Transition Henry ?

[Fox Creek Kid]

By the way, I got my screws turned around.    Anyway, you could machine out the front flare on the '66 and make a Henry "slope" at the receiver rear. However, you'd have to braze up one screw hole & drill a correct one above the other and I have no idea how that spot would look when done. I've never brazed. Joss, could it be done and look presentable?

[Joss House]

I've never brazed. Joss, could it be done and look presentable?

Absolutely. As a matter of fact I did some brazing on a brass frame cap & ball revolver today. It worked out great. One just has to use a small pointed flame and keep that torch tip moving.

[Wild Billy Potts]

Anyway, you could machine out the front flare on the '66 and make a Henry "slope" at the receiver rear. However, you'd have to braze up one screw hole & drill a correct one above the other and I have no idea how that spot would look when done. I've never brazed. Joss, could it be done and look presentable?

Wonder if the old hole can be coned from the inside, chamfered on the outside and then plugged with a piece of soften brass? This method was occationally used on some muzzleoading breachs.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Yes...they did make a transitional Henry (about three total).....but try to document the actual use of one in civil an hands during the 19th century....and you won't find it.

Bill

[Wild Billy Potts]

Yes...they did make a transitional Henry (about three total).....but try to document the actual use of one in civil an hands during the 19th century....and you won't find it.

Bill

This posting has nothing to do with usage, comman, rare or otherwise. It was originally about if anyone ever did the conversion on one of their Henrys, kinda became a thread on wishes and then correcting existing rifles. And of the original 3 (if that # is correct) I have pictures around here of 2. Kinda neat.

[Major 2]

The first 3 replies answer you question...

When I first saw the gun, The Smith Shop did I concidered having one of my Henry's converted ( I LIKE CONVERSIONS  )
I thought it "Kinda neat" too....

But, like OCB I'm also try to document the actual use...I believe the number was something like 6 made..none were sold, perhaps
a Gun Makers Agent Sample saw some field tests. More than likely none ever left New Haven in the era.
Least that my research on the Henry with King's improvement.

So...it comes down to, what floats your boat.... for some Like OCB it's Documented Original Impressions,  I envy him and strive to direction.

Others have just as much fun and are fine with Henry BIG BOYS... or maybe aHollywood Silver Screen impressions...
and anything in between.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

This posting has nothing to do with usage, comman, rare or otherwise. It was originally about if anyone ever did the conversion on one of their Henrys, kinda became a thread on wishes and then correcting existing rifles. And of the original 3 (if that # is correct) I have pictures around here of 2. Kinda neat.

Whooaa.........Hold on there Silver......if that is what this thread is all about you should have been clearer in your original topic. I thought we were allowed to interject with a little bit of history here but I guess not!

So since we're talking about our likes and dislikes, I'll try one more time.....what I don't like about the transitional Henry (other then what I've already stated) is, once you break up the lines by adding the loading gate and forearm, you've lost the streamline look that the Henry is known for. Now, you can have the Henry forum to yourself.

I hope this reply is a little more to your liking since that is what we are talking about, right?

JMHO

Bill

[Joss House]

On the Rare Winchester site under Henry's at the bottom of the page they show two Henry's with the loading gate. One is listed as a experimental transition model, the other simply as a transitional model. Neither of them have the forearm. Is it possible that more than a half dozen of these were made judging by it's serial number in the 14XXX range as compared to the experimental in the 13XXX range? Transitional Henry

[Major 2]

IF we were to assume the run was consecutive 13001 to 14993 the number could be assumed excess of 1993 ..
Rather,  I believe the few Henry's improved to King's Patent were chosen at random (meaning taken out of the production line as it were and Transistionalized)

Just as the were a few Henry's Iron Frame that were case harden color ...Not many, but I've held one    and saw another on that same site.

[Fox Creek Kid]

IF we were to assume the run was consecutive 13001 to 14993 the number could be assumed excess of 1993 ..
Rather,  I believe the few Henry's improved to King's Patent were chosen at random (meaning taken out of the production line as it were and Transistionalized)...

There is disagreement among historians on the Henry evolution into the '66. You can read both sides on the "Rare Winchesters" website.

While the Henry "Transition" was probably for all intents & purposes purely an experimental model the '66 "Flatside", albeit rare & expensive today, had a total of at least two thousand I believe and would be a far neater project to make. Coolness factor is off the map IMO. 

OC Bill, I believe that a '66 "Flatside" could be made from an Uberti '66 after looking closely at the photos. A little machining, a little brazing & refitting the forearm where it meets the receiver and you're done.

Historical trivia: Winchester collectors have for years stated that the first '66 carbine sold was in Omaha, NE in Aug. 1867. However, the famous frontiersman Finn Burnett states in his memoirs that he saw one in the Spring of '67 and it was picked up from an Indian who dropped it in a skirmish out West!! This adds credence to the theory proposed by former Winchester museum curator, Herbert Houze, who stated that the '66 had its own serial number series, starying with #1, and was sold mainly abroad prior to Aug. '67.

[Wild Billy Potts]

Bill no problemo, just intended to point out the original purpose was about home smithing. I didn't even realize that Taylors was offering the Trans. Henry (probably better to call it the Experimental Henry). I like home smithing, it's my part time hobby. Got 3 modern rifles and one Isaac Haines inspired longrifle in various stages of completion right now down in my man cave. 

[Roscoe Coles]

The interesting thing is that there are a number of transitional model Henrys, using several different loading mechanisms.  I got to handle the only know carbine version of a type that uses a small brass forearm that slide forward to allow cartridges to be loaded into a closed (like a 66 rather than a Henry) round magazine tube.  The fellow who owned it pulled it out of the trash after his grandfather died.  His dad had found it in Grandad's house and threw it away because it wouldn't take modern cartridges!  The drawings and some photos of this type of experimental (and others) are in "Evolution of the Winchester" by R. Bruce McDowell.  If I were going to go to all the trouble to do a conversion I would make one of these instead of simply putting a gate on a Henry.  It would be far more interesting.

[Fox Creek Kid]

...I got to handle the only know carbine version of a type that uses a small brass forearm that slide forward to allow cartridges to be loaded into a closed (like a 66 rather than a Henry) round magazine tube...

More than one survives as the Cody Museum has one. It's called the Winchester Improvement Carbine & there are several B & W photos in Herbert Houze's book on Winchester. Almost all went to Mexico or Cuba, hence the very limited survival rate.

[Roscoe Coles]

More than one survives as the Cody Museum has one. It's called the Winchester Improvement Carbine & there are several B & W photos in Herbert Houze's book on Winchester. Almost all went to Mexico or Cuba, hence the very limited survival rate.

Interesting, as I was told it when I saw the gun at the Las Vegas Antique Gun Show more than 10 years ago, most of them were in the rifle configuration (no barrel band or carbine ring).  Still, its an interesting design and good looking.  This one was in very nice shape.