ASM Richards

[Dusty Morningwood]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=115044908

Saw this.  Thought someone might be interested.

[Fox Creek Kid]

$625.00!!! 

[Dusty Morningwood]

Didn't say it was a good deal! 

[Will Penny]

no bids, no reserve, might go for a lot less then $650.00 still 4 days on it..

[Roosterman]

Bidding starts at $625

[Dusty Morningwood]

Too bad it's not .44 Colt.  I miight have made them a discrete offer. 

[Mako]

no bids, no reserve, might go for a lot less then $650.00 still 4 days on it..

I've got the "bastard" twin brother to that revolver.  Notice anything odd?  It's an 1861 "Type 1," I haven't been able to find any evidence the '61 was converted by Colt in the Type 1 configuration.  I do know there were some Thuer Cartridge Conversions because I have even seen cartridges for the .36 caliber, but never a Type 1.  If anyone can direct me to any reference of it I would appreciate it.  There were also Type 1s made by Armi San Marco with an 1860 profile cylinder and in .38 spl. I have spoken with one shooter that has a "1860" ASM Type 1 with a 7 1/2" barrel and one with an 8" barrel.  .38 special isn't that odd to us because we see Uberti do it with the Type 2s and R&Ms.   The one I have was imported by Traditions and I still have the box.

Now I say my revolver is the bastard Brother of this one because mine actually has an Army length grip on it.  I know some people will say you could order almost any option on a Colt  in the 19th century, but it always seemed a bit odd to me.

Personally I doubt (but don't have any proof)  that Colt made any Type 1s on the 1861 because they developed the Type 1 for the Army and quickly moved on to the Type IIs and Richards Mason Conversions  I have seen a lot of  '61 conversions and almost all of them have the under-lug for the loading lever re-contoured which I have never seen on a Type 1 or Type 2 Army model.  It is interesting how they used certain styles on different models.  You would almost expect to see a '60 and '61 having the same barrel lug profile.  This replica has the lug profile commonly seen on Army models.  I have included pictures below of the commonly seen 1861 re-contoured barrel lug .

Now if you really want the brother to that pistol I'll "sell it now for $625"     which would be great deal in the new Bamaconomy...

Regards,
Mako

[Mako]

Hmmm no takers... how about $624.95?

[Fox Creek Kid]

Personally I doubt (but don't have any proof)  that Colt made any Type 1s on the 1861...

In McDowell's book there is a photo of one "tool room" experimental '61 Navy with a Richards Type I ring & ejector. You are correct in that they never made any beyond that. 

[Mako]

FCK,
Thanks, once again you have the historical reference I needed.

I have only looked through a friend's copy of  McDowell's book, I wish I had one as a reference.  I guess if I quit getting things like more pistols (like I need more....)  I could get one.

Thanks,
Mako

(on second thought maybe I do need more...)

[Dusty Morningwood]

FCK,
  I guess if I quit getting things like more pistols (like I need more....)  I could get one.

I just bought the book (got a good deal) and keep buying guns, too.  Then more reference books.  Then need guns to go with books.  It's the Circle of Life! 

[Coffinmaker]

Yep.  The circle of life.  Much more harmonious circle though, if it includes a good shot of liquor and Girl.  The girl, however has to like guns a be a shooter (Or really great looking).

Seriously though, the ASM conversions were crap.  Well, they still are crap.  About 1 in 7 actually worked and the ate Cimarron, EMF and Navy alive with warranty.  Only problem was, when the replace a gun, usually the gun sent as a replacement wouldn't work either (unless you got the "one in 7.")  At one point I had 11 of them.  OK!! I'm a sucker for punishment!!  No, 4 of them were "parts" guns.  I gutten them for parts to make the "Others" work.  I still have 5.  They all work (mostly).  The truth is/was, I'm a sucker for the type one conversion, and the ASM was the only game in town that was affordable. 
Now, as to that .......... price!!  We have to find out what the guy is smokin.  It's really good stuff.  When available "as new" the guns were MSRP at about $450 and you could pick them up all day for 3 and a quarter (less if they didn't work).  The last two I bought for parts were $100 each.  I didn't see a lot of evidence of wear on the auction offering, which means it either doesn't work, or hasn't been used enough to find out if it works.
Today, there are no parts available.  You have to make your own.  So, with the number of bad guns from ASM vs the number of "good" guns, you chance of getting a good one is actually about 1 in twenty.
The gun is only worth about $250, if it works.  $100 if it's "parts" and YOU need the parts.
So, in conclusion ............... at the price ................... its a STEAL ........... or is it STEALING??

Coffinmaker

Oh, almost forgot, the ASMs are not actual accurate reproductions of Type 1s.  Close, but no Cigar!!

[Fox Creek Kid]

It amazes me that Krause has not issued a 2nd edition of McDowell's book as there certainly seems to be a demand. 

[Mako]

What Coffinmaker said...

He's right I have one in my safe and if I don't bag it air tight you keep thinking  the dog or cat left something somewhere... (My attempt at humor tonight)

Seriously though, they are not historically accurate or very well made.  But I'll sell you mine, they are RARE and therefore VALUABLE.  Buy it now dropped to $624. 25

~Mako

[Capt. Willard]

I had two...one with a 7 1/2 inch barrel and one with the proper 8 inch barrel both in .44 colt. I sold the shorter one although it was cool having one a little shorter for the "cross draw go to gun" in a two gun rig. It times great and has great case colors, fit and finish but I have yet to fire it and am in no hurry. I agree it is the only game in town for an inexpensive early Richards but I wish the cylinder was rebated like a proper Army cylinder.
At least with the shorter 7 1/2" one you could pretend it is a gunsmith overbored 1861 navy..then the straight cylinder would be proper.

[Flint]

Did ASM ever make anything worth $625 ?

[Fox Creek Kid]

Did ASM ever make anything worth $625 ?

At one time SOME of their SAA clones were great. I had two & sold them & now regret it. They were really close to an original SAA. However, they were not worth $625 then, no.