BPC load

[Cherokee Bodie]

This past weekend I shot my first meet where all of my rounds were ones that I loaded. I was very pleased with the results and I thought everything went great except for a few misses. Of course there was no wind and the smoke just hung there so how could they be sure it was a miss. Anyway that another story. But on the reloading I'm getting different opinions and wondering what I should do. I used a hoter load then I was told to use and that being 30 G of Triple 7. I pulled the lead from bp cartridge that had been loaded for me by a pro reloading guy and the BP was about 20 grain and was far from touching the pill. When I loaded, even using 30 grain, if the lead touch the powder it was just barely. I think if I went to 35 grain it would load with some compression which is how it should be according to what I am reading on here and also in Lymans Reloading manual. My question is if I stay with 30 G should I add some grits or something to get the right compression? Does it really make a difference about the compression. I shoot W3G and SASS so perfect loads are not nesassary but I like hot loads in my SSA 44/40's W/7 1/2" barrels. Using 200 grain bullet until my molds get in, then 215. I want to go more toward original then competitive. Smoke, fire and kick like a mule, I love it .Also use same rounds in my Henery's and have a couple mule ear doubles of which one is a working original (full length, not a coach gun) that I use when shooting fronter (cap & ball) .  PS my Triple 7 was all in FFF. Thanks in advance for any help or advice you can give me on this. Only 2 1/2 years in the sport so still a new comer.
Cherokee Bodie
aka Bill

[Dalton Masterson]

Howdy Cherokee! You definately want compression in your black powder or substitute loads. You can add a filler like grits, caulk backing rod, etc.
The easiest way, at least for me loading 45s, is to fill the case with powder, add a bullet and go. Is around 30-35 gr.

I always figured if I wanted a lighter load, I can:
A. go to a shorter case like a 45 Schofield or the like, or
B. Change my bullet weight
I shoot full case 45 Colts in my rifle, and full case 45 Colts in my pistols. Depending on what class I am doing, I change the Schofields between 150 gr EPP/UG and 200 gr Big Lube bullets. The rifles get a steady diet of 200 gr Big Lubes.

Now your 777 powder is a bit hotter than standard powder, so if you want to stick with a substitute powder, maybe go with Pyrodex or American Pioneer, which is very light shooting. Then you can fill the case, and noone should complain about speeds. I would think you are legal speedwise anyway, using a heavier bullet.
Good luck. I am sure the others will chime in. DM

Addendum to What Wills Point Pete said. I do believe that 777 is not recommended to compress, but you dont want air in the load either. Check their website and find out for sure.

[Wills Point Pete]

 Mostly folks like to fill the case with more powder but there are all kind of ways to get proper compression.

Of course proper compression is mostly a matter of opinion. As long as there is no empty air space, that's proper compression. Most Pards like a sixteenth or an eighth inch of compression. Now back before I ever heard of cartridge collecting I shot and pulled bullets from a quite a few original rounds. I have had powder just trickle out and other loads had the powder jammed solid and I had to dig it out with a sharp stick.

I've loaded a lot of .45 Colts with 28 or 30 grains of fffg and ffg. Then I filled the airspace with a grease cookie. Then when I got my Big Lube Boolit mold I loaded that same charge and filled the case with dry grits. Six to one, half dozen to the other. My nod goes to the Big Lube and grits but only because the grease cookie is kind of slow to put together. I never could shoot well enough to tell the difference on a target.

Now the amount of powder is up to you. The original load .45of forty grains og powder and a 250 grain bullet is difficult to load because modern cases won't allow it without using a drop tube and then very heavy compression. Nowadays 35-37 grains of real black is a lot easier. But then the Army beat the Apaches with 28-30 grains.

Same for the other ca'tridges. If your bullet carries enough lube for a full match, grits is fine to fill the empty space of a lighter load. If you start having a bit of a problem, fill that empty space with a grease cookie. Your gun will tell you what it likes.

As an aside we like to talk about "authentic loads". Well there were a lot of British revolvers in the old west. Many of those old guns shot 200-27- grains of lead over what we call very small charges, say 16-18 grains of Black. Yet the Brits took India, much of  Afghanistan, lots of Africa with such loads. Chances are, if you load it, somebody carried it back then. And might just have done very well with it.

Note: I shoot real Black, the compression works from just barely to rockhard. That 777 stuff is different. I don't believe we are supposed to compress it. Just snug it up. Seeing as how I don't use it, I am not sure.

[Athena Jake]

Also, check out this in the Darksiders den:
A Few Photos Illustrating How to Determine Powder Compression
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,18257.0.html