Questions on Wickett & Craig, Herman Oak

[JD Alan]

I've got the W&C website pulled up, and it looks like the only leather for tooling is 8-10 oz. I have a small Tandy Spliter (God bless E-Bay, got it cheap!) so I could skive something it if was less than 5 inches wide.

Since I've only used Tandy (+ 1 piece of Herman Oak) I'm not sure what I should order: Side, Back, Shoulder. At this point I'm focusing on belts & holsters.

I can purchase Herman Oak locally, one piece at a time. The cost is higher than Wickett & Craig, but without shipping, and I can pick my piece. I think the top grade is almost 8 bucks a foot. They have several different weights too.

Any thoughts? Thanks, JD


   

[Patrick Henry Brown]

I, too, am anxious to hear the responses to this. Also, wondering if they still have the shoulders on sale like last month. Anyone?

[Freedom]

Hi JD, I have mixed feeling about what I call light leather anymore. I make a lot of Black Powder gear for folks and I have found that 8-10oz is just too light for belts. ....No need to skive this stuff, it's allready too thin.

I have had to cut the buckles out of several 3 inch belts I have made because they just broke down to fast. I have since gone to heavier leather. And for tooling, you can really put some nice deep patterns in without comprimising the piece.

The first time my local saddle maker showed me his new shippment of quality sides I just shook my head and said "I can't make holsters out of that!"  I went though all he had and everthing was around 13-16oz. I finally settled on the lightest piece he had but it was still a 11-13oz side.  WOW am I glad I did, and I've never looked back.... this makes great belts and after working, tooling, forming, and finishing, the weight just seems correct even for holsters......I get lots of repeat costumers just because I use the heavy stuff. They unwrap there package and respond back that this is the way all things in America used to be made,, and then order a bunch more stuff.

I like double shoulders but most have all the neck wrinkles so this is either a good thing or bad depending on how you arrange the darker contrasting lines of the wrinkles. They give a lot of belts and are usually cheaper with very little waste.

Sides are great and can give you some real long, quality belts out of the back. But there usually is more waste along the flank and front leg area.

[Antipaladin]

Wicket and Craig is very good leather...especially the drum dyed, hot stuffed harness. For belts and holsters you can't go wrong ordering a full back. The butt portion can be used for the belts and the shoulder portion for the holsters. I just got a back of that leather cut down to 5 oz for money belts.

If you want to have "scraps" around to play with, test out dying, cutting, etc, get the full side and use the bellies for your
experiments. You don't want to waste the good stuff on mistakes...I mean "learning experiences". Ruin one $300 back and you'll curse yourself for a week.

There are two trains of thought regarding thickness for belts. Some people like using a single piece of very heavy leather (12 - 14) if you can get it without excessive run off at the edges.The only leather I've used that meets that criteria is the JE Sedgwick stirrup butts...you can use the whole thing. Others like to use two layers of leather cut to a specific thickness from a heavier hide, and sew them together. WC does a great job on this and you can pick the type of flesh side finish (buffed or pasted). This has the benefit that you can get EXACTLY the thickness you want and can use more of the hide because they'll cut through some of the looser fibers as you near the edges of the shoulder leaving more usable area underneath. This has the added benefit that you can use two different thicknesses or even two different types of leather. For example, a horsehide bottom layer and bridle top.

You probably already know this, but be sure to cut belt straps parallel the spine...the strongest leather is the first cut nearest the spine. The direction of strength for the shoulder is perpendicular to the spine.

I'm not a professional leather worker and neither do I play one on TV and my advice is worth every penny you paid for it.  

[JD Alan]

Thanks to both of you. I've found I prefer the heavier leather as well. I would prefer not to line belts, or even holsters if I can avoid it. At this point I'm trying to make items for CAS, not so much period correct pieces.

When they say stuffed, or hot stuffed I have no idea what they mean.

I appreciate the feedback, JD 

[Antipaladin]

"stuffed" means that, unlike the work harness described underneath, the fats/tallow/waxes etc are impregnated into/througout the leather itself instead of just being applied to the surface. Have them send you a sample of both and you'll see what I mean. the stuffed leather is typically more supple and has a more waxy feel to it. I've used both...the work harness for strictly utilitarian tasks like roll cage straps on the Jeep, the stuffed for belts and holsters.

[Ace Lungger]

JD,
I make all my holsters and belts, The only holsters that are lighter are lined. I also think you might want to looked harder on there site for a got samples for stitch and  there  is 5-6, 7-8, 8-9. and heaver. See if they have a leayher shirting available.
Hope this helps!
ACE

[David Carrico]

Wickett and Craig will also split the side to the thickness you are wanting. Sometimes they may run a special on say a 10-12 oz and you want some 7-8 oz, they will split it for you. The side will be a more uniform thickness that way. If you order a 7-8 oz, one end may be 10 oz and the other end may be 4 oz.

[JD Alan]

Thanks David, I appreciate hearing form someonewho's done business with them.

Did I catch your name in the current issue of Guns of the Old West? I took a second quick look, but couldn't find it right off.

If so, congratulations! I know they got Will G featured real well.

Thanks again for taking time to respond, JD   

[Dalton Masterson]

I saw his name in there too. Way to make news, David!

I think getting them to split it to an even thickness would be a great thing! Do they charge a lot extra for this?

DM

[David Carrico]

I don't think they charge extra. Are you talking about the issue about the Guns of Appaloosa? They did mention my name, I sent the writer an email and told him I had the actual gunleather they could have photographed, but instead they had someone make what they thought it should look like. Oh well. I'm now building gunleather and saddles for the Jonah Hex movie.

[JD Alan]

Yeah David, that's the issue. I read that they had leather made just for the cover. That seemed rather odd to me. Funny how when you are looking for a name, you can't find it to save your life, yet I saw it the first time I read it and thought "That's pretty cool, I know that guy"

I just looked up Jonah Hex, 'cause I'd not heard the name before. With John Malkovick as the bad guy, it ought to be a pretty good movie. I'll be watching for the leather!

[Dalton Masterson]

Jonah Hex, as in the comic book cowboy? That will be cool.
Thanks for the info, David.
DM

[Cut]

This was my first visit to this forum, stumbled over it looking for some leather.  But great sharing of knowledge--nice to see a forum functioning as a community.  So I signed up!

And I totally agree with the assessment of the Wickett and Craig sides.  That bridle is beautiful leather to work with. 

Hope to be back soon.

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy CUT

         Welcome to our forum pard, we're glad to have you with us, and you're right, we're a very friendly and supportive group here, so feel free to join in with us.

                      Regards

                   tEN wOLVES

[Cliff Fendley]

David is right on. Wicket and Craig will split it for you no charge, I have it done all the time.

For money belts and cartridge loops I order an A grade side and have it split to 4 oz. This way it is all usable. Use the back and down the side a ways for the belts and loops and most the belly is usually usable for lining, welts for bags, etc.

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Welcome to the forum, Cut. Good to have you with us. You're in the right place. Looking forward to seeing your posts.