Saddle Questions

[Ruff]

Howdy all,

Was killing some time piddling around on Ebay. Was looking at bedrolls and somehow ended up looking at saddles. Searched Western Saddles and then things got confusing. There was separate listing by size 15, 14, 17 and 18, also 17.5 and on. What do this mean? How do you tell what size you need? Next type. Pleasure, trail, barrel, cutting, roping, show and working. What is the best? Is there an all around style? Also the cost was all over there from $100 to about $790. That seemed low. I know that when I was surfing sometime ago I found some by CAS leather makers in the $1000's, is that due to style or what?

Thanks,

[St. George]

If you really want to get confused, start looking at 'Old West saddles and 'Military' saddles - the period ones are quite different from saddles available, today.

The numbers are seat sizes.

Period saddles oftentimes don't fit modern-day horses worth a damn, because of differing genetics making a better (and larger) horse - just like today's riders are by far larger than those old boys who rode the range.

Were today's average SASS shooters paired up with commensurate horses - they'd be riding Clydesdales...

The saddle types are for specific jobs - Barrel Racing, Roping, Working, Cutting - all are designed to keep the rider well-seated on the hurricane deck of a fast-moving pony.

If you 'just' want to ride - look at a Pleasure saddle, and check out local stables for a bargain.

If you 'really' want to dress and look the part, and ride an old-time one with a high pommel and high cantle, there are modern makers who will build one for you that'll look like the custom-built ones that Tom Selleck uses in his westerns, that'll fit today's modern horse.

Scouts Out!

[Freedom]

Size is reference to seat size...(it is more of a thigh size than a butt thing) a 15 inch is fairly small, say up to 160lbs. and a 17. 1/2 in is quite large. Many custom saddle makers will not build a saddle any larger than a 17in because it is not ethical for the horse. Every time you add and inch, it just moves the cantle back....it does not increase the length of the bars (the part that sets on the horses back) so when the cantle gets moved back to the end of the bars, the weight of the rider will drive the bar ends into the kidneys of the horse.

On price...Ebay saddles are usually junk. Many use cardboard, fabric, and plasitc in place of metal, wood, and leather

Cost to build a real saddle 1). 3 sides skirting leather.............$650
                                  2) Tree.............................$400-900
                                 3). Hardware, stirrups, conchoes etc...........$350
                                  4) Misl leathers, Sheep,latigo, string etc $200
                                  5) accessories........ This has no limit $$$$$$$$ But you will at least need cinches

So now you have a $1500 pile pf parts....and you still need to pay a skilled professional to assemble them.. this labor can run from 40 hours to 400. So what is a professionals time worth? So now "How in the world can they sell a brand new saddle for $400!!?


Style..trail/pleasure are usually lighter weight/duty.
Cutting has a real high horn and a FLAT seat! Not comfortable
 Show=fancy.
Roping saddles are usually not that comfortable and they have there riggin set wide...these are designed for an 8 second run and built to stand the pound of a rope coming tight on a steer/calf.

Working===these are designed to be lived in and will usually be heavy weight and duty ...but quite comfortable.

Here is a couple "Wade" styles that I have made. And yeah they were $1000'ss

This top one has an Elephant hide, padded inlaid seat

[Ruff]

Howdy St. George,

Thanks for the reply. Is there a horse bigger than a Clydesdale? That might be what I need.

I have looked at some of the old military saddles and they look uncomfortable.

I do like the look of the old style saddles and modern made seems to be the way to go. I am not sure I would ride a horse but would like to look the part.


Howdy Freedom,

Thank you for your reply. I really appreciate the info on the tree and the horses kidneys. An ethical question if I may. I am a big guy, 5"11" and 350 pounds. Am I too big to ride a horse?

As to the Ebay saddles I was just looking, killing time as it was. I figured I would get what I paid for if I bought one of the cheap ones. Although I may buy one just to display, but would like to find a nice old one to put in my future office.

Thank you for breaking the prices down of a saddle. A couple of questions if I can. Why is there such a wide range of cost for the tree? Is it material or size? I have had a look at Will Ghormley's website and the page with the trees, cool stuff. Also the accessories. I know the cinches are the straps that go under the horse and hold the saddle in place. I have seen pictures of another strap that goes around the horses chest/front. What other accessories are needed? Are we talking saddle bags, scabbards and such or something else?

I agree with getting and paying a professional for their time.

I checked out your website and really liked the last saddle pictured. Sort of reminds my of the one John Wayne used in his movies.


More Questions:

Where the old saddles carved or is that modern? I like the look of the modern made tooled saddles. but also like the more plain looking ones. Don't get me wrong I love to look at the works but am more of a plain guy. Besides I remember Louis L'Amour in Shalako I think it was talking about the generations and that the early one (first one) were not fancy, but the second one goes for tooled and conchoes.

What websites can I go to to look at period saddles? Give me your favorites. I am Googling period saddles and have found some good one.

Any books you suggest?

[Shotgun Franklin]

You might want to get together with some people who ride and see what they're doing. Look over some saddles. As a general rule you want a saddle big enough for you but for sure that will fit the horse's back. Your butt can adjust his back needs the best fit possible. I'm a big guy, 6' 8" and about 320. I ride a Belgian Mare. There are plenty of rideable big horses. Drafts tend to be laid back and easy to get a long with. Look a lot before you buy anything. IF you find the right horse then take the horse to the saddle and try it on him. Buying a saddle without trying it on the horse is kinda like buying mail order boots and guessing the size. There ain't nothing wrong with a well used, well maintained saddle.

[Freedom]

No way are you to big too ride horses....I would never tell anyone that. There is something so free and powerful about riding a horse I think everyone should have one.

Your riding style will play a large roll in your horses comfort...It goes without saying; Big Guy==Big Horse... But after that if you set up straight and "ride" you will keep weight in your stirrups. This is important because, no matter how big your seat is, the location of the stirrup leathers over the bars never changes. SO if you ride with longer stirrups and keep your weight on your feet with your shoulder more inline with your heals, you will be distributing your weight properly to the horses back.

If you shorten your stirrups and set flat back on your pockets, you will be setting your weight too far back and with a long 17"+ seat you will really grind the back bar points into your horses back and sore your horse.

[Trailrider]

Pay attention to the comments above, as I am NOT an expert, except for understanding that the "modern" horse is NOT the same as those from the 19th and early 20th Century. Just for historical information, the sizes of Army MaClellan Army saddles are different from civilian saddle measurements. The Army saddles came in sizes 11, 11-1/2 and 12, which bears little or no relationship to the sizes of civilian saddles. They were in fact, designed to be easier on the horse than the rider. Nevertheless, the Mac is NOT as uncomfortable for the rider as some folks think! I don't know about modern saddles, but for a trail ride, I prefer an Army saddle, so long as it has a fully covered tree. (Prior to about 1874 the rawhide covering the trees were not covered in leather, except for "fenders", and the rawhide covering, if gotten wet and dried, would often split, leaving sharp edges to irritate the rider's posterior.  Put one of these on a good riding mule, and the combination can't be beat, IMHO, for trail riding.

[David Carrico]

The McClellan saddle did come in 11, 11 1/2, and 12" seats.  This relates to about a 14 1/2"- 15 1/2" Western seat. It is just measured at a different location than the Western seats. If you measure a McClellan tree at the same points as a Western tree, this will give you more of a seat size that we are familiar with.

[GunClick Rick]

Well first, rub your butt with mud then sit on the wooden tree and shave wood till it fits comfy then start addin leather  and always remember "the best thing for the inside of a man is the outside of a horse" 

[Slamfire]

 Clint walker , aka, "Cheyenne Bowdie " perty fair size feller.








  Hootnix.