Help with 5744 and data for the 40-60!

[Milano]

This is alittle off topic for the 76 forum but I'll bribe / sweeten the deal with an email response that was sent to me by Western Powders Inc.

I reloaded a bunch of 44-40's with XMP 5744.  I used a 16.5 grain charge over a 200 grain lead bullet.  I am shooting an Uberti '73 carbine with that 19 inch barrel.  Admittadly, I haven't had the time to do any proper load development but figured this was a good middle of the road way to start.  Upon finishing my first string of 10 rounds they were only moving at about 884 feet a second.  The variation was 116 f/s!  There is ALOT of unburned powder.  One case inpaticular showered me with it upon ejecting the brass.  The lifter has 30 or 40 pieces of powder on it after only 10 rounds.  I'm not the best shot in the world but I can tell when I jerk the trigger and the group is so large when firing prone there's a chance I might hit myself in the toes!  Only 7 of the 10 hit a 2 FOOT by 2 foot target.  So my questions are.. Is this normal?  Might a magnum strength primer help some? If the powder is a problem, what would you reccomend?  I am looking into getting a 76 and was hoping to reload it to normal black powder pressures and velocities using 5744, now I'm alittle worried.

Anyway, awhile ago I wrote Accurate for some different reloading data including my beloved 44-40 and 40-60 in the Winchester 76.  I will copy and paste their response here including the waiver / warning so that I nor anyone else can be accused of liability...

Caliber:      .40-60 Winchester.
Barrel length:             30"
Powder:           Accurate -- 5744.
Bullet weight: 210 - 215Grain (L) grain
Start load: 22.0 grains (1500 – 1600 Fps)
Maximum load: 27.0grains (1900 – 2000 Fps)
Bullet weight: 240 - 250 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 20.0 grains (1450 – 1550 Fps)
Maximum load: 25.0grains (1750 – 1850 Fps)
Bullet weight: 265 - 280 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 17.0 grains (1250 – 1350 Fps)
Maximum load: 22.0grains (1500 – 1600 Fps)
Bullet weight: 300 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 16.0 grains (1150 – 1250 Fps)
Maximum load: 21.0grains (1400 – 1500 Fps)
Powder:           Accurate -- 2015.
Bullet weight: 210 - 215Grain (L) grain
Start load: 33.0 grains (1700 – 1800 Fps)
Maximum load: 38.0grains (2000 – 2100 Fps)
Bullet weight: 240 - 250 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 30.0 grains (1600 – 1700 Fps)
Maximum load: 35.0grains (1850 – 1950 Fps)
Bullet weight: 265 - 280 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 27.0 grains (1450 – 1550 Fps)
Maximum load: 32.5 grains (1700 – 1800 Fps)
Bullet weight: 300 Grain (L) grain
Start load: 25.0 grains (1350 – 1450 Fps)
Maximum load: 30.0 grains (1600 – 1700 Fps)

NOTES:
It' important to note that:
Whenever Western Powders Inc do not test, and have actual data, on a particular caliber or caliber/bullet combination, we may in some cases provide some guideline. This information will be based on various procedures and calculations, or from other very reliable sources.
1.        SAFETY is our prime concern therefore:
1.1.   The loading data is conservative, especially regarding the minimum or start load to ensure a safe baseline to work from.
1.2.   The safety margin built into the start load might be more than the customary 10%.
2.        We strongly recommend.
2.1.   To always start at the recommended minimum "START" load.
2.2.   If at all possible, measure the velocity.
2.3.   Contact us again with the velocity data, so that we can verify, and correlate with our calculated/estimated data. The data should also be compared, with the typical velocity levels accepted in the industry, for that particular caliber-bullet weight combination.


Regards
Johan Loubser
Ballistician
Western/Accurate Powders
Tel: 1-800-497-1007 or (406) 234 04 22
Part of Western Powders Inc -- Miles City – Montana.
For all Sales, Marketing, Pricing, Distribution and related issues, please call toll free 800-497-1007 and ask for a sales representative.
To ensure a continuous record per subject/issue, please use the "REPLY" function.
Western Powders Inc. disclaims all possible liability for damages including, actual, incidental and consequential, resulting from usage of the information or advice contained in this message.
Use the data and advice at your own risk, and with extreme caution.
We also request that you visit our website at www.accuratepowder.com for more comprehensive information.
IMPORTANT NOTE: Allways begin loading from the minimum "START charge and carefully develop loads by increasing in small increments of 2% towards the Maximum load.

[Milano]

Arghh.. I pushed the wrong button and sent the message!  I was going to delete some of that and clean it up some. Ohh well the data is there and the waiver is REALLY THERE!  Thank you.

[Roosterman]

I've been shooting BP and subs in my 45-60. So far I find a full case of 2ff to be the most accurate. I'm using a 300gr LFN lubed with SPG. In fact , this 2ff load shoots so well I'll probably never experiment with smokeless.