Civil War Infantry Cookoffs?

[Flatlander55]

Hello, I have heard of a few chainfires of the era, but how often did an infantryman in combat with an average rifled, or smoothbore musket have issues of ignition of powder while pouring from a paper cartridge after the previous shot? Burning powder can get left behind, and in a firefight I would sure not wait for safety reasons. I've read of soldiers accidentally firing with a ramrod in but nothing of a charge detonating early. I hope this makes sense, I'm not up to speed on muzzleloading terminology.

[Major 2]

 A trained Soldier was required & could fire 3-4 rounds per minute with his rifled musket.
Understanding that, I'm quite sure it happened and often.
In combat, I doubt anyone noted the incidents....
 

[Blair]

Flatlander55,

Soldiers of the time period were trained to load their firearms in "9 counts" (9 commands).
These maybe found in the manuals for the various Models from 1855 to the 1864.
While this training dose not stop the potential for a cook-off from occurring, the manuals, if fallowed correctly, helped prevent injury to the soldier should a cook-off happen during any part of loading.
I believe copies of the 1863 Springfield Manual of Arms can be found on the Net.
I hope this helps.
My best,
Blair

[Flatlander55]

Thank you both. I fell asleep while watching Gettysburg, woke up with a question I never even pondered. One never knows when it happens but it sure can make you wonder.

[Coffinmaker]

Not necessarily meaning to be terribly flip.  Well, OK, I am ........ sort of. 

I initially thought this question concerned Steak and Potatoes.  Or maybe even "field pizza."  Biscuits and Gravy also came to mind.  Never
even suspected it was about a round "cooking off" while being rammed.

Mostly, for me, a "Cookoff" is mostly involved with a Howitzer.  Or a Pastrami sandwich.   

Coffinmaker

[Flatlander55]

You, sir, have a great sense of humor. It's actually refreshing! I'm sure glad we don't have hardtack and worm cookoffs anymore.

[Major 2]

Thank you both. I fell asleep while watching Gettysburg, woke up with a question I never even pondered. One never knows when it happens but it sure can make you wonder.

Since you brought up "Gettysburg" .... the Park Service ( we filmed a good deal on NPS actual battlefield) required a 10 minute rule
on Artillery between firing and reloading... " back to one " is the term
Meaning, re-set  for another take (camera roll or take )
Two things made this note worthy...

* The Reenactor's prided themselves in " getting back to one "  ( the exact position for another take )
as historians and trained units...  Infantry , Artillery and Horsemen , wagons etc.  
They would re-set well before , production/Camera could be ready to roll.
Camera never waited , it amazed the production crew early on and became quite remarkable.

* the Artillery, were required to wait 10 minutes before they to touch the gun after firing, this was strictly adhered to.
Often camera/production and more so the reenactors had to wait as the clock ticked down the full 10 minutes before
the Artillery crews could even begin to "get back to one "


The late Skip Cosper, first assistant director refereed to reenactors as " Background Artist's "
and  production coined them  "Cosper's Corp"
I was an Assistant Director corps background wrangler under Skip , directing the horsemen.

[Noz]

One of the cannoneers activities was running a wet mop down the barrel of the cannon to extinguish any sparks.

[Blair]

I fully understand the NPS requirements, especially on Park property. They don't tend to like having rifle-musket fired with anything but their own cartridges.

However, the manuals of the time period for reloading a just fired piece, is to "stale the vent" first. This prevents air from coming through the vent that might help embers to keep glowing.
Next is to "worm the piece", with a cork screw like tool to help remove any such left behind material.
Nest would be to "sponge the piece', to help eliminate any glowing embers.
At this point the piece could be ordered to reloading, but, the vent remained "Staled" during this time. Not until it came time to "prick and prime" was the thumb stale removed from the vent.
All of this could be done very quickly by a well trained gun crew.
My best,
Blair

[Flatlander55]

Very interesting all around. I know that for me while in real infantry combat, muscle memory only went so far and foolish amerature mistakes were made by me. Not fully seating a magazine, forgetting to take the safety off, loading a tracer mag instead of ball rounds, etc. When under fire things happen, and I can't imagine in a situation as massive as Civil War combat it would be any different. It's awesome to know how seriously reenactors took the filming, and how serious 99% of them take safety. You always have one knucklehead though. I will add one question, how common are cookoffs with blanks while reenacting or participating in living history events? I'm assuming barely any, but thats also if they are even admitted.

[Blair]

Flatlander55,

I have found that by fallowing the training provided in the loading manuals, most shooters will remain in good health.

Your original question was in regards to cook-offs.
The best way I know of to prevent this is through good cleaning of the weapons after usage. This too is covered impart by the manuals.
However, this was only done under the authorization by trained personnel and with their supervision.
With the tens of thousands of arms being used in the field at anyone given time, this became a major issue.
Many, (not all) re-enactors don't do a very good job of this basic cleaning requirement, if they bother with it at all.
They tend to like the antique look, seems to make them feel more real to the period.
My best,
Blair

[Seamus]

Howdy,

For what it is worth, in many years of Civil War Skirmishing I have never seen a cookoff occur.  We are very aware of the danger and our rules prohibit fingers over the barrel while loading (no "thumbing" the bullet). 

It was probably more likely to occur in combat using paper cartridges and not being able to clean or even swab one's rifle after repeated firings.

Seamus 

[Coffinmaker]

Rifle'd field pieces??  Muskets??  Rifle'd Muskets??

WE're talking cook-off here!!  I wanna know when the Chili is gonna be ready    

Chili is really best with Cornbread Muffins or Paper Plates (Tortillas).

Coffinmaker

[fourfingersofdeath]

No doubt they were trained to keep them pointed away from themselves, if they did have a cookoff which trashed the gun, there were always plenty of spare guns on the ground.

[Grapeshot]

Cook-off to me is the gun going off after the gun is loaded and before it is readied to shoot.  This happens when a cartridge is loaded into the chamber and the breech block/bolt is closed.  The barrel/chamber is hot enough to cause the powder to ignite without the firing mechanism being employed.  I saw this happen in .50caliber BMG's when firing long strings and allowing the bolt to be closed with a live round in the chamber waiting for the next target to come into range.

That said.  I have seen, while shooting with the N/SSA, a man start to pour a powder charge down the barrel of a .577 Enfield when the powder ignited in the barrel and send a flash of fire and smoke out of the muzzle singeing his fingers.  Two volleys later, it did it again.

[Blair]

Grapeshot,

Yes, these are two types of cook-offs.
One is from the rapid fire of some modern firearms like the BMG.
The other is generally from poorly maintained muzzleloaders from the ACW, If the soldier learned his proper loading procedures, he would not have been harmed from a cook-off
Thanks for your post.
My best,
Blair