1858 Reminingtons in CAS or SASS events

[R.U. Snickering]

I have a brace of Old Model Army revolvers and would like to shoot them in CAS or SASS events. I want to shoot these "Cap n Ball" style. Has anyone used these pistols in the CAS or SAS events? What suggestions whould you give me based upon your shooting? I am a newbie to SASS. Thanks

[US Scout]

R. U. Snickering,

First off, that is a great alias.  Welcome to CAS and especially SCORRS.

SASS has a shooting category called "Frontiersmen" for those who desire to shoot C&B (percussion) revolvers.  You must use a side by side (double-barrel) or lever action shotgun in the main match stages.  If you don't have a side by side shotgun, you can register in another category but you'll probably be shooting at a disadvantage compared to the cartridge shooters. 

My first question to you is how experienced are you at shooting these revolvers?  If you've been shooting them for a spell and have the loading procedures down you probably won't have too much difficulty (though, as a rule, if it can go wrong it will go wrong while you're at a match).  If you haven't got much experience with them, you need to get out to the range and shoot them a lot to learn how to deal with any minor problems that can arise (such as fouling, a stuck cap, a bad cone (nipple), jamming, etc.).

I recommend you head over to the Darksider forum and ask your questions there as well.  All the Soot Lords hang out there and are always willing to help a new apprentice to the Dark Arts. 

Loading percussion pistols is usually done at the unloading table, though some clubs may differ.  You need to have your powder, ball, grease, wads and whatever else you need (except caps) conveniently together so you can do what needs to be done as quickly and efficiently as possible so as to to clutter up the table too long.  You will cap at the loading table just prior to shooting.

Since you plan to shoot Remingtons, I recommend you wipe down the cylinder and swab the bore between stages.  It'll keep the fouling down, which will improve function and maintain accuracy. 

I personally like to change all the cones to the better ones made out of stainless steel.  On several of my guns I found multiple types of cones on a single cylinder, some requiring different sized caps.  Now, all my cones on all my pistols are the same size.

You'll need at least one extra cylinder to shoot any stage requring a reload on the clock.  You load the cylinder with powder and ball, and cap it when you need to do the reload.  Pretty easy with the Remingtons, though you need to practice getting the cylinder in and out quickly.

I'm sure many folks will come along and give your their favorite recipe for lube or cleaning.  Recommend you try them out (all or some) to see what works best for you. 

Another alternative, though not cheap, is to invest in a pair of cartridge conversion cylinders from either R&D or Kirst, and shoot these while learning how to keep your percussion pistols functioning.

I like shooting percussion pistols and Frontiersman, and many people like watching Frontiersmen shoot.  However, some clubs and shooters are not well disposed to that category as they feel it slows down the posse.  I disagree but find it easier not to shoot with those folks, or at least not as a Frontiersman (I usually shoot Frontier Cartridge Duelist most of the year anyway).

Get out there and shoot those pistols - and enjoy them! 

[Bull Schmitt]

You can shoot them in the Blackpowder class and any class defined by age.

If you have to do a reload on the clock and insert a preloaded cylinder, DO NOT cap the cylinder until AFTER it is in the revolver. A loose capped cylinder is a disaster waiting to happen!

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Welcome, pard. A man with Remmies is a friend of ours. Looking forward to yer posts.

[hellgate]

R.U.S.,
Welcome aboard. My "serious match" guns are a pair of Uberti Millenium New Model Army Remington 44s. I like Colt's revolvers too and will say why in a minute. Be sure to read the SASS Shooter's handbook that is on the SASS Home page download area. A few things about Remmies:

Some foul quickly and others don't. Mine do so I use a lube wad under the ball, grease over the ball and a drop of oil between the front of the cylinder & the frame at each chargeup. The oil drop is placed so it will work its way down onto the cylinder pin and front of the cylinder to keep things twirling. Colt's guns are less fouling in this area. It may seem like overkill for lubes but my guns don't foul out nor do I need to swab the bore since the lube wad & grease do that for me each time I pull the trigger.

As US Scout says, charge up at the unloading table or wherever the RO or Match director says it is OK and be sure not to sweep anyone with the muzzle while charging. I dump powder in all 5 chambers, place a wad in all 5 then seat a ball onto all 5 and then grease all 5 chambers with a syringe of automotive grease. It goes fast. Some do one at at a time. I just keep the gun pointed UP. I would not "work" the unloading table until you can get the loading rhythm down pat. Otherwise you might dryball a chamber or get the sequence screwed up and that can be frustrating. Been there, done that. I don't wantcha defecting to the suppository shooters by getting mixed up in the loading aspects, becoming embarassed, frustrated etc.

Mark one of your chambers as the "open" chamber that is not loaded. I shoot each gun at a 6 bull target from a sandbag rest for 3 cylinders full. That's 3 shots per chamber at its own bull. The least accurate chamber is the "open" (unused) chamber. The worst nipple goes on that one too. I use a drop of fingernail polish on the outside of the cylinder to mark the chamber I don't load.

My answer to the 5 shot pistol reload: Get a cheap Colt, even a brass framed one will do. Colt's revolvers have larger cutouts for the nipples and a straight line capper is much faster to get onto the nipple cones for capping. The Remingtons are harder to cap in a hurry although it can be done quickly with practice and the right capper (Ted Cash steel in-line capper is best). Besides, it is a legitamate excuse to get a 3rd gun. Worked for me only I didn't know when to stop. For me, swapping out a cylinder and then capping would only be if I did not want or couldn't afford a 3rd C&B. It would be messy on your hands too. I have done many a "reload" by merely stashing the charged but uncapped Colt wherever the reload is to take place and just picked it up, capped it, and shot it dry. It's actually faster than most cartridge shooters 'cause you don't have to shuck out empties. But, I guess if speed is your game, you've got no business shooting Frontiersman but for the sheer joy of it (like me).

To shoot Frontiersman, you must shoot  black powder or a sub in all your guns and duelist (one handed) for the revolvers. If you use two hands for the pistols then you can shoot all BP in the Frontier Cartridge category or shoot the C&Bs with the BP and smokeless (I hate to suggest this) in the other guns in Traditional or any other age or gender appropriate category. My first year of CAS was in Modern catagory with my '61 Navy, a Ruger Flattop Blackhawk, a borrowed 20ga SXS and a borrowed '92 Rossi. I went all Black in 1994 and never looked back.

Keep in mind that shooting the perCUSSIN' revolvers is a part of history. They have their drawbacks but I get more joy out of a flawless match (who counts misses?) than anyone with the easy to do selfcontained ammo. It can be a "calling" or a curse depending on your attitude. I often see myself as providing comic relief for the rest of the posse. There are two kinds of black powder shooters: those that like to shoot it and those that like to watch those that shoot it. I often see folks just smiling and shaking their heads after I smoke up a stage. I don't know if they're laughing with me or at me but who has the biggest grin? I DO.

BTW, that avatar photo is my Remington with only 20 grs FFFg. You can get about 35grs in them.

[Bottom Dealin Mike]

A great thing about Remingtons is easy cylinder swap-out. Over the years I've collected six extra cylinders that I pre-load before a match. Then I only need to reload one gun per stage...speeds things up considerably. Eventually I'll scrounge up a dozen.

[R.U. Snickering]

Thanks for all of your suggestions. I am a devoted C&B shooter. Have been shooing 1851 Navies and these Remintons since 1976. I really love shooting these and do not mind the mess and extra loading time. I guess soot in in my blood.
Again,,, thanks for your suggestions.... R.U. Snickering