Let's talk Transistions #2

[Camille Eonich]

See this post for what this is all about and what I'm looking for please.
http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php?topic=5715.0


Scenario 2  - this one is more open ended but you have to think a bit more.

Rifle is staged on table 1 - right side of berm as you are facing targets
Pistols loaded etc and holstered
Shotgun staged on horse which is across the berm from the table.

Shotgun targets are three on the left side of the berm and three on the right side.  Pistol target are in the middle of the berm.

Stage directions read that you can start in between table and horse.  You can start with any gun and finish with any gun BUT there are six shotgun targets and you must shoot three and then another gun before you shoot the last three.  Please....no comments about the perceived fairness or lack of fairness to double barrel shooters on the three shotgun targets.   


I'm gonna let someone else start this one 'cause I hate going first ALL of the time. 

[Tensleep]

Start in the center, shoot both pistols, left first then right, holster as you turn.  Break left pulling three with left hand loading over the top, shoot three shotgun targets, move to table and lay down shotgun with left hand, retrieve rifle with right hand, engage rifle targets. Down rifle with left hand, P/U shotgun with right hand pulling three with left, engage three, loading over top.

This of course is for a right handed shooter.

[Doc Shapiro]

See revised description.

Doc

[Camille Eonich]

Pistols holstered, no directions for hands.  Let's say berms are Mason Dixon Stampede size.

[Lars]

Find this stage not understandable. Why are the targets on right and left and middle of berm? I thouigh berms were the artifical mounds of dirt on each side of shooting bay.

Lars

[Camille Eonich]

Lars

Berm
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Jump to: navigation, search
A berm is a level space or shelf separating two features.

In mediaeval military engineering a berm or berme was a level space between a parapet or defensive wall and an adjacent steep-walled ditch or moat.


In modern military engineering, berm has come to refer to the wall or parapet itself, when it is constructed of earth or sod.

The last explanation is how you are looking at a berm while we are looking at it as the first explanation...the level shelf between two features.    The actual shooting bay if you want to call it that.


Ooops forgot link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berm

[Doc Shapiro]

Let's try this again.

Starting on the left by the horse, right hand on pistol grip.  At buzzer, engage the pistol targets.  Side step to the left once while transitioning pistols. Holster left gun while side stepping to shotgun.  Grab shotgun and while loading the first round, side step the right.  In this manner, knock down the 3 targets on the left, while proceeding to the rifle position, making sure to follow SASS rules of not moving more than 1 foot with a cocked, loaded gun.  At the table, shotgun goes down with left hand while pickin up rifle with the right.  Engage rifle targets.  Rifle goes down with left hand, shotgun is picked up with right.  Shells are being grabbed on the left on the way up to meet the shotgun.  Engage the last 3 shotgun targets.

I am assuming that the movement described with the shotgun is not forbidden by range rules, and that that angle of the pistol targets is such that a reasonable shot can be made from toward the left side of the bay.  These are things that have to be worked out on site.

How's that for a gamer perspective?

[Stump Water]

That's pretty good Doc.  The stage Camille described is very close to one I wrote for this months match at the Iredell Regulators, and that's how I imagined the "thinking" person would shoot it.

You'd like the match.  I left all of the stages "open" like this one.  While there's only one stage that doesn't specify firearm order, the shooting strings are very loose and there's virtually no instruction about movement.  It's a "thinking" match.  I'm anxious to see how many times I'm asked to clarify something, how much a stage is discussed among the posse after it's read and, of course, how everyone shoots it. 

[Lars]

Thanks Camille!!

Suspect that definition of berm is out their all mixed up with the one I had in my head. Cannot recall ever seeing the definition you quote. I keep hearing things like "bermed shooting bays", where the berms were clearly the mounds of dirt on each side of the bay. Guess there must be some local slang stuff left in American English.

Just checked the only English-language dictionary I have. Old "New College Edition" The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language" 1979.
Berm: 1.a.  A narrow ledge or shelf, as along a slope, b. shoulder of a road, 2. A ledge between the parapet and the moat in a fortification.

I woulda still been lost.
Lars

[Wireman]

Oh goodie, Make your own shooting orders? I'm glad I'm going to this one! 

[Stump Water]

That's pretty good Doc.  The stage Camille described is very close to one I wrote for this months match at the Iredell Regulators, and that's how I imagined the "thinking" person would shoot it.

You'd like the match.  I left all of the stages "open" like this one.  While there's only one stage that doesn't specify firearm order, the shooting strings are very loose and there's virtually no instruction about movement.  It's a "thinking" match.  I'm anxious to see how many times I'm asked to clarify something, how much a stage is discussed among the posse after it's read and, of course, how everyone shoots it. 

"How'd that go?"  You ask.

Noooot tooooo guuuuuuud.

I knew there would be whinin' But I had no idea it would be that bad.  Seems folks don't like to use their head and prefer to be told exactly how to shoot stages.  I even got told I needed to attend ROII class so I "would get an idea of what is expected". 

There was one interesting phenomenon though.  Lower SASS badge number... louder whining.     

[Doc Shapiro]

Stump, I'm not surprised by that reaction at all.  However, if you do a few more, like one a match, they get used to it and some actually start to enjoy it.

I'd have had a great time.

[Wireman]

Doc,
I did have a great time, you'd have too.
Stump Water sure made my day day, I'll tell ya!
My SASS # is 55160 wonder does that make me an old timer now?
Funny, I was listed on the score sheet as having Badge # 0, gave DA idea to da Judge doncha'' know.
I'm sorry for Stumpy though, some folks just aren't ready for the "thinkin man's game.  I've written stages for my "home club" and it's not easy. I saw nothing that would have been dangerous, targets were within SASS guide lines; no reason for complaints, re:ROII. Heck, I know of a TG who just got ROII erized, and had been shootin fer years, ukw.
I'll say it again "Great Match Stump Water" !!
Closest thing I'll get to W3G round here. I mean run and Gun. Action in my CAS.    U know?
It was even GF friendly, till the 2 stages where the pistols were split between other guns, just shot them Double Dualist, no problem. Had 2 stages with 3 "fliers, (birds, skeet) on them, they were fun as well, I didn't do so hot with the birds, but they were still fun to try to hit. 6 Sig targets on each stage, and I'm shooting a Real 97 sg for the first time in a match, what me worry?, practice?, no way!
Still...
I'll say it again "Great Match Stump Water" !!
Thanks again.
Wireman

[Camille Eonich]

bump...for a friend 

[Digem Deep]

At the Regulators, they are kind of use to that type of stage. I often write very open stages. I enjoy having folks use their head. I don't get much whinning over it. But luckly there are 3 of us that write stages so over the course of the year they get a good variety.

[Camille Eonich]

bump for potential visitors

[Johnny Dingus]

In this manner, knock down the 3 targets on the left, while proceeding to the rifle position, making sure to follow SASS rules of not moving more than 1 foot with a cocked, loaded gun.  ?

New to this game and just finished ROI course.  I may be mistaken but thought that moving with gun was not permited in SASS it is kind of like basketball and traviling you have to keep one foot planted.  Need further advice or comments.

JD

[Camille Eonich]

Johnny you can move with a pistol in hand that is not cocked and that has the hammer down on an empty chamber.  According the SASS rules you may also move with a shell on the carrier of the shotgun if the action is open.  You may also move.  With the rifle you can move with the gun if there is not a live round in the chamber or on the carrier.

You can move with long guns that are empty and that the action is open on.  You must not break the 170 while moving.

[Kid Raven]

"How'd that go?"  You ask.

Noooot tooooo guuuuuuud.

I knew there would be whinin' But I had no idea it would be that bad.  Seems folks don't like to use their head and prefer to be told exactly how to shoot stages.  I even got told I needed to attend ROII class so I "would get an idea of what is expected". 

There was one interesting phenomenon though.  Lower SASS badge number... louder whining.     

We had a stage recently 5 pistol targets, 5 rifle targets, and 2 shotgun targets. Instructions said shoot each target twice, no double taps. Some people couldn't wrap their minds around that, they wanted to know which targets to shoot in which order. RO instructions where to repeat the intructions and no more. "Shoot each target twice,No double taps,  is the shooter ready" ?