44wcf Crimp

[Gripmaker]

Posted this also on Win. 73 site below but need more "eyes a lookin'".  Do any of you know what the original crimp was on the 44wcf, roll or flat crimp?  Called Buffalo Arms today to check on their ammo but none was available to see.  I'm sure W44wcf knows. John, are you out there with the answer?
Gripmaker

[Cactus Rope]

Little Brother,

If you might have them check back issues of Guns magazine, November 2003 article by John Taffin and April 2008 article by Mike Ventrino. I came across a letter in October 2009 on this subject, mentioning these two articles. Just give John a call.

Big Brother

[Gripmaker]

Thanks Bob.  I never thought of that, so I will.  God Bless and have a very Merry Christmas!

Little Bro

[PJ Hardtack]

Occasionally I'll get an out-of-spec 44-40 round using my Dillon dies. This due to case length variation and crimping. These will chamber with difficulty in my Remington 44-40 conversions, if at all. My 44-0 rifles eat them up.

I went on a case trimming spree and I've been advised to order a Lee 'factory crimp' die to alleviate the problem.

[wildman1]

I bought 100 Winchester cases to use while I was waiting on an order from Starline. I don't believe there were two of those Winchester cases that were the same length. Some of them would buckle the top of the case others wouldn't have any crimp at all. I received the Starline cases and have loaded about 300 of them the crimp is the same on every one. Also the rim on a couple of the Winchester cases was too big in diameter to go into the dies. After I shoot them all a couple of times I'm going to get a case length gauge and trim them so they're uniform. WM

[w44wcf]

Gripmaker,
The 1st cartridge in the pic (WRA CO .44 W.C.F. headstamp - early b.p.) shows a very slight roll crimp.
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,42144.0.html

wildman1 makes a very good point. Consistant roll crimps require all brass to be of the same length, whereas the LFC die works well with varying case lengths.

I have used both with good results.

w44wcf

[Gripmaker]

W44wcf,  Thanks for the post and reference.  It just goes to show that if you stop short in your research, you'll miss something.
Who makes a crimp die that will accomplish this "slight" roll crimp?

[w44wcf]

Gripmaker,
You are most welcome.  Most bullet seating dies will produce a roll crimp. They can be adjusted to give no crimp to a heavy crimp.

To set the die to seat and crimp in one operation........
1.) Place an empty case into the shellholder and push the press handle down to raise it to the utmost position.
2.) Insert the seating die in the press and turn it down until you feel it touch the top of the case,  then back it off 1/4 turn and lock it in place.
3.) Back off the die seating stem and insert a loaded case into the press.
4.) Adjust the seating stem down until the bullet is seated to the proper depth.
5.) Back off the seating stem at least 1 turn and run the loaded cartridge back into the die.
6.) Turn the seating die back down to touch the case then turn the die down 1/8 turn at a time until the desired crimp is reached.
7.) With the case in the crimped position in the die, turn the seating stem down to firmly touch the bullet. 

The die is now set to seat the bullet and crimp in the same operation.

NOTE:
That being said, there can be certain bullet / crimp combinations that are better achieved by seating and crimping in a separate operation wether using the standard seating die to seat the bullets first then crimping with the seating stem backed out or with the Lee FCD.

w44wcf