'73 carbine?

[yahoody]

I am thinking about getting a  19",   '73 carbine in 44-40, load it up with the original HV power loads and use it as a saddle gun for fun.

Thoughts?

[Mike]

Yahoody
I got a carbine 38WCF and i think it is a grate round and more people should try it. I still have seven 44WCF as well. 

[yahoody]

38wcf was my grandfather favorite round for his  '73 rifle and Bisley.  I still have both.

I don't own a 44-40 and thought it time.

[Pettifogger]

Depends on what you mean by "original HV power loads."  If you mean the High Velocity loads Winchester marketed many years ago the box specifically said not for the 73.  People couldn't read any better back then than they can now so Winchester discontinued them.

[yahoody]

Figure since the newest '73s will take 44 mag loads a 44-40 HV duplicate should be cake.

[Lefty Dude]

I own and shoot two 73 Uberti Carbines in 44WCF. I will not shoot HV in my Rifles. Standard loadings do just fine, thank you.

Get a 92 Rossi carbine in 44WCF if you want to Hot-Rod and play on the edge.

[yahoody]

"Beginning back in 1903, and for about the next 40 years, higher velocity .44-40 cartridges were offered for both the '94 Marlin and '92 Winchester. Catalog velocity was almost 1,600 f.p.s. with a 200 gr. jacketed bullet. Pressure was reported to be around 22,000 p.s.i. and therefore were not safe to be used in the '73 Winchester. "

" Original Winchester 73' 44-40 loads, pending powders, were 13-17 grains of a slow burning smokeless and produced between 1250-1300 ft/s."

44 magnum runs @ 36.000 psi per SAMMI spec.



"A picture of a Winchester WHV (Winchester High Velocity) box dated 1920.
Note the reference to '92 Winchester on the end. Ok for Marlin 1894's as well.

Instructions on the side indicate "They should never be used in Winchester '73 Rifles."
Also, in big letters: NOT FOR PISTOLS"


The old HV loads aren't hot rodding a new '73 by any means.

[cpt dan blodgett]

Asked, answered and answer rejected.  Request a signed letter from the manufacturer that the proposed load is safe in your rifle.  Seriously are you positive all action pins in your rifle match those in the Uberti 44 Mag 73??

[Mike]

My understanding is the Uberti 44 mag is a different gun from the standed 44 WCF 45 Colt gun.
Stronger construction.
The standed 44 WCF round is fine for me dont need to MAG it up,

[ndnchf]

I am thinking about getting a  19",   '73 carbine in 44-40, load it up with the original HV power loads and use it as a saddle gun for fun.

Thoughts?

You asked for opinions so...
If it's for a " a saddle gun for fun", what value will using the HV loads give you over standard 44WCF loads? Are standard loads not fun? For fun plinking, I cannot think of any advantage that is worth the extra strain and risk. Get a "92 if you really need the extra horsepower in order to have fun.

This from a guy who owns an original '73 carbine in 44WCF. My fun meter is pegged every time I shoot it with original style black powder rounds.

[Cholla Hill Tirador]

  I began my love of cowboy lever guns by buying a '73 short rifle in .44 Special, my favorite handgun cartridge. It was such a heavy little rifle though, so I sold it to fund the purchase of a Uberti carbine in .44 Magnum. It feels much lighter and is so much handier.

   I worked up loads in the .44 Special that ran into the 25,000 psi range, same as I use in my Ruger Flat Top Blackhawk .44 Special. Once I reached this pressure level I experienced a case head separation of two, so I backed off a couple of grains which would have put the loads probably in the 18-20,000 psi range. Everything was fine from then on. I attribute the case separations not to the strength or lack thereof of the action, but rather the skinny, unsupported bolt. Anyone familiar with and who have handloaded for the old British SMLE's know this problem well. Those rifles have a relatively small bolt that is supported by only one lug. This causes the bolt to flex which leads to premature case head separation. Just yesterday I was reading an article in an old handloader (1975)in which Ken Waters developed loads for the 38-40. He used an original '92 Winchester and even with that rifle experienced case head separations. He owed this to the bolt flexing under pressure.

  I've read a couple of articles/columns in Handloader and Rifle magazines in which they developed loads for the '73 Uberti's. In Handloader #261, the author tested some loads in the 45 Colt using AL2400 that exceeds "book" loads by about 10%. Likewise in Handloader #218 loads were tested in a '73 Uberti .44 Special that exceeded 15,000 psi loads by around 20% with Unique and 15% +/- with AL2400.

Undoubtedly todays '73's are infinitely stronger and safer than those made 130+ years ago as is evidenced by their chambering the .44 Magnum, and for that matter the .357 Magnum which operates at similar pressures. Is the.44 Magnum receiver some "special" hardened receiver? Probably, but one would think from a manufacturing standpoint the logical thing to do would be to make all the receivers to the higher standard.

If it were me, and I wanted to work up the 44-40, I'd do so slowly and carefully. I personally think the brass is going to go far, far before the rifle. Let's not forget that Uberti's, as well as all European manufactured firearms, are required to proofed with a load generating pressure 30% greater than CIP (Europe's version of SAAMI). So that means a 44-40 would have been proofed with a load generating roughly 17,000 psi.

Request a signed letter from the manufacturer that the proposed load is safe in your rifle.

Ha!! They won't even warrant their firearms if they've been fired with handloads!

Keep us posted. This sort of thing is interesting!

CHT

[Rowdy Fulcher]

Howdy
If you want the 44 mag velocities , why not buy the 44mag 73 ? Better safe than SORRY .

[Oregon Bill]

I'm thinking hard about a Uberti '73 carbine in .38 WCF. I am convinced it would have plenty of poop for short-range deer and hog hunting.

[Cholla Hill Tirador]

I'm thinking hard about a Uberti '73 carbine in .38 WCF. I am convinced it would have plenty of poop for short-range deer and hog hunting.

I recently picked up a couple of original '73's in 38-40; an '86 production and an '89 production. I loaded up some 180 gr. bullets with Pyrodex P and chrono'ed them, 1386 fps average. If that won't sail through a deer or hog, nothing will. If/when I ever hunt with mine, buy some of these 200 gr. flat nose bullets: http://beartoothbullets.com/bulletselect/index.htm

[Oregon Bill]

That Beartooth slug looks like the bee's knees for hunting applications.