As I Descend the Soap Box...and sit quietly

[Mako]

Redacted

[hellgate]

I carry my Ruger flat top Blackhawk with six and the hammer down on the firing pin BETWEEN case rims. It's a solid safe position. I can't wiggle the chambers under the hammer without pulling back on the hammer as in a SAA. The only problem that might come up with the hammer down between the case rims would be with a C&B conversion to 44 rimfire where a jar to the cylinder might ding the rim enough to set off the cartridge. Other than that, I think anyone who felt they needed to carry a "six shooter" to protect their life would be willing to accept the risk of filling that sixth chamber "just in case" and letting the hammer down in the safest position that would allow.

[Leo Tanner]

Far as I know, the "load one, skip one" was a result of the weak action of old Samuel's safety click.  With hammer in that second position, the primer is dead center.  Your method with the hammer at full rest between the chambers is MUCH safer than what the design intended.

     Also, who could argue with Rooster Cogburn?  
Just kiddin.  I have heard of ADs with a fully loaded Colt, but I weren't there ta see what happened.


Leo

[Rusty Spurless]

All good points & all completely valid.

However...

Until the Injuns or Griz start charging I will carry 5 in my ole Colts.
That extra round does nothing to make me feel better & I dont want the drag line on my cylinder from resting the bolt on it. 

[Dick Dastardly]

When I started deer hunting in northern Wisconsin we all had Winchester 94s.  You loaded them in the woods and carried them with a round IN the chamber and hammer on half cock.  Levering a round into the chamber is way too much noise to expect a deer not to hear it in the quiet woods.  We learned safety and we ate venison.

I frequently carry a K98 custom Mauser when hunting deer now.  When I get to the woods I carry it with the magazine full, a round in the chamber and the gun on safety.

I tend to agree with Five shots in a Six shooter for SASS reasons.  When carrying a wheel gun with six holes for bullets, including my S&W model 24, I carry it with Six holes loaded.

DD-DLoS

[Adirondack Jack]

I suppose in a military flap holster 6 might be OK. But how many of us use such a thing, or even ALWAYS use a hammer thong?

I do know one thing.  Having met a man named Harold Nye, a Ford dealer originally from upstate NY, late of Wasilla Alaska, and an avid big game trophy hunter, I'm never gonna carry an "unconverted" three screw Ruger, Colt, or clone with 6 beans in the wheel.

Ya see, ole Harold had six in his three screw, and while scrambling over a rock pile, the gun fell out of his holster, hit hammer first on the rocks, and shot ole harold in the thigh.  His hunting buddies packed him out, and in due course he made it to the hospital, and eventually recovered (an outcome nobody woulda bet on when the incident first occurred.  Ole Harold came real close to cashing it all in due to loss of blood.  He forever walked gimpy, and never again loaded six beans in the wheel of any SAA, clone or three screw that hadn' been converted, even when hunting in Polar Bear country.

[Leo Tanner]

That's why transfer bars are a beautiful thing.  They aint period correct for CAS, but we're talkin' huntin' now- differnt ball of wax all tagether.  If I'm goin inta the brush, I'm not just thinking about my saftey but that of my buddies as well and only take the guns that are least likely ta cause problems.


Leo

[Adirondack Jack]

Dang, pard, yer post reminds me of the story of the old timer who happened to be the only feller to show up at church. After a wonderful 2hr sermon, the preacher asked what he thought of it.  He scratched his chin a bit and said "If'n one of my cows showed up to eat, and none of the others did, I sure wouldn't give her the whole load. 

That said, the issue is not should Harold Nye or anybody else go to the extra trouble of fiddling around trying to get the firing pin to rest between the rims of six loaded rounds (have ya ever tried that with a .45 or even a .44 mag per chance?  there ain't a helluva lot of room), a condition that still leaves the firing pin rested on the cases and the whole shebang not quite as secure as it could be, or whether a MUCH safer choice would be EITHER a modern T-bar SA revolver, or if ya must carry a non t-bar type action, five beans in the wheel and the FP down on AIR.

yes, I agree if done very carefully, especially with those cartridges that DO leave plenty of room between the rims, it's a FAIR answer.  There are better answers.

[sundance44`s]

I can think of one good reason not to carry a wheel gun with the hammer resting between loaded rounds in the cylinder ...I don`t know of a wheel gun that the cylinder lock up bolt would be inguaged in the cylinder notches with it in this mode ...So I say it`s unsafe , the cylinder is able to get spun into a locked up mode which places the fireing pin over a loaded round ...the person carrying could fall down or be dragged down by say ..a Bear attack with out warning ..or he could fall climbing a rough hill side and slide down ......Useing a full flap holster would make it safer but then again ....whats safer than carrying a six shooter with the hammer down on an empty chamber ....when it can be brought into battery with one hand ...and when it`s needed at close quarters..which is why we carry it in the first place  , will 6 shots from a 45 really make a big difference over 5 ......the only way I would carry all 6 in the chambers is if I were loading up to take the walk into the shadow of death ...or looking to start a  gun fight at the OK corral ...When your a long way from a hospital why take chances ...we already have Murphys law to deal with ...lets not help ole Murphy out .

[Dick Dastardly]

Myth has it that in the olden days they used to keep their burying money in the empty Colt chamber.  That won't work no more.  You can't get that much cash rolled up small enough to fit in all Six chambers. . . .

DD-DLoS

[Adirondack Jack]

Here's my IMMEDIATE frame of reference on this one.  Last saturday I took my 14 yr old out for his first day of deer hunting.  I followed the convention I have always used with a lever action rifle, and had him carry with a round in the chamber and the hammer on the half cock notch.  A few hours later, as he was sitting watch i heard a shot.  Then a minute or so later, another.  I wasn't sure it was him shooting, but thought it might be, so I headed in his direction. he explained that he got bored and shot a red squirrel that was raising the devil nearby.
"What'd ya do, shoot it twice?"  I asked.

"No" he said, as his face began to get red.  I went over to look at it, then as I went back to sit down, the gun went off ALL BY ITSELF."
Of course what had happened is he racked another round into the Marlin and forgot to lower the hammer to half cock.  Then while walking, he shifted the gun in his hand and must have brushed the trigger with his glove.....

My immediate response was to go back over the manual of arms, esplain again why half cock was needed, etc.  Then I simply decided the better part of valor was to have him carry the danged rifle with an empty chamber (it does not have a crossbolt safety).  It's s shortstroked Marlin so he can bring it into action fast enough, and I KNOW it's safe with the hammer down on an empty.....

(Yeah I know, this is getting to be "the whole load"   ) Ya see, when in the woods, folks get caught up in HUNTING and little things like condition of carry NEED TO BE simple or they screw em up, sometimes with real bad consequences.  All of us would like to believe we are as cool as Askins or Skelton or O'Conner, but sometimes we find out we ain't, even if we can chew gum and walk at the same time.

[Greeenriver]

Just a casual thought on this subject, but when I was a little snot, years ago before I grew up to be a big snot, I was tought to carry a SA with 6 in the chilinder and the fireing pin down between the rims, IF I WAS CARYING FOR PERSONAL PROTECTION OR GOING INTO A SITUATION WHERE IT WAS PERCIEVED THE GUN MIGHT BE NEEDED NOW!!!!!

For simple woods walking or normal usage, like plinking or target shooting or SASS, I was tought to cary only 5 rounds and hammer down on the empty.

For years, and I mean a lot of years, I caried a SA revolver as my personal Cary Gun. This was normaly a Colt stile pistol and not a Ruger, as I found the Rugers to be heaver and don't just feel right in my hands. I always caried the SA with 6 rounds loaded and the hammer down between the rims, exactly as Skeeter Skelton recomended carying them. When I started on the police force in a small town in NM, we had to buy our own firearms and I had a Colt SA 45 at the time that I caried as my duty wepon for a few months till I could afford a DA pistol. It was caried with 6 rounds loaded and hammer down between the rims.  However, I did always cary these this way in a thumb brake holster that kept the hammer from raising enough to alow the cylinder to move unless it was cocked.

I now, when I do cary a SA for CCW, use a Ruger Single Six in 32H&R Mag with the tranfere bar and still load 6 rounds.

However, I feel perfictly safe carying a Colt stile revolver loaded with 6 rounds and the hammer down between the rims.

Not to start an argument or nothing, just me experences of a lifetime of carying and using single actions, and the advice given me in my youth by men experenced in carying and using SA's for a living, long after the DA's had arrived and been proven to be a better pick for cary guns.

Greeenriver

[springfield]

OK, just for the sake of arguement I just put 2 empty shells in my Pietta SAA in 45Colt. I lowered the hammer down in between the shell just like you wanted. It took very little pressure to turn the cylinder until one of the shells was under the firing pin again. The firing pin does NOT lock the cylinder in place like the bolt will. So I would say this method should NOT be used for casual use, like hunting. It does NOT work like the 51 and 61 Colts that have the pin in the cylinder. If I REALLY needed 6 rounds I would just leave the hammer on a loaded chamber, as apparently I have gotten myslef into a BAD situation, so the heck with safety.

[Cuts Crooked]

 Ok, I finaly got interested enuff in this topic to check it out myownself. Two Colts & three Ubertis in .45: could all turn with the pin rested b'tween rounds, pretty easy too. One Charles Daly in .357 could turn also, in that condition. BUT...an old ASM Open Top in 38 Special was locked tight with the pin resting b'tween rounds!!! I mean TIGHT too, it absolutely would not move until the hammer wuz pulled back! (It should be noted that the Charles Daly could not really have the pin between the rims, but rather it rested ON the rim edges of adjacent cartridges...too close together. The Open Top however had plenty of room to rest the pin in b'tween cartridges)

So, my take on this one is that's it's an individual matter that depends on how YOUR gun handles being carried in this condition...and what you personally are comfortable with. I would carry that Open Top with six in it... if I felt the need. But if I felt the need to pack a single action for protection, I'd be much more likely to go with a .45 or a .357 and jist stuff em with five.

[Dick Dastardly]

The Kirst Konverters in my brace of 1860 open tops only hold Five.  There is a detent for the firing pin between each pair of cylinders.  I carry them with all Five loaded and feel absolutely safe.

Of course, Walt Kirst did design them to be safe that way. . .

DD-DLoS