butt numbers and markings

[KEN S]

I have an original Spencer 1865 Burnside carbine. serial number 193x.   a four digit number, an early made carbine. It now has the stabler cutoff, and the markings are partly 'buffed' off noting a Springfield refurbish  probably late in the 1860's.

    It has three number stamped on the butt near the butt plate. 320     They are 1/4 inch high, and are 5/8 inch in length
    and are parallel with the length of the butt plate.
    Does anyone else have such markings?  And any idea what they mean?

    We should post any markings on any Spencer for record.... 
  Thanks....Ken

[Trailrider]

Can't say for sure, but I'd bet these are rack numbers, used to properly inventory and place the carbine on a cavalry company's gun rack in the barracks.

[Ibgreen]

Are these numbers in the wood, under the butt plate?

[KEN S]

Calvary company's gun rack?    ALL RIGHT!.   I was thinking the same thing.   or at least hoping. 

   the numbers are on the outside of the right but stock, near the plate...very old and stamped..not carved. and placed so they are readable when the carbine is upright.   makes sense for it being a gun rack number....

     I'd love to know what company, where, when, and the name of the soldier, and have his picture holding the gun...and  and  ...
   ok....I'll come back to reality now...

      If someone else had the same numbers it would be cool to compare....
  thanks for answering...Ken

[twogunpete]

I posted a question a few months ago with a similar theme.   If you want to do a search on "Spencer markings 1st cavalry" on this forum there is some interesting commentary but not specifically about rack numbers.  I also have an 1884 Springfield Trapdoor carbine stamped "GA" on top of the butt directly in front of the butt plate assuming it was from Georgia but hard to trace.  If nothing else it makes for good conversation. Good luck.  Twogunpete

[KEN S]

thanks two gun.....I'll check out the post you put up.
  I have a trapdoor with initials, a Springfield .58 with some too...wish they could....well, you know the rest...
      Ken

[KEN S]

one more thing Twogun.......great post...I found it and read it all...interesting....Thanks.
     I have been restoring antique guns for decades,  I've talked to the best from Colt about markings etc on Colt percussions.  R.L. Wilson for one...
      I have seen many markings and stampings....some real, some hidden, some Bubba made...I've examined some darn good attempts at faking...One dragoon really had me stumped once, an an 1860 Colt with a true London stamp.  though fake it was great. 
    I'll stake my reputation on those stampings on your gun being original...definitely period. 
     Period could mean 1890, but I think earlier.  Stampings that were applied before the guns went in storage are clear and the bottoms are sharp and clean.  They just sat on a rack for 90 years. 
     stampings that were done while the guns were used all the time, exhibit  round edges, dirt/oil oxide filled bottoms, and chips that run into them.   Considering they were done by a private waiting for an early lunch, they are off center and not straight.

      I think yours was 'there'.     
          If you listen, they DO talk.....Ken

     

[Thefergs]

I have a modle 1865 carbine with a similar marking only mine is 000 I too thought it to be stamped also found no info or pics referencing it.

My other post has pics up loaded of mine.

[St. George]

Before you go off into paroxysms of fantasy, be advised that any numbering of anything was replicated within units - every outfit has an 'A' Company, and every outfit has a '1', and 'if' the weapons were marked, there's a very large chance that there are several identically-marked ones.

Numbering weapons wasn't a Regular Army 'thing' - they really didn't like to mar their weaponry much. - it all depended on the Commander.

It was usually something done by a Militia unit later in time, but even Militias didn't like doing that, and they'd paint a number on the butt before using a stamp.

The truth of the matter is that Regular or Militia, the Spencer simply didn't stay in issue very long before being shipped back to the depots and sold off.

However, foreign militaries were quite prone to marking weapons - banging in numbers and plates - and a helluva lot of refurbished Spencers went overseas to serve - finding their way home when all the foreign armories emptied themselves for sale to American dealers in the post-war years.

Incidentally - if you're going to get yourself all excited about possibilities, at least know that the term is spelled 'Cavalry' - the military term for an aggressive horse-mounted soldier whose primary mission is that of a scouting and intelligence-gathering element for the Commander.

The term 'Calvary' describes something very different...

Scouts Out!