Supplies

[Red Cent]

Zack White in Ramseur, NC carries Fiebings dye, finish, and edge finish including enamel. They also carry Fiebings, XL-8, and Barge adhesives. Are these OK.

$10.00 in diesel away so I hope these don't have problems with you guys.

[Red Cent]

So I guess no one has any experience with the products. I guess ZW wouldn''t carry crap for sale. Oh well.

[Camano Ridge]

Not sure exactly what you want to know. I have Feibing dyes among other brands and Fiebings works well. You will find that know two brands give you the exact same color ie, Feibings Tan will look different then angelus tan which will look different then Tandy pro Water Stain Tan etc. most stored will have sample swatches of the color with the brand of dye you are using. Barge cement is good cement how ever it is odorifirous and needs to be used in a well ventilated area. The Tandy i go to sells Barge and there own brand. They claim that the large can of Barge can only be purchased if you have a business license.


Hope that helps, if you have more specific questions feel free to ask. Everybody has there own opinion so hopefully this response will generate some more input for you.

[GunClick Rick]

So I guess no one has any experience with the products. I guess ZW wouldn''t carry crap for sale. Oh well.

I'm just waitin on a friend

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi,

I only use traditional dies from walnut, coffee and vinagaroon .... I have had no experience with Fiebling dies ....

[Trailrider]

Don't know much about other dyes. I've been using Fiebing's alcohol ("spirit") dyes for about three decades now. The only thing is that, because the alcohol will dry the leather out, I follow it up with a treatment of Lexol(R) Leather Conditioner, AFTER the dye is completely dry (usually overnight). Apply Lexol with a soft cloth or spray on. Wipe off the excess and let that dry.

Barge cement has also been a staple of mine for years, although the newer formula in the blue tubes or cans is bad news vapor-wise! Definitely use in a well-ventilated area! (For small jobs, such as along the main seam of a holster, I've taken to using a rubber-based cement used in model railroading called Walther's GOO, available at model railroad hobby shops, or from Wm. K. Walthers in Milwaukee, WI. GOO also has strong vapors, but not as bad as the newer Barge!)

[Red Cent]

I have recently watched some videos of John Bianchi, Dusty Johnson, and a couple more. These were loaned to me by a very nice guy with the handle of Slowhand Bob. Thank you Robby. I plan to watch them about three or four times.

Camano, I want to know what dyes and adhesives do you and others, through your years of experience, use today.

I am glad that I watched the Bianchi triligy first. He makes the others seem ill prepared to make any videos. His approach is very informative and easy to understand.

I have another question. Do any of you immerse your product in oil as Bianchi does/did?

[Camano Ridge]

For period pieces I use natural dyes. All of the recipes for  those can be found in the how to link of this site. If I am not doing period pieces i use angelu, Tandy's Pro Water Stain and fiebings. It depends on the color I want. I think Angelu has the best tan, if I am not using vinegaroon for black I like Tandy's Pro waterstain Black. I have not experienced any rub off with it.

GLue, I hjave used barge and others but currently and for about the last two years i have been using Tanners Bond contact cement. It has worked well for me and cheaper then Barge also has less odor. I dip knife sheaths in a heated oil and wax mix. Holsters and belts I preffer to rub on oil.

[Massive]

"I have recently watched some videos of John Bianchi, Dusty Johnson, and a couple more. These were loaned to me by a very nice guy with the handle of Slowhand Bob. Thank you Robby. I plan to watch them about three or four times."

Funny, I am just watching the Bianchi tape right now.  He is very thorough.  I like watching someone who hasn't a wasted motion.  A few westerns have a scene where a gunfighter will belittle someone else as not having gunfighter hands.  But it is probably closer to the truth (not that there is any truth in that stuff) that the manual dexterity from crafts is highly helpful.  I once had to do a bunch of psych test for some lawsuits, just stuff to show how badly I had been hurt.  Regrettably I pretty much had the highest ratings they had ever seen, and in particular the most efficient hands at manual dexterity the person had ever tested.  Our side had to "send the tests back".

I have to wonder whether Bianchi uses Tandy skins for real.  I do though I know a better supplier or two, and once I get my volume up...

"Camano, I want to know what dyes and adhesives do you and others, through your years of experience, use today."

I have been at this 40 years, and my experience is people search until they find what works for them, then leave it at that.  This can mean they haven't tried anything new in decades, or after that initial point of success.  Online world does seem to make some folks go out of their way to try everything so they can be an internet expert. 

Here is the take-away for any finishing task i can think of:  Do samples of everything, and always have an objective.  Changing anything in your process can lead you to a failure.  fail small on samples.  Always have clear objectives like: colour penetration; resistance to transfer; shade; process; storage; work in cold; works in warm; non-toxic; traditional; luxury, or cheap.  Then set out to solve that specific problem.  I see dye jobs here every day that I don't like despite their obvious quality.  Good for them!  They solved their problem.

Right now I am experimenting with ecoflow because some have said that it is the best for a dyed finish look.  I prefer vinvigaroon up to this point.  Ecoflow is also good for speed.  I am making a handbag for my mother to augment one she has had 30 years.  It looks like what that market expects, and it works fast.  So far only downside is that it seems thick, and may cost, the jury is out.  Another thing.  I had to spot weld the parts together with light hold masking tape.  The dye would not penetrate the "non-existant" residue.  That is what i mean when I say "run a sample".  I had, but it didn't have tape on it now I was left with what was going to happen if I hit this mess with acetone.  Luckily I figured out that hard buffing with leather would remove the residue.  Yet another testing issue was Will mentioned that this stuff worked better with penetration enhanced with a soak, well chrome tanned does not soak like veg.  So as I say, whatever you hear, there are so many things to go wrong that you have to your own quality control and recovery.

"I am glad that I watched the Bianchi triligy first. He makes the others seem ill prepared to make any videos. His approach is very informative and easy to understand."

Watch it, some of those guys hang around here.

"I have another question. Do any of you immerse your product in oil as Bianchi does/did?"

Cost of that kind of set-up, fire hazzard, not on my list.  I came across this in woodworking also, where some stuff gets immersed also, but hand applied also has it's points.  There are pros and cons to everything.  Make choices on a practical basis then emphasise the positive.  Hand sewing is better, say, but if you go that route take it to the max, make it true for your products. Because somewhere out there, there will be someone machine sewing better than hand sewing, if you don't push your envelope.  It is marketing/lying if you just say it, you have to live it.

[rickk]

Fiebings products work well.

Zack White also has a few "Zack White" labeled colors (limited selection) that work well too, but are cheaper than Fiebings.

Zack White is one of my two favorite places, the other being Ohio Travel Bag.

Rick

[Slowhand Bob]

I posted a little about dyes over on the SASS Wire this morning.  I use Weavers but it has its problems.  Lack of color selection (ya gotta mix yore own) and the black is extremely dirty but there are some good points cheep, by the gallon, pricing if ordered in case lots to defray HazMat cost and the black does penetrate deeply in two applied coats.  My favorite glue has  become Weld Wood, which can be purchased by the gallon locally.  It is the easiest glue yet to work with and holds like a true weld.  On the glue topic.  http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,41797.0.html

Merry Christmas to all from Gods Country, Middle Georgia. 

[outrider]

You can always buy direct from Fiebing's...go to their website

[Red Cent]

Watching the Bianchi tapes, he built some holsters and did the usual. After he finished, he dipped the entire rig in oil. Forgot what oil it was. Between the oil giving the leather a rich, light brown color, the edge dressing bled (intentionally) into the leather and gave it a faded darker edge all over. Kinda neat in my inexperienced mind. Reminds me of some of Bob Mernickle's work. Anyway, I may not use the dye so much in the beginning.

I think vinegaroon is fascinating and will brew up some as soon as I get word the ship is about to dock. Why would one use black dye other than use vinegaroon?

[knucklehead]

Red Cent,

Bianchi used neatsfoot oil in his videos.  good videos but i dont understand why you would build a holster that requires you to beat on it with a hammer when wet forming it to the gun.
i think if you had to beat on it to stretch it to form to firearm then you made it way to tight.

[Slowhand Bob]

I think the results of what he was doing was more akin to pressure forming than actually hammering on the leather.  The holster was sandwiched between the enclosed round maul and the concaved surface of the femle 'die' and the pounding was setting the round shape via impact??  I think this is one of those cases where a picture would be worth a thousand words!

[Massive]

Red Cent,

Bianchi used neatsfoot oil in his videos.  good videos but i dont understand why you would build a holster that requires you to beat on it with a hammer when wet forming it to the gun.
i think if you had to beat on it to stretch it to form to firearm then you made it way to tight.

It is pretty hard to argue with the Bianchi holster fit, though up to date, some don't want any retention at all.

I think one thing about what he did was that he produced his fit without risking wetting an expensive colt should a bag fail, and he managed it without any gun molds. 

One of the things about getting a good fit with leather is one sometimes has to push it a little.  If one just wedges something in there for molding, like a gun, or a mold, how does one ensure the resulting shape is correct.  It is the same thing with shoes, the last is not a perfect model of the foot, it is the shape the shoe needs to be to fit the foot.  Other makers insert wood spacers, or use molds from one size up pistols like the original Vasquero to fit the current one.