H & R Trapdoor Trigger Play

[Bad Shot]

Should the trigger move freely on an H & R Trapdoor Carbine when it is fully cocked or uncocked?  I am looking at one, but the fact that the trigger will move under these conditions is giving me pause.  The carbine in question looks to be unfired and the trigger mechanism otherwise appears to function fine.  As you can probably tell, I know virtually nothing about Trapdoors.   I have wanted one since I first saw them advertised in gun magazines back in the early 70s and this one looks to be a nice one. 

Thanks

[Tater Pickens]

Bad Shot,

I have an original 1884 Trap Door rifle and it has free travel in the trigger when fully cocked. I can only assume that to be normal in that my rifle is the only one I have ever handled. I simply just take up the slack and then pull the rest of the way when I am ready to fire.

Tater Pickens

[St. George]

This is called 'military slack' and is present in all military longarms.

It's there so the piece doesn't discharge involuntarily when the Trooper is in action.

My H&R Officer's Rifle - arguably H&R's top of the line Trapdoor - features the same slack.

Concentrate on your sight picture - regulate your breathing - let half out - take up the slack - and try to let the hammer fall as a 'surprise' and you'll be well-pleased with the weapon.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[Major 2]

You'll find the same slack in the Springfield Musket the action is based on...it is as St. G states.

There was two versions of the carbine the Cavalry model and the plain, The Cavalry model will have the adj. Trapdoor sights and (as on mine, Gold leaf inlay Cavalry Modelmarkings)
The other plain model will iron open sights.
Then there was the Officer Rifle Model which had a some what longer barrel & Pewter nose cap, checkering  & cleaning rod under the barrel.

It's a great shooter...and has direct lineage to the originals in that they were produced on the same Stock lathes H&R acquired from the Gov. Arsenal as well as the same gauges.

[Bad Shot]

Thanks for your responses. 

I am familiar with two-stage military triggers; I own about a dozen WWII - vintage military rifles. This H & R is different than most of those triggers in that its trigger will freely "swing" back and forth, like a pendulum, if the gun is moved in the cocked and uncocked positions. 

In fact, it behaves just like my No. 4 Lee-Enfield does under the same circumstances.   It does not stay in place the way that my 98Ks and 03A3 will under the same circumstances.  The 98K and 03A3 triggers have slack, but don't move freely like this H & R Trapdoor and my Lee-Enfield. 

Does this make sense and describe the free play you folks have in your H & R triggers?

By the way, this Trapdoor is marked "Cavalry Model." It's all blued and has the open sights.

It was very interesting to learn that H & R used the same stock lathes and gauges as Springfield. I have also read that some parts were surplus.  The upper band on this one has a the letter "U" stamped on it, which, if I'm not mistaken, is a Springfield Armory acceptance or proof mark.

Thanks.

[Rebel Dave]

The "U" on the bbl band stands for  "UP", which is to indicate the correct way to install the band. The open end of the "U" should point toward the muzzle when reinstalling the band. There are no original Government inspector markes on H&R trapdoors.

The slack in the trigger is normal, on trapdoors and muskets. The internals of the lock, the sear, and the trigger, are to separate pieces. The trigger pushes up on the sear, when you pull it, and that action releases the tumbler, allowing the hammer to go forward. they all have some amount of slack.

Take it out and shoot it, they are fun. Don't use modern hi power ammo, as the trapdoors are a weak action, and are ment for black powder, or black powder type presure loads only.

Rebel Dave

[Major 2]

I have a little book around here someplace ("digging, searching, looking for it)
Springfield Trapdoor Collector Handbook
It state's H&R produced these guns using the lathe's & gauges, it does not mention is any parts were surplus.
However, it does mention when H&R folded , Navy Arm's Val Forgett acquired the equipment.
Now, that same equipment is at Petrosoli....

The book also mentions more than a few H&R era stocks with the correct in-circled C found their way on to original actions.
Many, beater stocked guns were sold with these newer manufacture stock to unwary collectors 

[Bad Shot]

I would like to find a copy of that book and also thank everyone that replied.  I learned a lot. 

I did buy this carbine, by the way.  Other than some minor dings and scratches, it appears to be new.  I don't believe it has ever been fired.  My original intent was to save my money and buy a Springfield version someday.  When this one crossed my path for $350, I figured the smart thing to do was to buy it.