pattern

[davemyrick]

Davemyrick,

Point of fact (or at least strong congesture) was that the South was pretty broke by 1862 ... and the on of the best suppliere of weapons was the Notrh through 'battlefield donations'. So it would not be out of the ordinary for a confederate cavalryman to ride by with a totally northenn (i.e. black) leather rig with a 'donated' Nothern Collt or Remington in the holster and a muzzleloading shotgun or rifle as it's partner ....

While it is true that the south was not as well equipped as their northern opponents, any suggestion that they were dependent on battlefield pickups to supply their troops is simply not true. there were items that were known to be in short supply and among the mounted troops, some of these were sabers, carbines, forage and remounts.
The type of equipment a trooper would have also depended on the theater he operated in as well as time period. Early in the war, he was supplied and equipped either with the prewar militia unit he served with or with those he brought with him from home. As the war progressed and equipment wore out from use, it was replaced by the Confederate government. In the eastern theater from the Richmond and Clarksville Depots. In the western theater, the replacements came through New Orleans and Texas and followed no specific pattern.
The horse equipments from Clarksville and Richmond were known to be of two patterns, either the Jenifer or a copy of the Federal McClellan. Also rather than the cumbersome separate halter and bridle the Federal troops used, many southern horsemen seemed to prefer the halter/bridle. A halter bridle is a one piece affair in which the bit buckles into the halter.
As for arms, there was a universal shortage of sabers and carbines. Rather than ration out sabers a few per company, they were concentrated and entire companies were armed with sabers and revolvers and used accordingly. The balance of the companies were equipped with long arms. these varied widely and infantry weapons were not uncommon as well as the aforementioned shotguns. Revolvers and long arms of various patterns were being manufactured at various places under contract to and directly by the Confederate government.
Probably the worst time for equipments flowing to the southern troops was the 1862 campaign season as the prewar stuff had worn out from use and manufacturing had not yet come up to speed. By the `63 campaign season, the southern armed forces were equipped as well as if not better in some cases than their federal counterparts. This was across all three branches of the army. After `63, southern manufacturing began to wane and could not keep up with demand. Food stuffs, forage and weapons were the majority of items that became more and more scarce. Arms, equipment and ammunition production in the east continued up until the fall of Richmond in `65. As a matter of fact when Richmond was being evacuated, all public property was burned and destroyed. When the arms depot was fired, the resultant explosion of accumulated ammunition was of such high order it was heard by troops in the trenches at Petersburg.
If anyone would like to do their own research, please let me know and I will forward my references.

Dave Myrick

[Doc Hawkins]

Alas, the pattern I made several years ago based on my own guestimations have not survived

Dave: I would love to have an accurate pattern for an army holster. I love the style and have always wondered how they were really made.

[davemyrick]

Alas, the pattern I made several years ago based on my own guestimations have not survived

Dave: I would love to have an accurate pattern for an army holster. I love the style and have always wondered how they were really made.

To everyone that would like a pattern, please forward to me via message, your mailing address where I can send the pattern. Give me a few days and I will get the pattern transferred to paper and some photos of my antique holster showing some details together and sent out. I have several other projects going at the moment so I will need a few days.

As to how they are made, after cutting, dying, creasing and edging all pieces:
1) The flap is stitched to the back side if the holster body.
2) The belt loop is riveted to the back side of the holster body without making a loop
3) The belt loop is turned back on itself to make the loop, stitched down with two rows of stitching and finally a rivet is set at the ends of each row of stitching.
4) The closure button is set and a round leather backer stitched to cover the burr of the closure button
5) A reinforcing piece is stitched to the inside of the back of the holster body at the extreme top along the edge of the piece
6) Both edges of the holster body are mitered
7) Beginning at the top, the holster is stitched closed
Toe plug is stitched in at the bottom of the holster
9) The left over end of the reinforcing piece is stitched with two parallel lines if stitching to the face of the holster
10) The closure tab is located on the flap and stitched in place with a single line of stitching.

All stitching is done at 8 stitches per inch. A small hole is located and punched into the center of toe plug. All pieces are to be creased, edged and slicked.

Leather used is vegetable tanned 8 ounce dyed black on the grain side. Also needed are 5, #12 copper rivets with burrs and one brass closure button and burr. Thread should be 3 cord linen, size #18, well waxed.

I have invested a great deal of time researching the leather goods of this time period and am more than happy to share that research with anyone interested. Someone mentioned earlier the common misnomer that all CS leather goods were brown. Many leather goods produced in the south exist today with a brown coloration to the leather for a number of reasons. None left the manufactures that way though. All leather of the period that was not buff, was bark tanned. This is a quite different process from the method of tanning leathers today. The type of bark used to produce the tannins to be infused into the raw leather affected how the leather behaved. Hemlock bark was often substituted for the maple and oak barks preferred. The result was with the dye stuffs of the period, the hemlock tanned leather, dried rapidly in the weather and the smooth finished grain flaked off. Unfortunately there was no way of knowing if a piece of leather was tanned using hemlock bark once the process was completed. today those hemlock tanned leather pieces still survive and appear to have a well worn brown surface. Also the dye specified in the army manuals, was an iron based mordant set dye. When applied the iron reacted with the tannins in the hide and produced a black color. The mordant "set" the color. Typical mordants used were copperas (copper sulfate) and logwood. Mix the copperas with the powdered logwood and the dye becomes a very rich black that is very color fast. Omit the expensive copperas and only use the logwood and you still get a rich black color to the leather. The downside is when subjected to sunlight the logwood breaks down and allows the iron in the dye to oxidize and it turns the leather, you guessed it, a nice rich brown color.

I'm sorry this post ended up being so long and I'm sure its more than most wanted to know but I wanted to answer a few questions and try to put to rest a few myths.

Dave

[Boothill Bob]

You got mail 

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Hi guys,

I ran across this today ...

4) John Worsham served under General Thomas Stonewall Jackson. After the war he explained how the Confederate Army was always short of weapons.

At the commencement of the war, the Southern army was as poorly armed as any body of men ever had been. In the infantry, my own regiment as an example, one company had Springfield muskets, one had Enfield, one had Mississippi rifles, the remainder the old smooth bore flint-lock musket that had been altered to a percussion gun. The cavalry was so badly equipped that hardly a company was uniform in that particular; some had sabres, nothing more, some had double-barrel guns, some had nothing but lances. It did not take long for the army of Northern Virginia to arm itself with better material. When Jackson's troops marched from the Valley to Richmond to join Lee in his attack on McClellan, they had captured enough arms from the enemy to replace all that were inferior, and after the battles around Richmond all departments of Lee's army were as well armed.


Remember, I had said that " Point of fact (or at least strong congesture) was that the South was pretty broke by 1862 ... and the on of the best supplier of weapons was the North through 'battlefield donations'. So it would not be out of the ordinary for a confederate cavalryman to ride by with a totally northern (i.e. black) leather rig with a 'donated' Northern Colt or Remington in the holster and a muzzle-loading shotgun or rifle as it's partner ... " The italics being mine ....

[WaddWatsonEllis]

BTW, does anyone have a pattern for a Slim Jim style holster?

I could buy one but have the ego that I would rather make my own if I had a pattern to go by ....

[Marshal Will Wingam]

What do you want it to fit? I might have a pattern that will work for you.

[Doc Hawkins]

Great post, Dave!

And you've got more mail

[Boothill Bob]

What do you want it to fit? I might have a pattern that will work for you.

Should fit Navy, Army and Remington.. but one of them would be nice, then I can fit the pattern for the outher guns.

[davemyrick]

Hi guys,

I ran across this today ...

4) John Worsham served under General Thomas Stonewall Jackson. After the war he explained how the Confederate Army was always short of weapons.

At the commencement of the war, the Southern army was as poorly armed as any body of men ever had been. In the infantry, my own regiment as an example, one company had Springfield muskets, one had Enfield, one had Mississippi rifles, the remainder the old smooth bore flint-lock musket that had been altered to a percussion gun. The cavalry was so badly equipped that hardly a company was uniform in that particular; some had sabres, nothing more, some had double-barrel guns, some had nothing but lances. It did not take long for the army of Northern Virginia to arm itself with better material. When Jackson's troops marched from the Valley to Richmond to join Lee in his attack on McClellan, they had captured enough arms from the enemy to replace all that were inferior, and after the battles around Richmond all departments of Lee's army were as well armed.


Remember, I had said that " Point of fact (or at least strong congesture) was that the South was pretty broke by 1862 ... and the on of the best supplier of weapons was the North through 'battlefield donations'. So it would not be out of the ordinary for a confederate cavalryman to ride by with a totally northern (i.e. black) leather rig with a 'donated' Northern Colt or Remington in the holster and a muzzle-loading shotgun or rifle as it's partner ... " The italics being mine ....

After the war ended, there was a lot of momentum to perpetuate the "lost cause" and to explain it away, lay blame etc. I would suggest researching the Official Records of the War of the Rebellion as well as Ordnance returns for information regarding the equipment and arms used by regiment and by theater.
Dave

[WaddWatsonEllis]

Dave Myreck,

I am sure you are correct.

[Dalton Masterson]

BB,
I am sending you a facebook message...

[will ghormley]

Just noticed this thread.  If a Confederate Soldier needed a belt, he would find a US belt some Union feller wasn't using any more.  He would turn the buckle upside-down and backwards.  It would then stand for "Southern Nation".  You can find it in Civil War Photos of Rebs.

Will

[ChurchandSon]

Mr. Will, this is from the Coster Avenue Mural at Gettysburg.
This is only part of the 80 foot painting....note the buckle ...........Randy

[davemyrick]

I don't know why I find this stuff so irksome, but I do. By and large the use of Federal accoutrements  by Confederate soldiers did not happen. Think about this for moment folks. When two armies meet and do battle, they both have to be ready or it doesn't happen. Belts, cartridge boxes, cap pouches, holsters, weapons, ammunition etc are all tools of the soldier's trade. If he doesn't have them, he isn't able to fight. In addition, in order to strip the dead of anything, the "stripper" needs to be in possession of the field of contest at its conclusion. After mid 1863 this didn't happen very often for the southern armies. More importantly, manufactories in the South were ramping up production of and supplying very well the needs of the Confederate military. Bulk leather, finished leather goods, completed uniforms and bulk wool for the making of uniforms were pouring into the South through the blockade as well as through Texas via Mexican ports. It is an ironic fact that when Lee's army surrendered, they were better clothed and had newer equipment than Grants men at the surrender ceremonies. The things the South became short of were food and bronze for heavy weapons production. Yes the dead were stripped of their clothes, shoes, weapons, equipment and food. Both sides did it. Military equipment was considered public property and it was collected by the victors, sent to the respective Ordnance or Quartermaster department and inspected. If found acceptable the items were issued. Condemned items were destroyed or stripped of any useful materials.
All of these things are documented and can be found in the Official Records, as well as in letters, diaries and the like from the men that were there, not an artist or a reenactor.

Dave

[Boothill Bob]

Very intresting facts there Dave....

[will ghormley]

One should never say never.  There are very few absolutes in life.

Here is a story that contains information about the dead Confederate soldiers who were buried after the Battle of Glorieta Battlefield.  I use to drive pass this place every time I went up to the line cabin at the summer grazing grounds my granddad leased from the BLM.  Anyway, the Confederate soldiers were identified by the upside down U.S. buckles buried on the bodies.  The article explains that C.S.A. buckles weren't issued that early in the war.  These Confederate soldiers were mostly Texas Rangers and Volunteers.  Don't know if that would have anything to do with them not having proper buckles.

http://www.thegeozone.com/treasure/new_mexico/history/nm_history5.jsp

Here is an ambrotype #5149 of a Confederate soldier wearing a small oval U.S. buckle.  The description says it was left over from the Mexican War.  Cant tell from the photo if it is upside down or not.  But, it is a Confederate wearing a recycled U.S. buckle.

http://www.historicalshop.com/sitecontents/photography/confederateimages.htm

Don't know how often it happened that Confederate soldiers wore recycled Union gear, but here are two documented historical accounts of it happening, one with ambrotype to prove it.

Will

[davemyrick]

Will,
Indeed the photo you linked to shows a man wearing an 1839 pattern US belt with plate, cartridge box with shoulder belt and breast plate and what appears to be an 1816 or 1842 US musket, an overshirt and a civilian hat. It's a very nice example of someone equipped from the aging stocks of war material remaining in storage at arsenals around the country at the beginning of the civil war. Also of interesting note is that as usual with ambrotypes, the image is reversed.

I did not say that the use of captured equipment never happened. Any historian studying the period in questions knows that it did, by both sides. Particularly early in the conflict when weapons were in short supply. However, as I stated previously, the standing orders to the men in the field were that they were to collect the items and turn in for inspection and redistribution. Obviously a man in dire need of something, canteen, belt, overcoat, shoes etc would take what he needed before he turned in the rest and this leads to isolated incidents. The extent of the pilfering varied according to theater as well, not just time frame.

All too often folks like to think that it's perfectly ok to use the other side's gear simply because its easier or less expensive to obtain the right stuff.

Dave