Schofields and APP

[DeaconKC]

Okay guys, I know that the Uberti Schofield replicas have lots of problems with fouling with genuine Black Powder, but does anyone know how they behave with APP or other subs? Thanks 

[Mako]

Now, that's a loaded statement about fouling with Gun Powder.  Who told you they fouled?  there are several things that have been left out here.

• What caliber, I'm assuming .45, but which cartridge?   
• What grain size? 
• Most Importantly the bullet


• What lube?
• Which bullet?  The style, groove depth, groove width all determine how much lube
• What is the center pin and mechanism being lubricated with?   

That will get us started.

We'll work this out...

~Mako

[Professor Marvel]

Ah My Dear Mako

We have been having lengthy and interesting conversations regarding the Uberti Schofield....
The problem is that Uberti removed the cylinder bushing that reduced BP fouling jams, keading to ....
BP fouling jams!

If one hase suffieciient resources, skills, and milling equipment, one can remediy the problem.

Howver, unless one can acquire some of the former finest sporting powders which had very little fouling,
The por little Uberti jams up in just a few shots.

Never had one to try APP myself, so I cannot comment on this.

Odldly tho, my Remmy '58's have no cylinder bushing either, and is able to go and go and go even with dirty old
Elephant Powder.

[Mako]

Perfesser,
None of my loose powder pistols have center pin bushings like you see on a SAA, they don't foul out.  However I think they have larger diameter cylinder pins than a Schofield.  Don't your '58s also have relatively smaller diameter pins?

In my experience Pyrodex gave me DRY and crusty fouling even with lube.  Pinnacle was also "dryer" than true BP, it reminded me of Smokeless fouling.  I have shot pinnacle and Pyrodex but not 777 or APP. I think the fouling aspect might be overstated and comes down to bullet lube.

I had a similar problem trying to convince the boys that running a weapon dry does not make it run more reliably in a dusty environment.  They were told lube attracted dust...I don't care if their weapons are "dirty", it just need to be VERY WELL lubricated dirt.  Super dry and clean weapons were an artifact of things they learned and were inspected to.  Hard to train that out of people when that is your tribes mantra...

So back to my question of which bullet (Which is really a question of how much lube it can hold) and which lube?   After that would be what are you lubricating that cylinder pin with?

~Mako

[DeaconKC]

My Schofields are both .45 Colt and very tightly fitted. They are 100% reliable for a long match of 12+ stages with my Unique load, 7.5 grains of Unique under a 200 grain molylubed rnfp bullet from Bustin' Head Lead. Their bullets are excellent, they have even supplied them to Bullets by Scarlett. I am currently planning on running my Opentops in .45 Colt as my Primary revolvers, as they have the cylinder bushings. I have no problem running a gun heavily lubed [I'm used to 1911s] but was wondering if anyone here was familiar with running them with a sub due to the problems that are well documented with the fouling on the Uberti guns having the lengthened cylider to allow .45 Colt rounds to fit. When I started loading for CAS, I followed Coffinmaker's [and others] advise to load my .45 Colt rounds to close to factory numbers to avoid blowback fouling and it has proven successful as my rifles run like scalded cats through matches and are not heavily fouled when done.

[Dave T]

Deacon,

I've posted my experience before but I'll run through it again for folks who never read my older musings. I have one of the S&W 2000 Schofields which also lack the correct cylinder bushing. And for the record, this really ticks me off after S&W's hype about how "authentic" their Schofield repro was supposed to be.

My sample, which according to the first owner had only fired light, mouse phart cowboy loads of smokeless, completely froze solid after four rounds of 45 S&Ws loaded with 27g of OE FFg behind 200g Big Lube bullets, cast of 1-20 alloy and lubed with SPG. When I say "froze" I mean I could not cock the hammer or advance the cylinder, even trying to simultaneously turn the cylinder with my left hand.

I had some Hodgdon Black M-Z on hand and tried the same volume of that substitute BP with the same Big Lube bullets. I got through 25 rounds without having to do anything but reload. In full disclosure I should say the last cylinder full (5 rounds) was getting harder to advance by just cocking the hammer but I managed without a boost from my weak hand.

Because I'm kind of disgusted with the whole thing I don't shoot the S&W 2000 much so I still have a bit of the Black M-Z left. I'm told it was just a re-branded APP product so if I am able to keep shooting (getting old and broken stinks) I will replace the discontinued Black M-Z with APP.

YMMV,
Dave

[Abilene]

Dave FYI, Shooter's World Multi-Black is also made by APP, and some of the big outfits carry it so you can tack a bottle or two onto a powder or primer order if you are already paying a hazmat.  APP seems to only be available by mail order and there is a minimum order.  I think.

And Mako, I think Pinnacle was also made by APP.