Hodgdon Tripe 7 and Fillers????

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

I live in a tiny town in western Kansas and therefore locating reloading supplies is often unproductive and often expensive due to haz-mat shipping charges. A Walmart Store 60 miles away often carries 777 and using the loading specs provided by Hodgdon web site, makes a mighty strong load. Using those specs, my joints start to complain which lead me to experiment with some fillers and 777. But before I do that, I wondered if a quick check here might find someone who has already walked those tracks as I am not interested in reinventing the wheel. So if you have any insight for me, please don't be bashful and step right up to the podium and tell me what you know.

[sundance44`s]

There`s some infromation on www.captainbaylorsrangercamp.com ...just scroll down the page and click on his Black powder subs for dummys ..I`ve tried some of what he`s doing for filler and it worked for me ....but because of the warnings on the 777 site i`d have to say don`t try this at home . They say no fillers ..but who wants to shoot 37 grs of 777 every time they pull the trigger .

[Capt. Augustus]

I use chaulker backing rod 1/2" diameter.
.45 Schofield 15 grains 777 and backing rod
.45 LC 22 grains 777 and backing rod
To measure hw much backing rod, put in powder insert rod, cut it off even with case edge, then seat bullet.

[Tensleep]

Go to Lowes or Home Depot and buy "backer rod."
It is round foam for sealing around windows and doors.
It comes in several diameters and cut to length, insert on top of the 777 and seat your bullet.

I used 3/8" in 38s and 1/2" in 45s.

I experimented until I found the load I liked (length of backer rod in case.)

[Adirondack Jack]

Howdy Sherrif Moses.

What caliber ya loadin' for pard?

If'n it's .45, I didn't like trippin the trigger on a wholebunch of that expensive 777 either, not to shoot close steel, so I made the short cases advertized in the banner that follows my post.

No wads or fillers, progressive reloading, and cut the powder bill a whole bunch.  What's not to like?  

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

Yep, I guess I should have mentioned the claiber of 44-40. I have used Cream of Wheat in the past as a filler in some smokeless loads in 45s and other than smelling like burned chicken feathers, everything worked fine. I have never tried the backer board, but I do like the way cream of wheat pours like water. I am sure that in today's world Hodgdon is not gonna allow anykind of experimenting with their products, hence the warnings. Thanks for all the quick responses......

[Tensleep]

I talked with Birdshot from Hodgdons and he said even filler like cream of wheat and grits have more moisture that 777 and will migrate into the powder.
Backer rod is DRY and neutral and will not migrate moisture.

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

Thank you Tensleep...........
A good point I never thought of, now, I just need to get someplace that sells backer road and I'll be in business.......

[Howdy Doody]

Does that foam backer rod gum up the barrel? Leave any hard to get rid of deposits?

[sundance44`s]

I`ve been useing the backer rod for a few months now shooting every weekend and so far nothing in the barrel and i`ve never seen one flameing out of the barrel eaither ...it slows down the loading a little but if`ll you`ll cut your backer rod first its just one added step with a wooden dowel to push them in the case .Probally easyer than useing other fillers .
For those that have never seen this stuff ..they have it at Lowels here and it`s for useing around windows during installing them ..for the air space around the frame in .

[Tensleep]

Does that foam backer rod gum up the barrel? Leave any hard to get rid of deposits?

Have seen no sign whatsoever and clean up is the same as without backer rod.

[Bead Swinger]

Hey Y'all -
Thanks a bunch!! That backer rod sounds like just the ticket.  'Have to go grab some next time I'm out. The 777 is much easier to handle and locate, although it is a bit hot for most of my loading.

Speaking of 777 - Should I be concerned with using a lot of lube?  or particular types of lube?

[sundance44`s]

I`ve been useing cheapo smokeless lube bullets , fouling is not a problem ...and the stuff cleans up with water .

[Tensleep]

"Smokeless" bullets are fine with the subs like 777, APP and Pinnacle.

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

As a little followup here, I loaded some 44-40 with 1.6cc Lee Dipper APP, topped with some foam backer rod and loaded with a regular blue lube smokeless 200 grain bullet. It is a very pleasant load to shot, highly accurate and enough smoke to warn off the wagon train.
It did leave some nasty looking black loose crud in the barrel, but cleanup was just the same as without the foam backer rod, it did not make any difference at all. All cleaned up and back in the box in a couple of minutes.
I say thank you to whom made the suggestion as other than being a labor of love cutting individual pieces to stuff into each one and being very time consuming, it is great to shoot and I know my old joints appreciate it!

[Adirondack Jack]

Sheriff Moses,

If ya decide to go with backer rod, ya might wanna make a jig to cut it.  one way would be to use a piece of CPVC or even copper pipe, pick a size the rod slides into nice, and whatever distance from one end yer piece of backer needs to be, cut a slot almost all the way through, leaving just a bit on the bottom not cut.  Now, cut in from the end of the tube, so that yer splitting the end part in half, back to the first cut.  Now take this tube,with the "step" made onto the end, and glue it to a board.  glue a small bit of wood up against the end of the "step", so that if ya slide a length of rod into the tube, it stops against the end of the tube.  Now ya slice off a piece, using the first slot as a guide, and pluck the cut off bit out of the "step" part of the tubing, advance the rod, and slice again.  When ya get close to the end of a rod, use a dowel or pencil to push it into the tube.  It should go very fast and give ya very even slices.

Somethin' like this:

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

By Golly Adirondack Jack,
I do believe you are on to something there, since my way was less than an exact science, lol......
thanks for the tip!

[Grapeshot]

I live in a tiny town in western Kansas and therefore locating reloading supplies is often unproductive and often expensive due to haz-mat shipping charges. A Walmart Store 60 miles away often carries 777 and using the loading specs provided by Hodgdon web site, makes a mighty strong load. Using those specs, my joints start to complain which lead me to experiment with some fillers and 777. But before I do that, I wondered if a quick check here might find someone who has already walked those tracks as I am not interested in reinventing the wheel. So if you have any insight for me, please don't be bashful and step right up to the podium and tell me what you know.

Just as an alternative, I have been using a granulated polystyrene product from Balistic Products.  The stuff flows like water, has no moisture and was intended to be used as a shot buffer for 00 buck Shot loads in Shotgun Hulls.

That being said, I'll tell you what I have found to work for me.  After putting the required ammount of powder in my cases, I put a card wad of the correct caliber in on top of the powder and seat it with a dowel.  Then I add just enough buffer to be able to seat the bullet with a slight compression.

I had been just adding the buff directly on the powder but after firing a cylinder full of .44's you could smell burned plastic.  The card or fibre wads are cheap to use and stop the burning of the filler.  If you get a punch you can make your own wads out of cerial boxes.

Good Luck on your reloading.

[Cedar County Sheriff]

Howdy Pards,
  I've been loading .45Colt cases half full and seating a standard smokeless-lubed bullet without filler and the load shoots as comfortably as my 4.5Gr. Clays smokeless loads, shoots to the same point-of-aim, and makes good smoke too!

Hope this helps!

[Sheriff A.E. Moses]

Cedar County Sheriff. thanks for the reply but I have always been advised to compress just enough to remove any airspace and if you are only filling your cases half full, than I recomend you check with some real authorities on the subject before anything bad happens to your gun or your hand........sounds like some of these new half-sized cases might just be right up your alley!