Anyone shoot a Chiappa 1892

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

I have never seen one... except pictures. Did a search (17 pages of comments too much to browse thru) only one came up.  I am interested in the rifle, but would like some comments from anyone who uses it.  My questions:  Is the Chiappa version more to the original Winchester versus the Rossi?  Is the action ROB like the Rossi and needs work?  I know the Chiappa is more expensive than the Rossi, but Rossi's craftsmanship in my opine leaves much to be desired (ROB).  Does the Chiappa '92 have that silly little thumb safety on top of bolt?  If the Chiappa action is hard and grinding... I would assume it can be "slicked" as similiar to the Rossi?  I am thinking of a Chiappa with Octagon 24" barrel in WCF 44-40 (comments) I am assuming that is fairly representative of the original.  I will assume the action follows JMB design as does the Rossi with some modifications???  I have never seen this rifle... I have a Rossi '92 sporting rifle 20" barrel that I have made "race ready" by changing certain springs and slicking the metal to metal inside the action.  Would like your thoughts on the Chiappa 1892.

[Marshall John Joseph]

The Chiappa is supposed to be a duplicate of the JMB design.  It does not have the Rossi safety.  The two that I have - a 45lc saddle ring Carbine and a 20" 44-40.  Both are smooth out of the box, not race ready.  Color case hardening, wood to metal fit is beautiful.  Great rifles.

I also have a Chiappa 1886 - absolutely georgous and rough as hell.  I sent it to Cody Conagher and it is still rough.  Need to put a major number of rounds through it to see if it loosens up.  Legacy Sports said they would take a look at it, but if Cody couldn't smooth it out?  I will only send it to Legacy if I get an absolute return date.

MJJ

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Marshall J. Joseph-  I thank you for the reply. I'm looking to get a Chiappa 20" or 24" barrel in 44-40.  I also have the Chiappa '86 and as you state the '86 is gorgous and they copied the real Winchester so very close, but they are not the smoothest when it comes to levering.  I have worked and worked on my '86 to smooth the "action"... it is a lot smoother but still hard to lever.  Do not know ifn you have fully disassembled the '86... it is only similiar to the '92 I am still working on it... the problem as I see it in the '86 has to do with the carrier. I just haven't figured out how to get to work smoother like my Rossi '92.  If you look under '76 Forum back about 2 years ago I posted my frustration with slicking the '86. But at present have not found the "key" to making it really "slick"... in due time I will.  You will find that there are no smitties out there that know dip about the '86... most of them just say "...it is not a main match rifle..."  leave it as is. But that is not my cup of tea.  If you disassemble be aware it is a bear to reassemble... the levering system has an S hook and it is a son of gun to get back in. I shoot mine in CAS Long Range and it is a GREAT SHOOTER, but it does lever hard. I will buy the Chiappa '92... Chiappa makes good products. Ifn you are interested email me at tjbynum@hotmail.com and I can fully update you on the '86. Thanks much...

[Marshall John Joseph]

Thanks for your reply.  I am not a gunsmith and would never attempt to take the '86 apart, especially after your experienced warning.  I thought the '86 and '92 were mechanically the same, the '86 on a larger scale.  Winchesters are smooth, so why can't its "exact copy" smooth?  I have not heard great things about Legacy Sports repair department, hence my reservation about sending it to them. 

Its going to take a mechanic to take an interest in this little problem and solve it.  Looks like you're nominated and elected  .

In any event, it is still a fine rifle, beautiful color, fit, and finish.  Just needs to be shot more to be broken in. 

Keep me posted on your progress.

MJJ

[Cliff Fendley]

My wife shoots a carbine, it is a more accurate reproduction than the Rossi. Is it better than the Rossi? A little bit, but they need work to get the action smooth. That or a lot of shooting to break it in.

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Cliff and Marshall JJoseph-  Did either of you have any action work done on the Chiappa '92?  I do not know about the Chiappa... but a Rossi '92 (ROB) sounds like an army tank when levering, and ifn you do not change any springs in the Rossi your ejected brass goes over into the next county.  Doing action work on the Rossi '92 is pretty straight forward and since it is not a "toggle linl" action.. it is really easy to slick one.. I will assume the Chiappa '92 to be no different?

For the Marshall:  With the '86... it does get a little better after much shooting, but it is still not to my likening.  I disassemble FULLY every 6 months and look to where there is binding on the metal to metal parts and this is where I "polish"... but since you do not do the full assembly... then there would be no reason for me to address that tirade...smile.  Disassembly for the '86 is not for the "faint hearted"... it can be very frustrating.

[Marshall John Joseph]

No work done on either of my '92s.  They work fine.  That's why I am surprised the '86 is so rough.  I did follow your '86 post regarding your smoothing of the action.   I have much respect for your talents and bravery.  If you ever find the cure, let us know.

MJJ

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Marshall J- I thank you in regards to the Chiappa '92... glad to hear they worked good ROB.  I know why the '86 is hard to lever... it is all in the way JMB designed action... the '92 unlike the '86 has two screws with tits to hold it in the receiver and as the lever goes forward up goes the carrier. The '86 is different in that respect to the '92. The '86 lever still pushes the carrier up when the lever goes forward, but the carrier is attached to the lever with a sort of S hook and there is a slider under the carrier all of this metal to metal ... there is friction IF those parts are not fully polished with some metal removed ... so as to make it slick when levering. Most Rossi's have a problem where as the carrier rubs against the right side of frame.  I have weakened the Main Spring and the Trigger Spring on the '86 and that helped tremendously when levering. But the action is STILL hard to lever. So every time I fully disassemble the '86 I remove more metal from that channel under the carrier where S hook rides. A little at a time, once removed you cannot put it back on. If you look down at the carrier when you lever you will see what I am speaking of. Another area where Chiappa could have helped was to make smoother would be the bottm side of the Bolt where it slides over the hammer when cocking... you will notice that as the bolt comes back to cock the hammer how hard it is to get the bolt over the hammer.  When I get it right... I will so inform... I will get it right at some point.  But I can see why gunsmiths do not want to work on the '86's... few to none know anything about them.  Ifn I was you I would not send my gun to Legacy. My opine.

[Cliff Fendley]

Hers was rough at start and got better the more she shot it. I decided to have it worked on but then when we got it back it was failing to set off some primers so I put the main spring back stock.

Wound up doing a little slicking on it myself and lighted/adjusted the main spring just a little but still made sure it would shoot all primers.

The stacking of the main spring has the hammer riding under the bolt still pretty stiff and making the action a little stiffer than I would like but it's pretty darn smooth now.

All in all don't know if they are that much better than a Rossi but they are more correct looking because they don't have that safety button and it is a better looking rifle than the Rossi, fit and finish wise.

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Response to Cliff Fendley-  Do not know who worked on your '92...not important..if the Chiappa is like the Rossi.. he cut off too many coils on the hammer spring.  Ifn you want to make your Chiappa '92 smoother in the levering... You need to remove metal from the bottom side of the bolt where it slides over the hammer. If the Chiappa bolt is like the Rossi '92 bolt that portion that slides over the hammer has an arch in it and arch needs to be taken down some.  And the front top edge of the hammer where the bolt slides over the hammer when cocking... needs to be rounded slightly. What I did to the bottom side of the bolt of my Rossi was start with 100 grit emory and work up to 2000 grit (do not use a dremal tool, it removes too much metal). Remove metal from just the center portion bottom side of bolt... with the 100 grit till you get the bolt sliding over the hammer nice and smooth so that there is no binding when levering. Once that is done work up to 2000 grit so that the bottom side center of the bolt looks like a mirror. Each grit up from the 100 will remove the marks by the previous grit..when you get to the 2000 grit level the bolt bottom center will look like a chrome bumper and the levering will be slicker than a '73 that has been short stroked. For the rails on the side of the bolt I would start with 400 grit and work up to the 2000 grit. That will make levering so much easier. I have never worked on a Chiappa '92 but what you have stated is what my Rossi did (ROB). For the Main Spring I installed a Lee Gunslinger spring for the Rossi '92 and i removed 3 to 4 coils. I removed all burrs from inside the frame and bolt channels and replaced ejector spring with a weaker spring. My '92 Rossi is really slick and is now a FUN GUN TO SHOOT. Pictures below show my Rossi.

[Cliff Fendley]

Tom, that bump under the bolt is EXACTLY where the problem is.. but I didn't know if it could be leveled out. If not for that the gun would be smooth as glass.

The Chiappa has a flat main spring, not coils. It is adjustable just like a 73 and I have it backed off as much as possible and still have dependable ignition of all primers. Overcoming the mainspring with that bump is exactly the problem. I did also narrow and thin the mainspring some which helped a bunch but when the hammer gets back to that point it's still really 'stacking' the spring and it's farther than the hammer needs to go to get to the full cock notch.

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Cliff...
Glad that my anyalysis was correct. Dissassemble the rifle and put the bolt in a "padded vise" and take a flat peice of wood the width of the center part of the bolt (that portion that rides over the hammer).  Go to Lowes and get sandpaper starting with grit 80 / 100 / 115 / 120 / 150 / 180 / 220 / 350 / 400 / 600 / 800 / 1200 / 2000... using the wood wrap the end with a cut peice of sandpaper starting with grit 80. start rubbing where the hump is and extent forward (towards the front of bolt) the 80 grit will cut the metal better than starting with 100 grit. Doing this way you do not have to worry about removing TOO MUCH METAL as you would with a dremal. Work on the hump to lower it. sand and reassemble the bolt into frame and work lever. Keep doing this with the 80 grit till you lower the hump enough for smooth levering. Once you reach that point... then using the wood guide work up to the 2000 grit to FULLY POLISH that portion of the bolt bottom where it slides over the hammer.  Use a flat DIAMOND FILE to round the TOP FRONT EDGE of the HAMMER and then polish the front top edge of Hammer to remove the filing marks. Clean the bolt of all residue and the hammer. Use a little WHITE LITHIUM gun grease on the rails of the bolt and on the bottom side of bolt and reassemble. Rifle will be slicker than goose grease.... This is a long process of sanding and reassembling to get it right... After you do that you will be truly satisfied knowing you did it. The rifle will be more fun to shoot and I gaurantee you it will be slicker than any '73 with all the bells and whistles. I will post pictures later of a Rossi bolt that has been worked so you can see.

[Cliff Fendley]

As a knifemaker 2000 grit is just the start of my polishing process, heres what I call fully polished.





Getting the 92 to be as smooth as my 73 is going to be a real stretch, I don't see that happening but I would like to improve it a bit more.

What is the purpose of the hump under the bolt, is it just to keep the action open?

[Ford D. River]

Yes, the bump holds the action open.  You can minimize it.  Makes a big difference.