Frame on 1872 open tops is cupped around the fining pin hole and causing issues.

[G.W. Strong]

I shoot my open tops with 30 grains of fffg Goex or Kik. I cast big lube 44 Mav Dutchman bullets cast with a scrap alloy. I lube them with a beeswax and olive oil homemade lube.  I love the load and the guns. 

[rifle]

Hopealong, I should have remembered that I read about what you shoot in some other thread. Thanks fer answering my question. You have a good load I'd say. "Scrap alloy" must be the same as "economical alloy" so that's a good decision. I prefer the pure lead as I said somewhere but.......that's because I suffered the heart wrenching emotional upset of having barrels crack so now I'm picky about hard bullets in these guns. I'm just eccentric though since I figure the guns can take even hardcast bullets. I thunk the barrel crackin thing was a short run problem and since the new barrels I got to replace the cracked ones had "thicker" forcing cone bottoms at that "milled spot" that is there so the "barrel arbor hole bushing" can get in the hole. Uberti should do away with that bushing altogether. When I fit the new barrels to the guns I had to turn the cylinder bushing down to get the barrels over it. Anywhooooo.....I've shot more than a few rounds thru the 44 and the 45 new barrels and they are still fine.
I shoot the FFg since I discovered the FFFg can ,at times, be erratic and ,in some guns....not all(according to a loading manual or two) spike the pressure for some reason. I know the FFFg can do that from an experience way long time ago with my Uberti Cattleman in 45 Colt. I overly compressed(I assume anyhow) the FFFg (ran out of FFg) black powder loads to get some wads or whatever in the cases and.......
The area in the chambers under the cylinder notches was pushed up. In all six chambers there's a shallow area pushed up that the cases would swell into and stick in the chambers. i had to get a new cylinder for that gun because of the FFFg and the compression. Maybe it would have done the same thing with FFg and the compression. I just figger that if I see that FFFg pressure spike in the loadin book I'm better off stickin to ffg. I used to read a lot of gun magazines and over the last few decades I've read where the FFg is the right thing to use in carts usin black.  I thunk it may be the standard deviation from shot to shot that was one culprit. On the other hand I know the pistols like the faster powder since thay have short barrels.
Anywhooooo if ya go way back it was a known or accepted thing that FFg was the thing fer pistol carts. Trends change though. I've seen plenty of that. People use FFFg more now a days and have no apparant problem with it so.....I may as well "shut the heck up" right? May be ,just may be, 30 gr. FFFg and the Mav Dutchman 44 could be compressin a little too much. I get 25 gr. FFg and a thin lube pill(lube wad) in my 44 Specials with some compression. That's with a 200gr. RCBS "Cowboy" moulded bullet. Anywhooooo....I can't say if 30gr. FFFg and the MD Big Lubber 44 would be compressin too much. It's a thought though. Maybe the cupped firing pin hole area was caused by the FFFg in 30gr. and the MD BL bullet? Just graspin at straws here. Maybe goin to less than 30gr. and switchin to FFg just for the heck of it wouldn't be a bad ide-eeeer.
Abilene,thanks fer reminding me about that rebated/non rebated cylinder thing. I should have been aware enough to be specific and say I was talkin bout the 1860 type Richads Mason in 38 caliber and it's non rebated cylinder. I wish Uberti would have made the 1860 RM in 38 on the 1860 frame and use the 1860 rebated cylinder. I'd like that better than if they shortened the barrel of the 1860 in 38 and called it a 1861 Colt because of the non rebated cylinder. Maybe that is what it is supposed to be?
I'd like to get one of the 1851 RM's fer my collection and your reply reminded me about that. Next time I'm somewhere there is one fer sale my credit card is gonna be flyin out of my back pocket.

[Fox Creek Kid]

I have two early Uberti '72 OT's, one from the first batch in country in the Fall of '99, and I have had recoil plates machined into the breech faces of both. However, the Colt SAA uses a recoil plate approx. 0.090" thick which is too thick for the OT breech face, i.e., not enough "meat" there. My '60 RM in .44 Colt had to have the breech face welded up from peening as it also is too thin there for a recoil plate.

This is not uncommon for CF guns of then and now. All modern CF revolvers have recoil plates, even Rugers. The idea was first used by S&W in their Russian models as suggested by the Russian advisors. 

[The Coconino Pistolero]

I have a pair of Cimarron .44 Colt Opentops with a frame problem.  These pistolas are consecutive serial numbers 81xx bought used on the Wire; these pistols had not been shot much from the condition.  I have had them about 3 years and have about 1000 rounds through them.  Ammunition was mostly BP with a 200 gr Big Lube bullet .44 Russian 21 gr KIK and .44 Colt 23 gr KIK.  I did shoot 200 rounds of Black Hills .44 Colt ammo that I got a good deal on.  The .44 special case will not fit.


Here are pictures of brass and frames:





So what gunsmith does this work?

CP

[G.W. Strong]

I carefully hammered mine out from the backside on the surface of a smooth anvil. I make sure the wedge is not overly tight and they have worked like a dream ever since. If you need that done, I can give you more specific info or I could do it for you.

[The Coconino Pistolero]

Howdy Hopalong,

Send me an IM and I would like to learn how to do this before going the welding or recoil plate route.

CP

[G.W. Strong]

I will post the instructions here. Others may want to know. I will take a few pics tomorrow of the process for clarity.

[RRio]

Has this condition showed up on any .38 Specials?   

[River City John]

Has this condition showed up on any .38 Specials?  

I've been shooting my Uberti 1999 manufacture Open Top in .38sp for some dozen years and no sign of this. I did have to have the firing pin replaced after two years as it mushroomed. A properly hardened pin was installed.

Best natural pointer I've owned, with exception of the Leech & Rigdon.

RCJ

[Thomas (Tom) Horn aka James Hicks]

Late Post to this Topic-

I had the same problem "firng pin hole cupping" but not with open tops. It happened on one of my Uberti '73 Cattleman 4.75" barrel. It happened at a CAS shoot... fired two rounds and the cylinder locked up tighter than dicks hatband. At first I thought it was the primers causing the problem... but on inspecting the pistol with a bright light I still could not see it with naked eye.. I then ran a flat diamond file over the firing pin hole and you could see the "outward pucker" not much, but enough to cause the pistol to jam.  I have 6 uberti's (4 in cattleman models old frames) and 2 smoke wagon's. None of the others have had this problem, only the one that is in 4.75" barrel.  I filed the pucker out with the diamond file and the problem disappeared.  It has not reoccured since I filed the pucker out.  So it does happen and it is not just the Open Tops !

[The Coconino Pistolero]

Per Rifle's discussion back in June, I got some Peacemaker recoil plates (after some backorder delay).  Now the problem is finding a gunsmith willing and able to do the work of milling a hole, press fit the plate and crimp the plate in per Kuhnhausen.  Preferably in AZ but will send them to whomever will fix them.

[The Coconino Pistolero]

I have the pistols back from the gunsmith with the recoil plates installed.  Yeehaw!

Will test them with smoky and smokeless ctgs this week and report on the smithing and shooting shortly