.44-40 thru a .45 LC???

[Major Matt Lewis]

Question for those who know....

Can you successfully run .44-40 knecked cartidges thru a .45 LC? I am on the eventual journey to shoot Frontiersman. This year, I will shoot Duelist, maybe next year FDC, but I will eventually end up as Frontiersman. When I get there, I would like to use my Henry. My Henry is in .45 LC. I know that the knecked cartidges in .44-40 help with blow back and are generally a lot more efficient than the straight cartridges of .45 LC. So, can it be done?

[Long Johns Wolf]

I don't know about accuracy of a .44-40 out of a .45 LC Henry.
However, intentionally fixed an Uberti 8" .45 Colt Conversion barrel to an Uberti .44 Colt RM Conversion frame/cylinder. I don't want to go into too many details but: Loaded with the .44 Colt .429 dia bullets accuracy was sufficient for CAS purposes up to 10 meters. But at 25 meters I was lucky to hit the target at all, like 1/10. And the few that hit made key holes.
Bootsie

[Dusty Morningwood]

Best stick with cartridges your gun is made for.  A proper bullet and good crimp will take care of most of your blowback in a straight wall case.  Cleanup ain't that bad.  Builds character! 

[Coffinmaker]

Well ....... Yes ....... Sort of.  The real problem is:  44-40 will chamber in a .45 Colt.  It should NOT be done.  Once chambered the case mouth is totally unsupported by the chamber and the case is highly likely to split.  The bullet, once on it's way, just rattles and bangs thru the bore and then just wanders around down range.
The 44-40 round only reduces/eliminates blow-by when fired in a 44-40 chamber.  For safety reasons the case MUST be fully supported.  While it is hilarious to watch when a .45 has been inadvertently loaded with 44-40 (bullets go everywhere), there can be chamber damage from split cases and blow-by can be horrendous.  Very bad JOSS.

Coffinmaker

[Will Ketchum]

Matt, read Cuts Crooked's thread over on the BP forum shooting BP in a 45 Colt.  He says to just neck size the case and this creates a kind of bottle necked.  Also if you use some of the big lube bullets it will help.

For myself I have gone to using Pinnacle for my straight walled cases which takes care of the fouling problems caused by real BP.

Will Ketchum

[Will Ketchum]

It is my understanding that it is APP with graphite added and is made for Goex by the makers of APP.

I should compare the price of the 2.  Perhaps APP is cheaper than the rather expensive Pinnacle.

I never had any use for the substitutes when shooting muzzle loaders but I rationalize it's use in cartridge guns because I have been told that the powder used in the 19th Century produced much less fouling than what we have today and our forefathers didn't have the problems with their guns binding up due to fouling.   My 66 fouled so badly after about 8 shots I had to work to get the carrier to come up.  I doubt that the toggle link repeaters would have been successful if they bound up that bad.

Will Ketchum

[Coffinmaker]

Just the facts Mam, Just the facts.  Black Powder in an of itself is not corrosive.  Moisture is.  Corrosion occurs because BP fouling attracts and and retains moisture.  The moisture causes rust.  Because of chemical content, the BP substitutes are corrosive by them selves, without adding moisture.  Immediate cleaning of BP subs is a real good thing.  Had a brass frame rifle in the shop for action work and the Carrier Block was fusing itself to the mortice.  BP sub caused the corrosion.  Not nice stuff.
The .44 cases in the early repeating rifles were not hard brass.  Copper.  Soft.  Very malleable.  Sealed the chambers nicely.  Fouling of the carrier block in .45 rifles is almost totally unavoidable.  While it is possible to reduce blow-by, you can't completely get rid of it.  Modern .45 Colt cases were designed NOT to expand.  19th century .45 Colt cases weren't designed to work in rifles.  Hand gun round only.
The best pistol caliber cartridges for rifles are 44-40, 38-40 and 32-20.  .45 Colt is actually a lousy rifle cartridge from the clean-up end of things.  Makes a dandy hand gun round though.

Coffinmaker