Shooting 45 Scholfield in 45 colt revolvers?

Cliff Fendley · July 12, 2012, 07:29:29 AM

Starlines site says some modification may be necessary in some revolvers to allow for the head diamiter.

Has anyone had to do this using Starline Scholfied brass?

With my neck in a bad way I want to make some reduced recoil loads for my 45 colt. I think I'd rather use Scholfield brass rather than filler in the 45 Colt.

Will be shooting in a Uberti SAA.

Also can I use my Lee 45 colt/454 casual dies or will I need different dies?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Junkman · July 12, 2012, 07:50:39 AM

I am able to load .45 Schofield brass in my Lee .45 Colt dies just fine.

I should have mentioned that I shoot them in an 1860 Pietta Colt Army with a Howell's conversion cylinder, and they fit just fine with no modification to the rims.

reloader4410 · July 12, 2012, 07:52:26 AM

My 58s with r&d cylinders one the brass fits fine the other wont chamber, I take a dowel & duct tape it untill the shell fits snug chuck the dowel in a drill & spin & file till they fit. We are just talking about a few thousandths, hope this helps.

Pettifogger · July 12, 2012, 10:16:04 AM

If you want to use light loads and avoid any possible cylinder interference use the .45 Special. Smaller case capacity and it has the same rim as the .45 Colt.

litl rooster · July 12, 2012, 10:32:24 AM

I use .45 Schoefield for my wifes New Vaquero's no issues I have used both .45 colt and .45 acp dies to load them with. I got this brass very cheap. I may have bought the Adirondak Jack .45 special's otherwise.

Tascosa Joe · July 12, 2012, 10:35:11 AM

Cliff:
I have been shooting .45 Schofield in a .45 Colt for 20 years. I have never had a problem with any SAA .45 Colt Revolver I have owned. I have used ASM, Uberti, USFA and Colt. I shoot a 230 gr bullet with 28 gr of 2F. I am trying to duplicate the original .45 S&W loading. It still has a lot of recoil and smoke.
T-Joe

Major 2 · July 12, 2012, 02:50:40 PM

Quote from: Pettifogger on July 12, 2012, 10:16:04 AM
If you want to use light loads and avoid any possible cylinder interference use the .45 Special. Smaller case capacity and it has the same rim as the .45 Colt.

Cliff

FYI the 45 Special ( Cowboy ? or short ) has not been approved for NCOWS.... just saying

Cliff Fendley · July 12, 2012, 03:55:08 PM

Thanks Major, that answered another question. That and the fact I want to keep things authentic whether approved or not. Otherwise I'd shoot them little ole 38's.

pony express · July 12, 2012, 07:38:58 PM

I have used Schofield brass in my Colt's Bisley(circa early 1900's). The rims will fit, but they touch and sometimes require an little extra push to "snap" them past the next one when loading.

Driftwood Johnson · July 12, 2012, 08:06:21 PM

Howdy

I have no problem chambering and firing 45 Schofield in either of my 2nd Gen Colts.

However the ratchet teeth design on a Ruger is different, there is less clearance near the ratchet teeth. I have two 'original model' Vaqueros, and each one has one chamber that will not accept the larger rim of the Schofield cartridge.

Here is a photo that shows the difference in the designs of the Colt and Ruger ratchet teeth. You can clearly see how much less clearance there is with the Ruger.

Since this photo was taken I have filed down the ratchet teeth a bit on one of my Vaqueros, and it will now chamber 45 Schofield in all six chambers. The other one, which I have not done the filing on, still will not accept Schofield brass in one chamber.

Note, these comments are only about 'original model' Vaqueros, I have no experience with a New Vaquero chambered for 45 Colt. Also note that not all 'original model' Vaqueros have this problem, but mine did.

Regarding conversion cylinders, I have two conversion cylinders made by R&D for the 1858 Remingtons. When first purchased, one of these cylinder would not accept Schofiled rims, the counterbores for the rims were too small. I had a gunsmith open up the counterbores slightly so they would accept Schofield rims. It is my understanding that the current crop of six chamber R&D cylinders for the 1858 Remington will now accept the larger diameter Schofield rims.

This photo shows how my reworked R&D cylinder will now accept Scofield rims.

Cliff Fendley · July 13, 2012, 08:46:41 PM

Thanks everyone, I think I'll get some Scholfield brass and try it.

litl rooster · July 15, 2012, 04:00:21 AM

Driftwood that's interesting I guess I'd had never tried some in my older Vaquero's.

Pappy Myles · July 15, 2012, 09:34:47 AM

Guess I got lucky, I have an pair of the old model vaqueros in 45 colt and don't have a problem usint star line 45 brass. Good pictures and comparison, by the way. A little off the subject, I ve installed the power custome half cock hammers on my OM's and have notived at half cock, the cylenders index to the loading gate like they are suspose to, but I do have some problems loading the scofields as they bind against the frame while loading. Looks like I have some more fitting to do on the spin paw to get it to index in the loading gate properly.
I find I like the 45 scofield with black (and substitutes) cause I can use a reduced load without filler.

Slowhand Bob · July 16, 2012, 08:57:23 AM

I gravitated to the Cowboy special as a way to solve several perceived bp loading problems. No doubt about it, most of these were for playing SASS and producing the fastest loading, cleanest shooting rounds possible for the sport. I seriously doubt that there are many who can afford to approach within even 90% accuracy in duplicating an original round for SASS play. It should be remembered that the big 44sped/mag and 45colt/schofield were preceded by by shorter big bore cartridges and while the modern short 44 and 45 cases may not be exact duplicates of the early Henry and Russian rounds, they are close enuff for game play.

Grapeshot · July 19, 2012, 02:02:10 PM

Historically speaking, the .45 Schofield could be loaded and shot out of Colt SAA's. After the Army addopted the S&W Schofield they found that the Schofield would not chamber the .45 Colt Governmet round, but would chamber and shoot the shorter Schofield round.

The Army then ordered that all .45 Caliber revolver rounds would conform to the shorter Schofield patern.

I know for a fact that the Schofield will not chamber in the DA 1878 Colt .45 or the early R&D Conversion for the 1858 Remington. They will, however chamber and fire in the M1909 DA .45 Colt New Service and the Colt Anaconda.

I solved the conversion's problem by shortening the .45 Colt cases to .45 Schofield length to shoot lighter loads out of it. I also had to use a light .45 caliber bullet or that gun would shoot high. I finally got it to shoot to point of aim with a 165 grain, hollow based bullet under 25 grains of Goex FFG.

Cliff Fendley · July 19, 2012, 02:23:43 PM

Thanks for the responses.

I thought about just shortening some Colt cases but since I will still be shooting 45 colt at times I thought the different head stamp would be very beneficial in identifying them without having to take them out of a the cartridge loops or box to compare length.

If the Scholfield brass is a problem I'm figuring I can take a little off of the rim of the cases just as easy as shortening colt cases.

Junkman · July 19, 2012, 02:59:09 PM

Easier in fact.

Jack Sterling · July 20, 2012, 02:16:54 AM

Quote from: Cliff Fendley on July 12, 2012, 07:29:29 AM

Also can I use my Lee 45 colt/454 casual dies or will I need different dies?

I've been using Lee 45 colt die set reloading 45 Schofields too. Only problem that I've had was powder through expanding die body being too long for allowing the case mouth being flared and powder measure actuated. I solved the problem just simply grinding the die body a tad shorter.
Of course the #11 shell holder won't work with 45 Sch. brass #14 being the correct one.

BR,

Jack