Fake case color methods?

[Virginia Gentleman]

I know the only real looking case coloring is the bone/charcoal method that Turnbull and others use, but has anyone used a home method such as using Kasenit or a chemical treatment to mimic the look?  If so, how did it hold up?  I know the Europeans use a fake method to approximate the look of case colors. 

[jiminy criquet]

Bone charcoal, sometimes called boneblack or bone-black, or bone char, can be found under the guise of aquarium charcoal.  (Not all aquarium charcoal is bone charcoal so check the label.)  Simply pack the part completely in the bone charcoal in a small container with a lid (metal, clay, whatever) and heat it to red hot in a fire for about 30 - 45 minutes or so until it is heated throughout, then remove it and immediately dump the whole works (still contained) into a decent sized (metal) container of water (such as a regular metal trashcan).  The quenching action of the water combined with the bone charcoal being in contact with the metal imparts the color and hardness to the part.

On the other hand, forget what I just said...you might as well send it out and have it done

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Howdy!

I once inquired about having the color-case finish replaced on one of my pistols.  I was told that [A] the way it's done in Europe produces the best results of the fake casehardening, and  it CAN'T be done here in the USA because one of the ingredients used is arsenic, and now EPA forbidden.

[Lars]

Real "case hardening" is done for the hardness it imparts to the upper small fraction of mm of the metal's surface. The colors are totally incidental although they are often consistant with a very specific method of "case hardening". Some methods produce only dark blues and some yellows -- no indication of quality of the "case hardening". Some folks, like Turnbull, use method that gives surface colors that many folks are willing to pay much more for. He also coats the surface with a protective coat that makes the colors deeper, more lusterous and longer lasting.

Modern steels don't need "case hardening", as do the low carbon steels that were heavily used in past and in some replica guns today. Case hardening may destroy the heat treatment some modern steels receive. Because many folks really like "case colors" gun makers have developed various "case color" treatments to produce the multicolored surface coatings on modern steels.

Lots of folks, I am one, don't like case colors at all and prefer either blackend (blued in USA speak) or one of the metallic grey finishes.

Lars

[Virginia Gentleman]

Thanks all for the historical and methodology for real case hardening as I am well informed on that.  What I am looking for is a home method that I can use to appoximate the look of casehardening, like using Kasenit and lightly runiing the mapp gas flame back over the piece to color it.  Are there any other method that you all have used to do this WITH OUT going to the full process of casehardening?

[bohicabill]

 OK here is the real poop on the fake case coloring.  I bought about 10 years ago at the ABQ. gun show a bottle of the fake c.c. This was some type of a brown syrupy liquid that had the odor of bitters. One is suppose to place on a thin layer and allow it to dry. After this has been accomplished you use a ox/ace torch with a ox rich flame. You can control whatever pattern you want on it. After this one takes a super fine steel wool with water and wash off the residue. The shit really works. It was sold by a Bill Holmes from someplace in Arkansas.
Now other methods. If you have a receiver that was once c.c. you can take casey's super blue and mix 50/50 with Iso-alcohol. Use a q-tip or cotton ball using a very light film. Wipe off within 10 seconds. This will bring out some of the old coloring. Super glue contains a iso-cyanide. Apply a fine film of super glue on the part and heat gently. This will bring out a some very light colors.  There are also some synthedics when burning will produce cyanide gases. In addition to this wool will also generate cyanide gas when burned. Wool will produce a nice variety of light colors. Ever cut an apple with a knife and not clean it off. After a while one get some real nice marbling effect with a variety of color hues. Unfortunately this rubs off with very little effort.
Final note if you do get something you like as far as a color goes, remember this that c.c. , was orginally sealed or varnish over at the factory. Hope this helps.

OBTW it is not arsenic it is cyanide and it is not FORBIDDEN by the EPA, arsenic is what rat poison contains. Additonally what do you think they use to recover gold with, cyanide. There are a lot of restrictions using it but potassium cyanide can be legally obtain and used.  Futhermore, there are several cyanide compounds that can be purchased and are fairly safe to keep around. Unfortunately they are pretty useless when it comes to using them to  obtain color on steel. I love it when someone talks out there backside as an authority.
Turnbull will splash on a lot of color but, does not have a clue what the orginal colors look like. There again maybe he does. But 99% of the customers don't know any better. They do a fine job on refinshing metal. Years ago he use to advertized the carbona blue...not any more. They haven't got a clue what are the proper ingredents are or the total process.

[Montana Slim]

....BTW, case hardening is still widely used in many U.S. military small arms weapons  , but not color-case 

And I suspect it is still imployed in triggers, sears, etc. in many commercial firearms.

Slim

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Didn't mean to talk out my back side as an authority (which you seem to be intent on doing);  I was merely repeating what a manufacturer told me.  Wouldn't be the the first time a customer was lied to told.

[Montana Slim]

Didn't mean to talk out my back side as an authority (which you seem to be intent on doing);  I was merely repeating what a manufacturer told me.  Wouldn't be the the first time a customer was lied to told.

No-offense to ya pard.....

The process they were describing to ya uses cyanide. The old method of bone/charcoal is the best "color" method and enviromentally friendly. An industrial "fake" color-process can be done using a salt-bath (high temp) quench process. A high-carborizing flame process is typically employed for parts that aren't "seen".

Slim

[Steel Horse Bailey]

No problem, pard. 

[rifle]

Cyanide: heat in iron crucible until liquid. Place part in it and heat till red for awhile. With preheated tongs retrieve part from cyanide. Place part in water or oil a little at a time to impart beautiful color stripes. Place part on grate in 55 gal. drum with lots of air pumped in to churn and bubble the water that will cool different areas at different rates to make swirls of color. Actually since it's the "heat" and the fact that the metal is cooled in different areas at different rates of temp. and not the cyanide to get colors.....a person can do it with just heat and water. The cyanide is too" see" the part and what color it is being heated to since it is clear liquid when heated. It may impart carbon but I'm not sure. Metal gets to be different colors with different heat temps. The trick is to cool the metal fast but different areas at a slightly different rate or temp. With the box of charcoal(bone and wood) the water leaks in the lid and hits the metal in different spots as it  leaks thru the charcoal. The bone imparts the case hard as anything organic is mostly carbon. The thing is that the metal still has to cool rapidly to get hardened.Using a flame in the atmosphere(propane torch) and left to cool slowly can "soften the parts".  Brownells (gunsmith supply)sells the stuff for casehardening. The nitre salts are like the cyanide salts somewhat and can be used to "charcoal blue "(nitre blue-bring to 580-600 degrees and remove parts and immerse in oil or water depending on the steel. One thing to consider is what hardness the metal originally was and return it there. Whether or not the part had to be tempered in a low heat for a period of time should be known. Most refinishers (casehardening) don't have a clue as to whether or not the part was tempered originally at the factory after casehardening(ex: old Remington Double shotgun reciever) so it would not be too hard or brittle. I wouldn't have anyone do the casehardening just because they figured that process out but only if they also know metalurgy and what gun parts hardness should actually be to be safe. If yer talkin a cap&baller Colt pistol frame well....but if yer talkin a shotgun reciever or rifle reciever well...... maybe leave well enough alone. Most refinishers just caseharden and know squat about how the temper of the gun part should be. I don't mean regular Joes like us. I mean the professionals that are actully frauds and can screw ya up because they don't consider any tempering after the hardening. Most people know not to caseharden a cylinder from a revolver or a pistol or rifle barrel because they would be brittle. Why the heck would a reciever be much different? Don't want to make them brittle. Maybe if a metal was casehardened at the factory originally and not tempered it would be fine to re-caseharden. What if the factory originally tempered after the casehardening so the reciever was not too brittle? A refinisher would need to know how the factory tempered it(400 degrees for six hours and then 350 for 4 hours, ect ect.) or undrstand the metal to know if it needed the tempering at all after the casehardening. I've asked refinishers whether or not a part needs to be tempered after casehardening and they say," never had a problem", but can't answer the question. oh oh

[Roy Mason]

Here is the Roy Mason touch up process for a casehardened/colored finish.  Take you gun and don't degrease it.  Get a shop towel and rub on the area you want to touch up.  Rub heavy in some areas and lighter in others, what you are doing is removing some of the surface oil, but not all.  Now dip a Q-Tip in your cold blue and run it around in a figure eight pattern.  Once it starts to color in some areas like "case color" gently wipe or spray oil on it to stop the bluing action.  Let it sit for 24 hours and wipe off the oil.

This works good to touch up the colors and color the areas missed on some Italian guns.  It also works well on color case Rugers.  If you have rust on the surface use an ink eraser or oil soaked steel wool to remove it.  The rust will spoil the look you are trying to achieve. 

[Virginia Gentleman]

Kasenit has worked pretty well for me except that I re-temper the part again after it is hardened again just a bit with the Mapp Torch.  It really brings out the colors then.  If you do an oil quench it can make the part look darker.  Be careful if you use used motor oil as it can be flammable.