Who Killed Pat Garrett?

[Delmonico]

I always thought the best of the "Old West" gunfighters was Tom Horn, or at least one of the smartest, take off boots, sneak up and shoot them from a safe distance with a rifle.  Sounds sensible to me, in fact I belive Ned Huddleson/Isom Dart was shot by Tom while he was peeing also.

[Will Ketchum]

I always thought a peeing man makes a good target.  They tend to stand still and don't make any
unexpected moves .

On the other hand when I was first in SE Asia I wouldn't do number 2  in the bush because I didn't want to get shot with my pants down.  That went out the door when dysentery struck and I went just about everytime my left foot hit the ground, or so it seemed .  I took care of that by removing the seam in my trousers so I didn't have to pull them down y that time modesty was long gone.

Will Ketchum

[CanChaserKate]

It was Wayne Brazel. I know, that Man is my Cousin; This is what is Handed down as Truth in my Family, and I am Damn Grateful to him for Killing Pat who Needed Killing, as he Killed Billy who hurt No one unless they threatened him and/or his Family.

[Delmonico]

Funny, the two deputies the so-called inocent man killed in his escape most likely didn't need killin'.  Two leagal deputies killed while guardin' a prisoner? 

No matter what happened before the trial, all reasons to say he was not a cold blooded killer ended that day.

As for family legonds, I learned a long time ago with out documentation or logic reason, they hold little weight in historic disscussions.   So give the reasons, besides family stories you think he is the killer.

[CanChaserKate]

Well, I believe so not just because of Family story, but that Wayne and Billy's Wife Abrana were Cousins, and Wayne and the rest of the Family would have Done Anything for Billy and to Defend Abrana's Honor.
The Family is Indeed Close, and would do Anytihng to Avenge something as this.

[Delmonico]

Family oral history with out documentation is no proof of anything.  Pat Garret was a sherrif elected by the pepole, huntin' down the killer of 2 sworn law enforcement officers killed in the line of duty by someone some folks say was innocent, but the killing of the 2 deputies to allow himself to escape raises doubts in my mind of any "innocence" before and if he was before it turns him in to a no good killer afterward.  Just like any one today who would kill to escape.

Funny how today many homicidal manics from the past are thought up as heros.  Hope none of our's from today get the same treatment in 125 years.

[Second Creek Sam]

Back shot?  Sounds like a Pinkerton to me...

[Uncle Eph]

well said Del, well said.

[CanChaserKate]

O.k. I not just have Family Story to back this up, but think of it this way, Wayne had Motive, Opportunity, and Means.

Means: had the Gun right there in front of him (Family Story).
Motive: Billy, His Cousin Abrana's Husband was Killed (Family Honor to Restore) also Money over a Dispute gone Bad.
Opportunity: Pat was Taking a Whiz by the Carriage.
I can get more on this from at least two Books I Own that tells more to this.

[Delmonico]

28 years, I doubt it very much.  Check the dates. Post the evidence.  Sounds like a family legand, similar to urban legands.

[TheGLOV]

28 years, I doubt it very much.  Check the dates. Post the evidence.  Sounds like a family legand, similar to urban legands.

I shot the sheriff, but I did NOT shoot the deputy. - JJ Cale

Sorry, I just had to. 

-TheGLOV

[GunClick Rick]

Crap i use both hands to pee

[liten]

billy the kid killed pat garrett

[yeti76620]

billy the kid killed pat garrett

Dang Hollywood....I thought it was the other way around......       ......     

Yeti76620

[Dead I]

It was Wayne Brazel. I know, that Man is my Cousin; This is what is Handed down as Truth in my Family, and I am Damn Grateful to him for Killing Pat who Needed Killing, as he Killed Billy who hurt No one unless they threatened him and/or his Family.

As I recall, after Garrett's death, Brazel married and his wife died soon thereafter.  Then he disappeared.  Do you know where he went?  Gardner in his new Billy/Pat book leans toward Killer Miller as the man who popped the cap on Garrett. Whether or not Garrett needed kill'n because he killed the Kid I don't know, but  he did kill a lot of men.  Folliard, Bowdre and the Kid for three. I think he killed a few more. The Kid wouldn't hesitate to pull the trigger.  Neither did Pat.

[litl rooster]

Crap i use both hands to pee

braggert

[litl rooster]

Back shot?  Sounds like a Pinkerton to me, now what was Will's alibi again?

This fits their M.O. but there was no reward for it.

[Dead I]

This fits their M.O. but there was no reward for it.

Pinkerton men did not shoot people in the back.  It was below them.  Rather they'd throw a stick of dynamite into their mother's home and blow her arm off. Much classier. They might drop a bomb down a chimney.  They'd do that too.  Cool guys those Pinkerton dudes. 

They were particularily good at estimating the number of Confederate troops which they provided to Gen. McClelland. Luckily he ignored their numbers and attacked Richmond, thus ending the Civil War in 1862.  It could have been so much worse. 

[Delmonico]

Pinkerton men did not shoot people in the back.  It was below them.  Rather they'd throw a stick of dynamite into their mother's home and blow her arm off. Much classier. 

I would guess you are referring to Jesse James' mother.  Please get your facts straight, all accounts I've ever seen says it was a metallic object thrown through a window.  Pinkerton's say it was a smoke bomb, who knows for sure at this point, but no matter what it was, throwing it in the fireplace was not the brightest idea.  No down the chimney, no dynamite, except perhaps in a dime novel.