44 Spcl Type II

[Abilene]

Well, it started a couple of years ago when someone on this site mentioned a big ammo sale at some dealer I'd never heard of, and I ended up with a case (500 rds) of Black Hills 44 Russian (210gr flat point) at a price I couldn't pass up.  I have and shoot several 44 Spcl guns but am happy with that round, so I've just been sitting on the case of Russians. 

Now, is that a good reason to buy a gun?  Yeah, it's a trick question.  ANY reason is a good one, hehe.  So I bought myself a Christmas present, a Cimarron 5 1/2" 44 Spcl Type II Richards, to shoot up that ammo.  Now, 1860 conversions were .44's but were never produced for 44 Russian that I know of, but I won't let that little detail deter me. 

After getting my '61 Type II and shooting it quite a bit, I've been wanting basically the same thing in .44.  So I ordered it.  When it arrived, I noticed that there was already a light ring all the way around the cylinder.  Thanks a lot, Uberti.  I knew what it was, the bolt head doesn't retract far enough into the frame at half-cock.  I've seen it several times before.  Seems to be more of a problem on opentop type guns with their curved water table.  Well, I could have refused it and sent it back for a refund or exchange, but I knew it was the last one in stock and I didn't want to wait for another shipment.  I could have let them repair it under warranty, but I think they would have just shaved down the bolt head and touched up the cylinder, and I can do that without having to wait some months.  So I did the bolt work myself and will try touching up the cylinder later.  Also tossed in an Evil Roy spring kit and rubbed some emery paper over a few spots.  Re-profiled the hand spring.  I guess the arbor is short - with the cylinder out and a split washer in the hole, I could force the barrel all the way on up to the frame, but then could not even start the wedge into the slot.  With the cylinder installed and no washer, the wedge is pretty tight when barely in, so I'm shooting it that way for now.  Maybe hunt for a smaller washer later.  The action feels very good now.  The bolt rise is just slightly late, but the gun locks up well with no throw-by on fast cocking, so I'm okay with that.

I didn't even take a picture with the Army grip, just took it off immediately.  The Navy grip is borrowed from the '51 R-M that is currently wearing a Tru-Ivory grip that is borrowed from my engraved R-M's which are currently back to wearing Thunderer grips. I have another Navy grip coming from Crow Choker as well, so that is another possibility. Only Army grips came originally on the '60's and their conversions, but I'm sure some folks back then put on a Navy grip either out of necessity or preference. 

First match (and first shot from the gun) was Saturday at the Tejas Caballeros.  For this match I paired the gun with a 44 Spcl Thunderer (I am no stranger to mixing guns), and will likely also pair it with the similar looking '61 and perhaps the Kirst-Strite '61 after I get its hand spring repaired. If I shoot it much with the '61 Type II, I may borrow the other Tru-Ivory grip to put on the new '60 for a more matching appearance.  I shot the same 44 Spcl load in both (180 gr bullet, 4.5gr Traiboss), until the last stage when I loaded 5 Russians in the conversion.  My intention was to pay attention to the difference between the Spcl in the Thunderer and the Russian in the conversion, but I forgot about it until the stage was finished.  But they were close enough to not feel obviously different. Both the Specials and Russians mostly dropped out of the cylinders at the unloading table.

And the result was...another clean match!  This being a Christmas match, everybody had the opportunity for a clean match by making up any misses with extra shotgun shots at the end of each stage.  But I did not need any makeups, and even with some shotgun fumbles and a few hulls that didn't eject, managed 14th out of 49 shooters.  Not having to do makeups certainly helped! 

Moving on, I think I will stick with the Russians in this gun, partially because it eases my reloading requirements.  And then when I have enough empty brass I'll start reloading that.  I know the Russian makes a dandy BP round as well, and I look forward to when I have time to get back to shooting more black.  Enough blah blah, time for pics.

[Coffinmaker]

Abilene   

MOST EXCELLENT!!

AND HAPPY HOLLIDAYS EVERYBODY   

[Professor Marvel]

Ah My Good Abilene

beautiful Open Tops and I love that thunderer!

Seasons Greetings and Merry Christmas to Everyone!

prof and mrs marvel

[Crow Choker]

Interesting post Abilene. I can't wait to get your Army grip frame on my newest OT that came with Navies. Then all four of my OT style cartridge hoglegs with have the same type of grip. The one that came with the Navy grip just didn't look right along side the other three-feel right either. 

[Coffinmaker]

Hey Abilene   

I are be some curious.  Is it a Typo??  Your narrative describes your 44 Special Type II as an 1861.  I don't find an 1861 on offer.  Also, your 44 Spl sports the stepped cylinder of an 1860.  The 1861 was an 1851 with an army style barrel assembly and '51 type grips. 

Or am I just confused??  Weak and Feeble Mind wants to know??

[Abilene]

Coffinmaker, I could refer you to this thread to refresh your memory:

https://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,58772.0.html

The '61 Type II is the one in the picture above with the white grip.  Of course, Uberti calls it an 1860 Type II but their .38 Type II's have the '51/'61 frame and cylinder, so merely changing the Army grip to Navy gives you a "Sixty One"

So now I have two Type II's, the '61 .38 and now the '60 .44.

And Merrrrry Christmas to all of youse guys, too!

[Coffinmaker]

   Now I Remember   

No I don't.  I hadda re-read the whole referenced thread.  Makes good sense now.  I'm there.  I was kinda unaware Cimarron was marketing a Type II in .38 with a straight cylinder and non-rebated water table.  Really KOOL!!  I could live with a pair of those.  Don't know what I'd do wid em, but I could find room inna safe. 

My current Type II(ish) conversions were built on Pietta 1860 frames/cylinders with the barrels cut at the ejector housings.  They are .45s