First 10ga reload: does this look right? (UPDATED AGAIN)

Mossyrock · April 12, 2009, 10:26:14 PM

While I have loaded several hundred 12ga BP loads in Mag Tech brass cases, these are my first BP loads of any kind in standard cases, and first 10ga loads, specifically. The load consists of Remington primed 3.5" hulls, shortened to 2 7/8". I added 2 1/2 drams of Goex ffg followed by a nitro card and a 1/2" lubed fiber wad, both of which were compressed with 80 pounds of pressure (measured using a dowel and a bathroom scale...real high tech). I topped it off with 1 1/4 ounce of number nine shot (all I had on hand except for 00 buck), and sealed with with an overshot card and a roll crimp. I can see where loading these things by hand without a press can be pretty time consuming....and S-L-O-W.

I think the roll crimp looks a little strange. It is holding the overshot card just fine, but, like I said, it looks a little weird. Thoughts? Opinions? Comments?

Sir Charles deMouton-Black · April 12, 2009, 11:08:03 PM

The roll-crimp looks just fine, to me. The slight bulges in the case body look a bit like too much pressure on the load. I'm not really much of an expert but I think the round will work just fine by drop-tubing the powder and using less muscle on the wad column.

Dick Dastardly · April 13, 2009, 08:40:31 AM

I wouldn't cut your first load, but that would show the question, if any, about the slight bulge just above the powder. I'm wondering if the Remington reifenhausen (sp) type hulls may be slightly tight for the 10ga over powder nitro card? The crimp will work fine. If the round chambers well the bulges will go away when it goes boom.

As Sir Charles mentioned, you may be a mite less aggressive with the pressure and make sure it is in line. I use a MEC 600 Jr. Mk-V to load my 10ga bp shells. The pressure is set to around 50 pounds. You want a nice snug wad column, but if it is compressed too much you will start to see bulges.

Also, since I use lubed (my own lube) fiber wads to ease cleanup, I don't compress with the rammer directly. I put a carriage bolt inside the rammer and compress with it. The result is a slightly cup shaped wad with very even compression. If I don't use the carriage bolt inside the rammer tube the lubed wads will soon plug the tube and I won't get reliable powder and shot dropping.

Good on you Mossyrock! You're well on your way to some happy big smokey BOOMS.

DD-DLoS

Jamie · April 13, 2009, 09:23:20 AM

Just a thought on the wads and the bulges - depending on the source, and maybe the time frame - it might be valid. At any rate, I think that the Dixie cataloge (I can NEVER spell that freaking word! Arghhhhhh (sp?)) At any rate I'm sure that it's in Dixie, and I've read it elsewhere as well that wad size is for the most part based on muzzleloading caplock or flintlock smoothbore dimensions, and that, while the brass shotgun shell is thin walled and will take a 10 gauge fiber wad perfectly, the plastic shell is thicker, and therefore requires (ideally) an 11 gauge wad for proper sizing. Obviously DD and others in the forum have loaded far more shells than I have, but in the 12 gauge shells I loaded for an old hammer double I definately found the same problem using 12 gauge wads. I don't know what negative effects it would have, maybe a tick more pressure, or a bit more pressure required to seat the shell in the gun - maybe nothing at all, but just thought I'd toss it into the mix. I thought the roll crimp looked great!
Jamie

Mossyrock · April 13, 2009, 07:15:22 PM

Even with the obvious bulges, it dropped right into the chamber of my 10ga Field Rival.

As for the 11ga wad, I was kind of wondering about that... Dick, what are your thoughts on using a lubed 11ga wad? Even though it is a 10ga, the bores on my gun measure out at 11ga....kinda like a modified choke the full length of the tubes.

Dick Dastardly · April 13, 2009, 08:54:16 PM

If they work better in your loads, use 11 ga wads. They'll sqoush out and fill the chamber just fine. I load mostly the brown Federal hulls and the 10ga work fine there. I wish Magtech made all brass 10ga hulls. . . .

DD-DLoS

TAkaho kid · April 13, 2009, 08:55:12 PM

Mossy Rock,

I would loose the nitro card and go with a .070 paper card over the powder. I found those hard Nitro cards add a lot of weight to the load column and they blew holes in the pattern. In addition at 25 yards they were going through the light ply backstop!! To take-up the space add another .030 or .070 wad on top of the 1/2" wad. You can also go with a .070 overshot card.

Looking at the crimp I would try to get a bit more material to roll. As for compression 80 lbs is overkill. 40 is plenty

You will get a slight bump in the hull from the card wad.

With 2-1/2 drams I would suggest going to a 2-5/8" hull then you can cut down on the wads and the shot charge.

Mason Stillwell · April 13, 2009, 08:59:13 PM

Hello Mossy Rock.
I have also gotten into the 10 gauge game. I am gonna try the glue the over the shot wad method. I am just not sure how far down in the hull I need to leave the shot column.

I was kinda thinking on some Brass hulls but have not found any 10 gauge ones.
I did order some Federal plastic hulls that are primed from Ballistic Products.

Mercy ain't this fun?

Yer loads look fine to me . If in they fit in the chambers and go BOOM and take down the targets that is all a person can ask for LOL

Later Mason.

TAkaho kid · April 14, 2009, 07:24:41 AM

Mossy Rock,

This is 12 gauge paper but it gives you a good idea of how that roll crimp works. Note how the top edge is tucked under.

P.S. Don't try sectioning a live cartridge at home!

Mossyrock · July 04, 2009, 03:04:37 PM

Gentlemen;

In honor of Independence Day, I took my 10ga out into the back yard and rattled some windows!

I never did shoot the loads pictured above...something about them just bothered me. The loads I shot today were using the same Remington hulls I used before, 100gr of ffg, a .070" card over the powder with a 1/2" 11ga lubed fiber wad (compressed to 40 pounds) and 10 pellets of 00 buckshot. This time, the roll crimp was picture perfect...almost too pretty to shoot! $:-\$ But, shoot them I did! Since this was the maiden voyage of a vintage Damascus barreled shotgun, I had my wife standing by in case we needed to call 911.

But, those fears were unwarranted as my Field Rival 10ga handled the charges with aplomb! (As opposed to a-bomb...) I have to admit that the recoil was not nearly as bad as I was expecting. I am sure some of you have loaded heavier charges in a 2 7/8" 10ga hull, but I sure don't know how the heck you got it to fit!!

Well, the Pandora's Box is opened, and experimentation will continue. This is FUN! I am still on the constant lookout for a Colt 1878 or Remington 1889 10ga in good condition. Why a ten gauge? 'Cuz I can't find or afford an EIGHT gauge!!

WOO-HOO! Wart Hogs Are Us!!

Mako · July 05, 2009, 02:22:16 PM

Woooo Hoooo! I love a happy ending! I read to the end and was rewarded...

Many happy days of shooting my friend.

~Mako

Smokin Gun · July 06, 2009, 12:28:05 AM

I like the siound of 10 gauge :O) 8 guage now that's more than I need...well want. I got a 10ga SxS Muzzle Stuffer Pedersoli that I have got to get out and try ... did you know Jack Rabbits run a Hare slower in the summer heat of the Desert? Well they do and so do I... lol!

Mossyrock · August 22, 2009, 10:03:29 AM

UPDATE: I ordered some brass 10ga hulls from Rocky Mountain cartridge...and the wait begins. It appears that he is running a couple of months behind. The funny thing is, I ordered the hulls on a Friday, and on Saturday I went to a gun show. This might very well have been the BEST gunshow I have ever attended as far as actually FINDING what I went looking for! First off, I found two original WWI Colt 1911 safeties in good condition (another disease...), 13 original brass Remington-UMC 12ga hulls (!) for my 1889 Remington hammer double, an EIGHT GAUGE round for $2.00(!!!) and one, count 'em ONE, Rocky Mountain cartridge brass 10ga hull!!! Throw good friends and a good cheeseburger into that, and it makes for a mighty fine day!!

Oh, and in case anyone was wondering, I had my 10ga Damascus Field Rival hammer double Magnafluxed, and she came out with flying colors...no detectable flaws in the Damascus welds! Of course, I broke the lever return spring the day I got the barrels back, so it is at the gun doctor's getting a new spring made.

Have no fear, though...she has a big brother coming by pony express as I type this. How about a 10ga Colt 1878 with 30" barrels?

Stand by for news.....

TEXAS SARGE · August 23, 2009, 04:42:20 PM

Hey Mossyrock

The wait is well worth it for anything from Rocky Mountain Cartridge. Was up in Cody Wy. the week before last at his shop and he gave us a tour, very impressive for a one man shop. I had purchased 45-60's two and a half years ago and ordered more while I was there. He works orders with the size brass stock that he is running and is quite time involved to change brass stock size for small orders, so thats why it takes a little longer to get to your order unless you just hit it right. He probably will be doing 45-75 when he does the 45-60's.They are not the least expensive cases but well worth the price and the wait.

Best of luck

Texas Sarge

Pulp · August 31, 2009, 02:33:21 AM

They look better than mine

I don't have any 10 gauge loading tools, so after inserting the overshot card I run them into a Lee Load All 12 gauge crimp starter just to bend them over a bit.