cash on the firearms, so sometimes "entry level" is fine for now; I'm not yet CAS, so maybe my thoughts don't count as much, as I don't beat my leather up in competitions.
   I do, however, salute you for being The Gentleman, and I'm putting your company on my "favourites Search" list.

   Be Well!

        M.T.Marfield:.
             6-28-07

[Slowhand Bob]

I offered a bargain table when setting up at events.  In my experience, it sold little more (if at all), than the more expensive products.  You are dealing with two totally different customers when you talk the difference in quality versus lowest price and the persons position in life does not always dictate his buying habits.

I once worked for a guy who drove a couple of hundred thousand dollars worth of cars and Harleys but yet bought the junkiest guns immaginable.  I would fuss at him constantly about his choices but to no avail.  He did like to look at and handle 'the nice stuff' but that was always for later priorities.

In my local shooting group, I'll bet I could lay my hand on at least half a dozen shooters who had to litterally sacrifice for the leather that houses their firearms but they did it.  Most of these guys did it, not because they did not know about Mexican rigs for $99.  The reason these guys sacrificed for quality was to obtain excellence in their performance.  Their priority is shooting and that trumps looking for low end equipment.

Triggersmith, the cusomer for 'made in China' is already out there and you can forget him, he will never be your customer anyhows.  This customer is acually not even looking for a bargain, he seeks low price only.  Your competition is going to be much tuffer than a starving Chinaman, you are going up against an ever growing group of leathercrafters who constantly seek to offer more quality at better prices to rise above the crowd.

Lets talk craft, this is getting kind of heavy!

[Triggersmith]

That about says it for me Bob. I'm done.
Well,  Bye
Triggersmith

[St. George]

Actually - the 'Made in China' rigs are already out there - and are being used by those doing a military Impression.

All those holsters and Dyer Pouches and such that International Military Antiques offers in the 'Shotgun News' and the like are made by 'Pacific Canvas and Leather', and built in China.

The 'Oklahoma Leather' offerings 'are' of the type made for the big Mail Order houses during the era - none of those rigs were fitted or lined - and decoration was truly minimal - often being a simple machine embossing.

The quality rigs that are still around came from saddlery shops - made of good leather, and offered as an adjunct to the 'real' business at hand - saddles and tack - but like the ones seen on the Dry Goods shelf - they were deep so as to secure the piece.

Most shooters balk at prices of good leather today - simply because they don't have all the money needed to buy the best, if that means a competition-based outfit - and most will never gain from the advantages of their leather - but they will shoot more often and they'll enjoy the sport more - and as their finances improve - and their exposure to folks with better rigs - maybe then they'll salt some spare cash away - and place an order.

This can be a damned expensive hobby - as we know - and folks do prioritize their discretionary income spending more now than ever before.

Personally - I always encourage folks to buy the best - or at least, the best that they can afford - simply because they'll get better value for their dollar, but if all they can afford is something from that noted importer of Chinese-made goods - Cabela's - and by using that item, they can get a basic outfit together - then they need to be encouraged in the sport.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Bad Hand Dan]

Well God bless you gentlemen for the support you have given to me on this thread! I truly appreciate it.

I love CAS and I work the gunshows with my booth being dedicated to the expansion of the sport. At the Southern California shows my wife and I will often be the only CAS dedicated folks there.

We hand out our "Basic Guide to CAS", explain the sport etc...

The more new shooters we get, the more leathermakers we will employ. All shooters need to start somewhere, however, and a top shelf big money rig should not stand in the way of getting started. They WILL buy these eventually, after getting the cowboy fever. Maybe I can help sell some of the no doubt fantastic goods you gents make.

I'm going to work my hardest to expand our sport and if I can make a living out of it, PRAISE GOD!

Until then, may the wind help you hit your targets!

Bad Hand Dan
http://www.oldwestgoods.com

[Major 2]

"...The 'Oklahoma Leather' offerings 'are' of the type made for the big Mail Order houses during the era - none of those rigs were fitted or lined - and decoration was truly minimal - often being a simple machine embossing.

The quality rigs that are still around came from saddlery shops - made of good leather, and offered as an adjunct to the 'real' business at hand - saddles and tack - but like the ones seen on the Dry Goods shelf - they were deep so as to secure the piece.

Most shooters balk at prices of good leather today - simply because they don't have all the money needed to buy the best, if that means a competition-based outfit - and most will never gain from the advantages of their leather - but they will shoot more often and they'll enjoy the sport more - and as their finances improve - and their exposure to folks with better rigs - maybe then they'll salt some spare cash away - and place an order.

This can be a damned expensive hobby - as we know - and folks do prioritize their discretionary income spending more now than ever before.

Personally - I always encourage folks to buy the best - or at least, the best that they can afford - simply because they'll get better value for their dollar, but if all they can afford is something from that noted importer of Chinese-made goods - Cabela's - and by using that item, they can get a basic outfit together - then they need to be encouraged in the sport.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

can't argue with that logic 

I said my piece.. I answered the thread starters question from my point of view, Experience is the professor 
I did not intend to impugn oldwestgoods.com

over and out !

[Bad Hand Dan]

I want to say A BIG THANK YOU to Major for alerting me to the pricing of Cabelas.  They get their OK Leather a lot cheaper than I do, but I need to be competitive, no matter how bad it may hurt.

I already had to go back To OK Leather for more stock since I matched the prices to the Cabelas. They are a super bunch over at OKL. Really helpful.

Sometimes the small business can win, especially as I am an active CAS shooter and I care deeply about my customers. My customer service is an area I can always win in.

You gents keep the faith and the craft! Let's get some more shooters out there to throw some lead. God bless!

Bad Hand Dan
http://www.oldwestgoods.com

[Travis Morgan]

I wish Oklahoma Leather would change their name, I've seen their products, and they aren't doing Oklahoma any favors by using that in their name. 

    As I recall, they are actually located in Texas. Otherwise referred to as the Northern occupied territory of Mexico.

[Travis Morgan]

I'm not at all against good quality, low priced equipment.  Mexican tooled leather has been excellent for decades.  I just worry about someday seeing a  $10.00 holster with the makers stamp that says "China Leather Company."  Where does the "low end"  end?
Triggersmith

That mex tooled crap is dry and varnished. Not worth crap. Bend it once, it cracks. Bend it a dozen times, and it'll fall apart.

[Butch Barkley]

Just checking in to see if these (this?) guy is still in business. I purchased a pair of holsters and a belt from him near the first of the year, but the belt has shrunk!!!  (Another of those "wife put it in the dryer"?)   Anyway, the site keeps coming up as Empire Technology or something like that. There were some items that I wanted to check on, but I can't find the info out there. The last posting to this thread was from late June 2007. So, as I said, just checking to see if anyone knows about it.

Thanks in advance pards!

Butch
My name is Buh...Buh...Butch!

I just found these guys, and they are advertising at 50% off.
http://www.oldwestgoods.com
I am totally new to this cowboy stuff, and need some leather for my NM 5.5" Vaquero, but am afraid of screwing up and buy something that I shouldn't have.
Is this decent leather?
No offense to these guys, but I'm a little skeptical of a 1/2 off sale. Does this leather usually sell for more?

Thanks!

[Major 2]

Offer or make a GOOD product at a fair or reasonable price the world will beat a path to your door 

or then there is Web Hosting 

[Texas Lawdog]

"Build it and they will come".

[Texas Lawdog]

You get what you pay for.

[Travis Morgan]

Butch,

    I had a similar issue. Once I got married, all my pants shrunk! I'd worn a 32" (now a 38")waist since high school, but suddenly, all my pants shrunk. So did the ones at the store! How the hell I gained weight while shoeing horses and doing construction, I dunno!

[Seth Shaw]

I hate to jump here so late in the game, but I figured what the heck, I craft leather gear too so why not chime in.

I started shooting in SASS matches only 3 months ago or so. I had joined SASS the organization NINE months ago. So that means I had the desire to shoot and I knew clubs where I could shoot CAS events at, but I had to wait 6 months before I felt I could start. That's how tough it can be to get started with your own gear when you are coming into the sport cold. The upshot to is was, that the cost of quality gun leather was SO far out of my reach (and I refuse to skimp on quality whenever possible) that my wife insisted I try crafting leather myself to save money.

Am I a great leathersmith? Heck no! I am amateur at best! But I love the gun leather I have made and I am very proud of it and it only cost me a fraction of what a commercial rig would have run me. If I had NOT have gone this route I can assure your I would have;

A. Waited another 6 months before starting to compete/participate in SASS matches.
B. Knuckled under and bought a practical yet serviceable budget rig till I could afford top of the line leather.

I hate the idea of having to buy twice, but sometimes it happens. Heck, I just had to buy new pistols cause I went with Uberti's first cause I was tight on coin.

Cowboy Action Shooting is a VERY expensive sport to get involved in, especially if you want to only buy once and get it right the 1st time. Newbies coming into this sport can be warned to high heaven about the perils of not taking their time before making purchases and about how high the initial costs can be, but even with that advice we are still taken off guard by it.

Anyways, before I ramble on any further, the moral of the story is, if push came to shove and I had to do it all over again only this time I wasn't able to make my own leather, I would have bought budget leather so I could have started shooting sooner. This sport is way to much fun to miss out on it cause you are short on money to buy a $300 gun rig. And on top of that, coming down on people for choosing to go the budget route does nothing to help promote the sport or encourage new shooters.

I would hope most people would rather see more new shooters with budget rigs having fun competing in CAS events, than see them turn away from the sport cause they can't afford top of the line gear.

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Good advice, pard. There's nothing wrong with budget gear to enable someone to get started in the sport. If it works, you're shooting. You can always upgrade later on. You're right, this sport is way too much fun to miss out on if you can get started sooner with a less expensive item.

[Major 2]

You make lucid point..

However the orginial question was ...."Is this a good deal?"  and "is this decent leather"?

As to the deal I answered ....his 1/2 price sale was the same as Cabela's catalog price...
in other words he was saying " I charge  $ XX for the product normally  but on sale it' $ X "
The appearance of a bargain. At twice the price is was more than double it's useful value.

Next the product itself, is mass produced ,oilly, 7oz and soft. Stitching has a tendency to pull at ends and the holster will begin to unravel...it leaves an oilly residue on clothing.
It will begin to misshape as it stretches and the Gun (particularly heavy OMV Rugers) will sink lower.


I know of several  makers, who can made good entry level holsters and can compete with the Price, even the 1/2 price quoted...
One only need to ask here, and they will be steared in the right directions.

I have a fine Holster from one , that was only $32.50 a 10oz quality leather Slimjim with a simple border and sewn plug toe.
I've had it 3-4 years ..sees morderately heavy use with a Remington 7 1/2 Conversion...
It looks as good today as it did when it was sent, though a bit marked and scuffed.

I've made my own, but that's not to say I don't buy from a good Maker too.
I make a killer steak...but I enjoy fine Steak House on occasion  

That's all , thats it ! my openion...  other flavors will vary   

[Marshal Will Wingam]

I've made my own, but that's not to say I don't buy from a good Maker too.
I make a killer steak...but I enjoy fine Steak House on occasion  

Good point there, too. 

[Deadeye Don]

I didnt read anyone coming down hard on someone for getting budget leather goods.  The basic issue is that you get what you pay for.  If you can only afford budget leather then buy it.   Just dont expect it to last as long, and dont make an issue of it when it falls apart.   

That being said,  I agree with Major 2 that there are good reasonably priced leather makers out there and the leather goods they make will last  as well.   Carricos is one that comes to mind. 

[Major 2]

I didnt read anyone coming down hard on someone for getting budget leather goods.  The basic issue is that you get what you pay for.  If you can only afford budget leather then buy it.   Just dont expect it to last as long, and dont make an issue of it when it falls apart.   

That being said,  I agree with Major 2 that there are good reasonably priced leather makers out there and the leather goods they make will last  as well.   Carricos is one that comes to mind. 

Exactly...That was the maker I was speaking of...