Twist of Chiappa 56-50 carbine

PJ Hardtack · January 20, 2019, 11:38:05 AM

A pal just asked me what the twist was in a Chiappa 56-50 carbine. I said "Um, er, ah .... ".

Help!

Coal Creek Griff · January 20, 2019, 12:06:53 PM

Per the Dixie Gun Works website, it is 1 in 22 inches.

https://www.dixiegunworks.com/index/page/product/product_id/8355/category/314/category_chain/312,313,314/product_name/CR1014+Dixie+M1865+Spencer+Carbine+-+5056+Caliber

CC Griff

Herbert · January 20, 2019, 02:18:45 PM

Ami Sports advertised there 56_50 carbine with a 1 in 28 twist at one time(very accurate twist rate in my Belgium 56_50 carbine)if they changed this to 1 in 22 twist this would be a bas move accuracy wise.I has a ARMI SPORTS 56_50 rifle that had a 1in 20 twist rate,accuracy was terrible,relined it with a 1 in 36 liner an it is now very accurate

PJ Hardtack · January 20, 2019, 04:58:28 PM

I'm surprised the accuracy was so good with the slower twist.

1x22" used to be the standard in 45-70 for years. Now 1x18'' is the norm for the heavy bullets.

El Supremo · January 20, 2019, 07:09:55 PM

Hello:

I have been told by Romano that, over many years, he's encountered three A-sport, 56-50 Spencer twists.
I don't know all, but one was 24".

From the experiences of two A-S Spencer owners, even the Chiappa Warranty Center in Dayton, OH, that is supposed to be able to match serial number to production parts variations/specifications, has not been much help.

Taylor's only knows about the current stuff they handle. Taylor's Winchester VA techy's have been extremely professional and caring, but these sort of questions are referred to Dayton.

Frankly, it is not easy to measure twist accurately via tight patch and I have been off as much as an inch or two with many barrels. No one has been able to tell me WHY most CW era twists are in even, whole numbers instead of either odd numbers or fractions. The Merrill breechloader seems to be the only one with a partial inch twist, per specifications.

Burnside '65's in 56-50 had 24" and were reportedly quite accurate.

Still, 36" in Douglas' 56-50 barrel blanks (used on some repro's, not A-Sports') and 32" in Romano's barrels or his Spencer liners works very well with a 310 - 315gr bullet ahead of 35gr 3Fg.

That UTUBE vid of the fellow gong shooting from the bench in the wind remains chillingly inspiring.
One w smokeless, one with black. Bang ... Clang! Shot-after-shot! Have to love it.

All the best,

El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

Herbert · January 20, 2019, 08:50:54 PM

Twist rate is determined by groove diameter,velocity ,and bullet length (the 56-50 has to have short bullet and short bullet overstabilise in fast twist barrels) 1 in 22 will stabilise a 410 gr 458 bullet but go to 310gr 458 bullet an it really needs to be a slower twist for the same velocity.I would not expect a twist rat faster tan 1 in 28 to work at any distance with the short 56-50 bullet at Spencer velocitys

PJ Hardtack · January 21, 2019, 12:00:41 PM

My experience with my 1x26" Shiloh 50-70 carbine with 375/450 gr Lyman 515141 bears that out. It is a great 100 m shooter but accuracy falls off at 150 m.

My Farmingdale Military Rifle with 1x36" reaches out well to 200m with the same loads.

I shoot both with the factory ladder sights.

El Supremo · January 21, 2019, 05:07:32 PM

Hello:

The old adage "Nothing in this world is what it seems to be." applies to Armisport's Spencer 56-50 rifling twist:

Ryan Hodges of Taylor's Firearms in Winchester, VA just replied to my inquiry of this morning.
I remember him from a Winchester facility visit last May. Nice, professional fellow!

He included a "Spencer twist rate table":
44-40 ---------------- 36"

44 Russian ------- 20"

45 Long Colt ---- 16"

56-50 Spencer - 24"

Perhaps Dixie's 22" 56-50 Spencer twist figure is an older one.

Again, Taylor's only knows about current, not older production.

My experience with normal bullets is that the 2" (22" vs. 24") should not be a material difference.

All the best,

El Supremo/Kevin Tinny

Drydock · January 21, 2019, 06:15:59 PM

AT the relatively low velocity of the .56/50, I don't think somewhat fast twist rate will have much of a negative affect. The long range BPCR guys these days like to overspin their bullets, to maintain stability as the bullets slow downrange. The stubby Spencer bullet with its lousy BC is not going to group well much past 100 yards no matter how fast or slow you run the twist. (IMHO, yet I'm sure someone has had fantastic results at 300 yards) One of the reasons the Army went back to the Sharps carbine in 1868 was to gain downrange accuracy and power.

It's a big pistol cartridge, with all the limitations attendant. And damn it's fun to shoot within those limitations!