Looking for suggestions on what holster pattern to make.

[Black River Smith]

Moving into turn of century smokeless 44Spl Colt SAA.  So year is about 1912 to 1915 by the time I find out about this new caliber in new smokeless powder.

So what type or pattern holster would I find to put this SAA in?  Can you provide a book and page for an example picture of the holster you recommend?  I understand that anything about 1895 on, would still be usable or a viable option.

I found that Meanea was still in existance in 1914 as listed on page 118 of PI, I truly did not catch that all these years.  I just got a hold of Will Ghormley's Cheyenne Pattern, so it is a possibility but really looking for something different, but not modern.

I will be making this holster myself so complete detailing may not be reproduced just the shape and will have some tooling.

Thanks

[Camano Ridge]

Most of the styles of the late 1800's carried over into the first part of the 1900's. In the early 1900's you started to see the military flap holsters that evolved into like the 1912 pattern. The Tom Three Persons and the Buscadero/Hollywood holsters did not come about until around 1920. The one thing that did become more prevalent at the turn of the century was the use of spots and conchos.

[Black River Smith]

Your third sentence is what I do want to stay away from, no modern or hollywood.  Your last line is some new piece of info that I appreciate hearing.

[Cliff Fendley]

S.D. Myers comes to mind.

[Davem]

That double loop Wyoming pattern- I think that was almost universal. Can't go wrong with that.  A lot of the originals just had some simple tooling along the edge, repetitive stamps, things like that.

[Slowhand Bob]

You are right on the steps of entering some more modern holster designs.  I would cheat a bit and go with something similar to the Three Persons (or at least close to a minimalist Duke design) for a super practical holster l that is evolving right along with the new smokeless ammunitions that were just just getting a toe hold.  The old will be gone soon and the new is starting to move away from the old excess baggy styles and a spit is developing between the practical cowboy and the gaudy photo cowboy that will soon turn from rodeo/wild west shows to movie stars.  Holsters that are high and tight will be coming into vogue now for those who actually need a gun and need it to be secure and in place.  That south-west border is as dangerous as it has ever been at this period in history.  There are patterns already available out there for the Three Persons Rigs, I even think there might be one in the old Bible of 'Holster Making' by Stohlman and sold by Tandy.   

[Davem]

Is there any regional aspect? In other words the Three person's design: was it used in TX and OK and then spread to other areas over time?

[Camano Ridge]

Tom Three Persons was working in the El Paso area and supposedly designed the three persons holster about 1920, he had the holster made by S.D.Myer company and the popularity of the holster spread among the law enforcement communities. The original was an open top with later versions having a hammer thong and then a retention strap.

[Trailrider]

That Three Persons rig would be okay, providing you include the retention strap and the snap! Pretty fast to get into action; faster than the hammer thong version. I would NOT use the exposed hammer version with any double action gun, however! Too easy to snag the exposed trigger on brush or something.

[Massive]

It is pretty easy to make your own pattern.  I look for quality belies when they go on sale. they are great for working out your pattern.  Once you have a pattern you can configure it to any style with minimal additional work.  You can also determine if you want to add any presumably modern features like a sight track, or heavy welt. Then you can add any features that are necessary to your method of work, for instance I like a little space for machine sewing so I make the seam allowance a little wider, it just gets cut off.

Since you already have a Gormley pattern that should get your pattern development off to a good start.

[ChuckBurrows]

While some later iterations by some makers of the Threepersons holster include a retaining  strap, the early originals including Threeperson's own holster never did. In fact it was Elmer Keith, who based his holster design on the Threepersons but added a retaining strap with snap as made by the old George Lawrence Co.

[Graveyard Jack]

Yep, it was Keith's #120 that added the strap to the Threepersons.

I don't know how easy it is to snag the trigger on a DA and cause it to go off. Proper fitment pretty much prevents the cylinder from turning and also negates the need for a strap. Properly fitted, the sixgun shouldn't fall out with the thong disengaged and THAT is infinitely quicker into action than any retention strap. The design has been in action long enough that any such shortcoming would've already been exposed and addressed by present makers like El Paso Saddlery.

[ChuckBurrows]

One thing to consider here is that a hammer thong or a strap is not just for retention of the revolver in the holster, but also to prevent the gun from being cocked. While I agree that a snug fit around the cylinder can minimize the cocking of the gun, it can happen and at times the gun is cocked only enough to let loose and spark off a round.
I had this happen many moon ago - my old three screw Ruger in 44 Mag went one time when the hammer got hung while mounting a horse - a wild ride ensued, but luckily no one was injured. IIRC something similar to my escapade was reported by Mike Venturino some time back. On the other hand a period holster can be built in suck a way as to obviate the problem of retention and keeping the hammer un-cocked.

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi,

My first buys went Will Ghormley ... as an active Reenactor in the 1850 Era I felt the pressure to arrive with a '58 Colt
and left vertical/cross-draw Main & Winchester ... which Mr. GHormley kindly provided.

Next I was fortunate enough to  Mr. Chuck Burrows into taking a trade knife from India, and by covering the handles and massively reworking the sheath, made it look as though some miner had spent his first poke in arming himself ...

I had I know ... in no time at all I had 3K in clothing and guns.

My humble thoughts;
1.) Get a copy of 'Packing iron'.... by begging, borrowing or outright stealing ... the price is more than you will pay for almostanything else ... it has museum quality photos of  leatherworkers, many of the holsters themselves.
2.)Talk to fellow shooters. They might have decided on the same rig originally, only to switch for a rig that was better in humidity or dust.Or just easier to pull from ...

3.) Just my $0 .02

[Black River Smith]

Well it took awhile but I decided on the holster pattern I would use.  I went with Will's Cheyenne holster and modified it for a Meanea look.  But I put time and effort into the Meanea welt; wider loops; and a toe plug(that I have never done before) therefore forgetting to modified Will's back panel.  Will pattern appears to use the Stohlmann method of transferring from trigger front to back rather than the wider trigger fold area of a Meanea holster.  I cut the leather before I realized this and the only thing I could do was taper Will's big corner.  See first attached picture.


During this timeframe I have been reading Elmer Keith's book and reflected on his chapter about holsters.  So I used the Stohlmann method and designed a modern streamline holster.  This one used the Meanea double recurve; Meanea welt and a rounded sewn toe (again something I never have done or ever thought I would desire on a holster).  It appears that I contradicted my own original posting with this holster style but I can agree with some of Keith's statements about weight for every day usage.  See second attached picture

[steve75]

Third holster I made was a Threepersons style holster for my S&W Model 65, sans safety strap/hammer thong.  The retention is incredible on that holster.  I was able to turn the holster upside down with the weapon in it.  The revolver remained secure even with shaking it.  The weapon was, of course unloaded, and the experiment was performed over a cushion as I did not want to damage my revolver.  After passing this test, I became worried about the retention effecting the draw.  I was pleased to find the draw crisp with the weapon quick into action.  The design was well thought out.  I liked it so much I made one for my Peacemaker.

It is however amazing that the most common issues identified is the lack of a safety strap, exposed trigger, and the potential for unintended discharge of the weapon.  This topic has even been addressed on leatherworker.net  Makes me wonder how many times someone like Threepersons had an unintended discharge of his weapon.