Overshirts revisited: Suggested guidelines?

[Dr. Bob]

WBP,

I'm a bit confused here!  This thread was about Overshirts - shirts worn over a regular shirt as an outer garment.  You seem to be talking about a regular shirt that was worn under a coat!  Am I missing something?

[Major 2]

Doc
I think the thread sorta morphed about here

liten asked:

anyone no the makeup of the white shirts you see in period military photos , i no they wore either drk blue of gray, but you also white as well

[Dr. Bob]

Maj 2,

Thanks!  I thought that I missed something.1   Must not have been paying proper attention!!

[Delmonico]

At The Dept of the Missouri Muster this weekend the temp dropped to 45F overnight,  I don't have any pictures, but I just dug in my gear and drug out an extra shirt and put it on over my other shirt and suspenders till it warmed up.  Not sure if I broke any overshirt rules but it made me warmer.

[Wild Billy Potts]

Just an update here on the isue shirts. Dr. Bob seems to be correct. The earlier regs called for cotton shirting. The article I have on issue shirts was from a Company of Military Historians article by Stephen Osman titled, "A Tale of Two Shirts." In it is described details from correspondence concerning faulty issue shirts from the early 19th century and details of 2 extant Civil War era issue shirts. I'm still looking for the stuff I had on the contractor shirts and possibly another issue shirt.

[Delmonico]

Just an update here on the isue shirts. Dr. Bob seems to be correct. The earlier regs called for cotton shirting. The article I have on issue shirts was from a Company of Military Historians article by Stephen Osman titled, "A Tale of Two Shirts." In it is described details from correspondence concerning faulty issue shirts from the early 19th century and details of 2 extant Civil War era issue shirts. I'm still looking for the stuff I had on the contractor shirts and possibly another issue shirt.

Good information from both of you on militaryt regs.  I do find it funny though on this subject and others how many folks seem to think civilians had regs also on dress. 

[Rube Burrows]

What about some patterns for some authentic style overshirts?

[panhead pete]

Howdy Rube,

I used a band collar pattern form Abraham's Lady in Gettysburg.  It is an easy project.  Then I added pockets to the shirt, hand stitched cloth tape to outline and used large dome brass buttons.   It is also referred to as a battle shirt, but I believe the style continued.  The material is Civil War blue kersey wool from Chas. Child's County Cloth.  Needle & Thread in Gettysburg has the buttons and patterns as well.  Their website may be helpful as well.

Best,

Panhead Pete 

['Monterrey' Jack Brass]

R.B.

Panhead Pete (aka PHP) did a great job on the overshirt pictured in his post above and is an accomplished tailor with all of his sewing projects. I included a ferrotype partial of him below in a different overshirt he made with narrower trim, the full view in the photo shows the shirt's details well. I believe both shirts he made are from the pattern referenced in his post above.




I made an overshirt awhile back using the Chas Childs/County Cloth 'Holliday' shirt pattern. I highly recommend that pattern as it's based on a shirt period to the era and an easy one to use, just add an inch to the seam allowance to make it large enough to be an 'overshirt' and you're good to go. Note: When adding seam allowance cut the collar and cuff pieces a wee bit larger than the actual pattern but not too much, certainly not an inch, or they will be too large to fit properly. Same goes for the placket which you also might want to consider making a couple inches longer so it is easier to put on/take off the shirt when completed.

Brass

[Wild Billy Potts]

Just order the pattern a size or two larger than normal. Chas Childs offers good stuff. The uniform in my avatar was made from his patterns.

[Rube Burrows]

Thanks guys. I will order me a pattern and try my luck at sewing. 

[panhead pete]

Hey Rube,

go to Richmond Depot.  They have battle shirts on sale now for $129.00.  They are an authentic Civil War supplier so the quality and materials are top notch.  RichmondDepot.com is their site.

Best,

PhP

[Dr. Bob]

Oh man,  I can make a lot of shirts for $129.   

[Delmonico]

Oh man,  I can make a lot of shirts for $129.   

Kinda what I was thinking, could make at least 2-3 and buy a sewing machine.

[panhead pete]

Kinda what I was thinking, could make at least 2-3 and buy a sewing machine.

I suppose if one were to purchase fabric from Johann and a machine from Harbor Freight?

Perhaps Mr. Burrows would prefer a tailor to his own labour?

Kind regards,

PhP

[Wild Billy Potts]

Kinda what I was thinking, could make at least 2-3 and buy a sewing machine.

I suppose if one were to purchase fabric from Johann and a machine from Harbor Freight?

Perhaps Mr. Burrows would prefer a tailor to his own labour?

Kind regards,

PhP

Wool flannel is not all that hard to find at local fabric stores, especially in the winter. In the era most are concerned with here, machine sewing and store bought clothing was the norm.  I've got 2 working 19th century sewing machines in the house and neither of them cost more than $50. Shirts are and were some of the easiest things to sew, and that is why the shirt sewing went to the less experienced seamstresses under the US depot procurement systems. So I kinda agree $129 for a shirt that is sewn by machine, with probably only visable stitching done by hand is a little steep.

['Monterrey' Jack Brass]

Perhaps something to keep in mind would be to make future garments with a good pattern but to also have something dead-nuts on, i.e. a Richmond Depot overshirt or the like, to reference for future sewing projects. This would be especially helpful to those new to sewing their own period clothing. Unless instructions that come with patterns are so painfully detailed as to make having a properly assembled garment on hand to look at unecessary, getting an item or two made by h-core authentic suppliers is not a bad idear.

The only supplier I know of that would make having a reference piece a non-starter is W., W., & Co/Dan Wambaugh. I put together a Fed SA trouser kit (original SA trousers were 100% hand-sewn) from Dan and was very pleased with his assembly instructions. The many photographs he included detailing each step of the construction process were so friggin' good I didn't need to reference a properly assembled piece to know I got it right. However, this is likely the exception and not the rule at least for ACW military stuff.

Brass

[buffalo bill]

I just finished watching the Tobey McGuire movie "Ride with the Devil" (again). There are ALOT of overshirts in it. Almost every Southern bushwhacker has one on. It is a great movie with very nice wardrobe and equipment. Even thouigh most men in the movie wear overshirts there is a wide variety of styles represented, much like it must have been. Just my two cents. . .

[buckskin billy]

lot of great info on the overshirt. i have really been following along.

here is a couple of links to two different over shirt patterns. hope this contributes

http://www.gallarock.com/shop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=58

http://www.gallarock.com/shop/index.php?l=product_detail&p=9

[Wild Billy Potts]

Overshirts were pretty popular for a long time in our early history. I would venture that one was an easy way to have something on over the shirt sleeves, which at least in the East was considered vulgar in mixed company, and was more comfortable than a coat and/or vest. Doesn't help that the frontier era hunting shirt/smock is along the same lines and was a symbol Independence.