Leading problems with .44 Mav Dutchman Big Lube Bullets

[Grapeshot]

OK I've been shooting these bullets almost all season long.  I have two .44-40 lever guns; an 1866 Yellowboy Carbine and an 1873 short rifle.  No problems with the '66 per say, however, the '73 shown leading of the grooves in the last six inches of the barrel even though I'm getting a good lube star on the crown of the muzzle.  Both have 20 inch barrels.

A few swipes with a .45 caliber bronze brush and some Balistol and it usually comes out.  I've onl;y had to "Scrub" the bore with that brush a couple of times.

The Lube is Springfield Slim's formula.  Am I going to have to scrub the bore with J-B bore cleaning compound or fire lap the barrel?  Melting out the existing lube and re lubricating with 50/50 Bee's Wax - Olive Oil is not an option.

Any suggestions are welcome.  I've been using Goex's Pinacle as my Propellant, 777 is a bit hot for what we do.

[w44wcf]

Grapeshot,
The fact that the same cartridge recipe does not produce leading in your '66,  but does in your '73 would sure  seem to be an indication that either (a.) the barrel is not in the same condition in the last several inches or (b.) the barrel is slightly larger in the forward portion that is leading.  In either case, fire lapping or hand lapping would eliminate lead adherence.
w44wcf 

[Howdy Doody]

That is strange, Grapeshot. The bullets being equal and all. I wonder if lube although enough, could be the culprit? I shoot Marlins and I have noticed that my newest one, the one with the least rounds through it will sometimes show some flakes of lead on the patch, but the grooves clean up fine with a couple patches. I'll be interested in what others can input on this. 

[Fox Creek Kid]

Have you slugged the bore on both rifles? IMO the '73 probably has a larger groove diameter or there may be some roughness near the muzzle. Slug them both.

[Mako]

Grape Shot,
You might want to try what FCK suggested first and find out the actually bore diameter (for both the groove and land).

I had a similar situation I have several Uberti '66s , two in .44spl.  One is a 19" Carbine and the other a 20" Rifle.  The 20" never fouled with Big Lube Bullets and a bore snake every couple of stages. The Carbine leaded (maybe fouled is a better term, these see only BP)  so badly that I would get flyers after about eight rounds, which was very bad. And I mean BAD flyers, we're talking 8 or 9 inches at 35 to 40 yards.  The clubs I shoot with tend to have an 11th round bonus targets on some stages either at a longer distance or on a smaller target.  The fouling doomed me.  I lapped the barrel with a lead lap on the end of a steel cleaning rod and finished it with JB bore cleaning compound and the problem went away.

I have mixed feelings about "fire lapping."  I've never done it but I have read both pro and con about it.  Of course the same could be said about traditional lapping on barrels , men such as P.O. Ackley didn't think much of it.  Gale McMillan doesn't like lapping any barrel that is mounted, he laps them before they are cut to length and the crown and chamber are cut.  But for a Cowboy gun I don't think you will harm it with the traditional lapping, and using that same logic may apply to fire lapping as well.

You might try JB bore cleaning compound first it might even be enough to get you over that edge just don't run the lap or patch out the end of the barrel in either direction.  If your barrel started out heavily fouled you may even consider getting a Lewis Lead remover and using it with the JB first then use the Lewis Lead remover with a patch and follow last with a patch on a good Jag.  Get a good one like the Dewey or Accupro "Pro Jag".  I like the Pro Jags, don't use those short little jags you get from Hoppes or the like for lapping.  Oh, and do it from the breech end.

Best of luck,
Mako

[Delmonico]

Just a thought, don't know if the gun is new or used, but if it was used when you got it, be sure someone has not shot enough jacketed bullets in it to get some copper fouling up there.  Just a thought in case you find no other cause, copper fouling in a gun shooting lead bullets is bad.  Few folks ever go to the work to remove all copper fouling.

[Springfield Slim]

I never had a lick of trouble with my Uberti '73 rifle, but I traded it for a '66 rifle, and then the trouble started. The barrel would foul out with carbon in the middle of the barrel. The ends of the barrel woud be perfectly clean but the middle 3 inches would get some bad fouliong, messing up my accuracy terribly. Bore snaking would clean it up just fine, but I could feel it drag in the middle on the first pass.  I cleaned it up good but the problem persisted for another 6 months, and then it stopped. The only thing I could think of was that the former owner shot it mostly with smokeless and Moly coated bullets, so maybe it just took a while to get all the Moly out of the barrel. It has been a great shooter for the last 3 years now, I can go 6 stages, let it sit overnight and do 6 more without any problems.

[Grapeshot]

I ran a .45 Caliber Bronze chamber brush I got from brownell's through the "73.  After several passes I put a brass jag on the end of my cleaning rod and a patch wetted with ballistol and J-B bore cleaner and pushed it back and forth thru the barrel several times.  When I took out the patch, it was B L A C K.  A couple of more Balistol patches and a dry one showed more of the same but were getting lighter in color.  I re- swabed the bore with the J-B bore cleaner and now the patches are a dingy white color, but no more heavy fouling showing.  We'll see how it shoots come March.  I plan to slug the bore over the Christmas Holidays, but I'm sure that the Mav-Dutchman Bullets are soft enough to slug up when fired.  We'll see.