Need help locating a supplier of .451/.452 heeled bullets or bullet mold

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Any help would be appreciated for info on a supplier of .451/.452 heeled bullets or a dealer who may have a mold for this bullet.

Bill

[El Paso Pete]

Maybe I came a little late or maybe I'm just a little slow, but I can't remember hearin the term "heeled bullets" before.  Could ya give me hint as to what a heeled bullet is?

[Cuts Crooked]

Pete, a "heeled" bullet is one with a "shank" for a base that is slightly smaller than the diameter of the rest of the bullet.

The heel, or shank, fits inside the case of a loaded cartridge, while the part of the slug that is exposed is actually the same diameter as the cartridge case itself. This is how .22 rimfires are made. In fact I think all rimfire bullets were made this way back in the old dayz. Some early centerfire cartridges were also made this way because that's jist how they did it bakc then. The difficulties of loading these led to the use of hollow based bullets in some cartridges, and ultimately manufactures swapped over to the current method of chambering so that they could use a bullet that was slightly smaller in diameter than the case. Seems to me like I recall that this is why we have some wierd caliber designations too, like .44 is the common designation fer a a gun that actually fires a .429 slug! Something about producers using case diameter fer caliber designation! 

Meanwhile, I'm tryin' ta figger out why Bill needs a heeled bullet in .451/452? The .45s were one of the catridges that were originally designed without the heeled bullets. M'be he's loading some odd ball foreign made .45?

Hey Bill! Inquiring minds want to know!

[44caliberkid]

You beat me to the punch, Cuts, that's my question too, waddaya need a healed bullet in .451 fer anyway?

[Adirondack Jack]

Lets see now.  Either we're talking a .451 bullet size, which would mean a heel of maybe .430, (like if ya was using a .44 mag cylinder bored through and a .45 BBL) or a .451 heel, which would be a bullet of .476 or so??

The recent .476 Achilles (I think that's the designation) built buy a few gun nuts, is a heeled bullet design, using a .45 Colt cylinder bored straight through, and cut down colt brass, and a .475 Barrel.  A big soft thumper is what it was described as.

[Capt. Augustus]

The only mould for this kind of bullet, is a Rapine, as far as I know.

[Cheyenne]

Rapine, again is your best bet for a mold.  The bullet OCB is needing is for an 1860 Richards conversion, I think.  The "44 Colt", in it's true form would have used a heeled bullet with a diameter of about .451.....the 1860 barrel is really bored to 45!

Buffalo Arms carries Rapine molds     http://www.buffaloarms.com/

Old West Scrounger did too, last time I looked.....not sure of their web address.

[Adirondack Jack]

Cuts, "Jist how they did  it back  then" is a holdover from C&B days.  Imagine ya got a C&B gun, and ya bored through the back of the cylinder and faced it off straight, then put in a recoil shield, ya got yer early cartridge gun.  Onliest trouble is, like yer .22 rimfire, the chambers are straight and the bore the same size as the chamber.  Onliest way to use a gun like that is with heeled boolits.  Else the boolit would be too small fer the bore.  Then some yokel realized if ya took a .45 cylinder and a .44 barrel, ya could shove the boolit inside the case, so's it didn't get  all pocket lint and such on the sticky lubed part, which ain't no good for the BBL.

[Bushwack Bill]

My two cents worth.  Sounds like he's got a Colt 1860 Conversion in the original .44 Colt cartridge.  Cylinder bored though but the barrel is still .451 groove to groove.  Or he has an 1858 Reminton converted to .44 Colt.  Either way, he needs a heeled bullet to stick in that case whereas the rest of the bullet is .451 in diameter tapering to a point, round nose, etc.

Rapine and NEI both carry molds for this.

[Tommy tornado]

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,2199.html

[Bad Flynch]

Hoch Bullet molds, NEI Handtools, Paul Jones. All will, with the correct amount of green stuff applied, supply you with a heeled design. What are you loading a .38 Short/Long Colt or .41 Short/Long Colt? Most people really do not want to put up with the disadvantages of the heeled bullets, most notably the need for oustide lubrication.