Howdy all
I've been fooling around with walnut dye , to see what works best for me, I've found that leaving my leather work submerged for a longer time than just 24 hours at room temp. or outside temp. at least in warmer weather, but not in the sun, that I get my best results, I just did a test on three pieces of leather two were 4 to 5 ounce and one 8/9 ounce, the first one I left submerged for 5 days, and the second and third for 1 day, these pictures show the results, 002 shows the piece of leather that was submerged for 5 days, and has dried fully, and this is all the color I was able to get out of it. 004 shows all three pieces, the two on the left were soaked for 1 day and conditioned with Lexol and one coat of EVOO, I wasn't happy with the color, or depth of color.The one on the right (the one I soaked for 5 days ) after conditioning with Lexol, and putting one coat of EVOO, then putting in the sun until I got the darkness I wanted , came out beautiful, it's a dark walnut brown in color, and the depth is nice and deep, the tone and shade was just what I was after, and it looks a lot better in person.
I use plastic containers , to fit the size of my leather pieces that I'm dyeing, and I keep the lid on so it will sweat, everyday I'll stir it up a bit and move the leather piece around, this helps to get a more even dye job.
So I wanted to share this with you, the dye I made this time, was from fresh green black walnuts right off the tree, with the green skin still on , and I just filled up one leg of a ladys stocking and tied it off , I didn't crush the shells , I just put them in a big pot , and cooked it down for three days , after bringing the liquid to a boil, I reduced the heat and simmered them on a low flame for about three hours with the lid on, each day for three days , letting them cool in between, the extra day of cooking might have made the difference, but leaving the leather submerged for five days too also made a difference, this combination of methods works well. So this is the way I'm going to do the dye from now on. ::) ??? :o 8) one thing , don't let the liquid cook dry, make sure you have enough water in the pot to cover the nuts, and keep the lid on while cooking or your water will evaporate.
If you're going to make enough dye to last you for a while, you can add a 1/8 cup of rubbing alcohol to a quart of liquid dye , so that it won't go bad on you, or you can freeze it also , if you have room in your freezer you can also freeze the GREEN BLACK WALNUTS, I have some in the freezer right now and I keep adding to them every day, for as long as they keep falling off the tree. Anything liquid left over after dyeing can be poured back in its plastic container, I use what ever is handy on the plactic containers, I'm useing cat litter containers now, because they're large and hold a lot more liquid dye.
Thanks for stopping by :D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
tEN W,
Thanks for the test results....
5 days soaking is kinda hard on some of us newer leather workers.... You know us younguns that want it now.
Going to give this a try as soon as I get some walnuts.
Am currently trying USMC black mixed with evoo to get my new brown.
You know when you see Chucks brown and you just fall in love with it you start trying everything to get that perfect Brown. ;D
Johnny Dingus
Hey 10W, those are green as in picked off the tree today type of walnuts, right? With the big ugly green skin? I have been scoutin out some trees here in town, and there are a bunch of them ready to come off if now is the time. Also, what does this concoction smelll like when cooking? Do I need to do it outside? Thanks. DM
I did mine inside, Dalton. It didn't smell too bad but I'd bring it to a boil then take it outside to cool. Did that every day for 3 or 4 days. Before straining it off.
Yesterday I dunked a test holster (the one I said might go to the kid next door) in the batrch I made, flesh side up. This morning I pulled it out and turned it over. I used an aluminum roasting pan and it had ribs in the bottom. Where the leather rested on those, it left light areas. Next time I'll start with the finished side up. Tonight I took it out and it's drying in the shed now. It'll be interesting to see what the results are.
Howdy Pards
Dalton , I used GREEN BLACK WALNUTS, NOT CRUSHED, I pick them up after they fall off my neighbors tree, I don't do anything to them , not even washing them, I just put them in a ladys stocking tied it off and then in the pot with water, covering the walnuts by a couple inches with water , and cooked at a very low simmer , after reducing from a boil, keep the lid on or your liquid will evaporate, it doesn't stink like Vinegaroon does , and is totally safe to cook inside, in fact my sister inlaw wanted to know what smelled so good, so being me I asked her if she would like a bowl.
Johnny I know where your coming from , when I was younger i didn't have patients for nothing, this is one of those things you do ahead of time, and if you make enough , it will last you a long time, when I'm done I just pour it back in its container, and store it away for next time.
thanks for asking :D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Ok, next question(s), I assume you dye it first, then do your tooling? I have a coffee can full of them right now, how much do you think I will get out of them? How much are you guys making at a time? Thanks.
Dalton the first batch I made was 8 gal., and I still use this , the batch i made this time is about 3 gal., this batch is stronger than the first, and I think it's because I used the GREEN BLACK WALNUT, this time, the color I got was because I think there was more dye pigment in the leather, than the two pieces I soaked for just 24 hours.
I do my tooling first, in fact I finish my work all together including the sewing, and some burnishing, final burnishing and finishing I do later
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
:)TW,
I do think you are right about the color of the leather before you put it in the dye. The 2 peices I have had soaking were real light to start with. I am useing a very small set up to do mine, I have a hot plate that is most likely about shot, but it still works!
I am using a 2 gallon size old pressure cooker that I took the seal off, so it would not build up pressure and put the green walnuts in the hose allmost fills the pot up ad 2 litre's of water which fills it up to the top and turn it on high. It takes it about 2 hrs to come to a boil and then I let it boil for about 30 mins. and then i turn off the hot plate and let set untill that evening and then take it off, i do the next for 3 days except I add a little water every day to make up for what has boiled away, is that about the right way?
Later
ACE
Dalton, I did all my tooling first. I'll assemble it next. I didn't make enough to submerge a completed holster in it. I barely had enough to cover it laid out flat. Obviously I didn't make enough and before I do another rig, I'll need to brew up a new batch. I won't be putting steel wool in it next time so I can have that nice warm walnut color. To overcome the greying, I dumped a quarter cup of Fiebings russet dye in it. That brought the warmth back into it, but it sure isn't the color I was looking for. It actually may have ended up a little dark but I'll know later today.
For the next batch, I'll use a large kettle so I have a couple gallons. I guess I'll be hitting all the yeard sales this weekend. This is all a learning curve for me so I'm getting to find out these things the hard way. The unassembled holster is now inside drying. I expect later today to be able to see what the color actually is. I'll complete it but I expect to do a whole lot different next time. The walnuts are almost ready so I'll be gathering the hulls as soon as possible. BTW, I used the hulls that were left over after they split and the walnuts had fallen out. It's much easier than trying to get them off the nuts when they're still developing. You get to eat the nuts that way, too. 8)
My wife wants the use of the back of the fridge. This could get complicated. ;D
Quote from: Ace Lungger on July 18, 2008, 08:27:30 AM
:)TW,
I do think you are right about the color of the leather before you put it in the dye. The 2 peices I have had soaking were real light to start with. I am useing a very small set up to do mine, I have a hot plate that is most likely about shot, but it still works!
I am using a 2 gallon size old pressure cooker that I took the seal off, so it would not build up pressure and put the green walnuts in the hose allmost fills the pot up ad 2 litre's of water which fills it up to the top and turn it on high. It takes it about 2 hrs to come to a boil and then I let it boil for about 30 mins. and then i turn off the hot plate and let set untill that evening and then take it off, i do the next for 3 days except I add a little water every day to make up for what has boiled away, is that about the right way?
Later
ACE
Howdy Ace
You have the right idea, it doesn't matter what size pot you have , but the biger ones will just give you more dye in the same time of cooking, the one I use is either an 18 or 20 QT. pot , it's the blue porcelain, finished, the type I use for camping.
The color pigment in the GREEN black walnuts, seems to make a stronger dye, just cooking them right off the tree seems to do the job, also Ace I think cooking them more than two days also helps to make it stronger too, you will notice the liquid getting thicker each day of cooking, so bring to a boil and then turn the fire down to a low simmer , so that it just bubbles, this is what CB does, but were adding one more day of cooking.
Dalton there wouldn't be anything wrong with doing your tooling and stamping after you did your dye, I know WG talks about doing his this way , but you would have to be careful with your caseing , you would want to do it at the right moment, so that the leather doesn't dry out to much or is too wet, but you've done this enough to know when it's right , I just thought I put that in for others that might not.
Marshal Will, I was going to say keep the fresh side down, but I see you found this out, what ever you are going to use to dye in ( or soak in ) use something that has smooth surfaces, or the leather will be marked by any high spots , MW I found this out my ownself , a few months ago when I started doing this. if it wasn't for screw ups we wouldn't know when we did things right.
If you pards want to make the color darker, AFTER YOU HAVE DYED YOR LEATHER , AND LET DRY, and I do mean DRY, you can give the leather a baking soda/water bath, but you will want to be careful as to how much baking soda you use to the water , and don't leave it in too long, like CB SAYS not more than a minute, for a light bath use 1/4 cup of baking soda to a QT. of water, if you want it stronger go to a 1/2 to 3/4 cup of baking soda to water, but be CAREFUL if you leave it in too long it will turn your leather that was light brown to black, don't ask me how I know this just take my word, it is still a nice way to give it a little more color and it looks nice when done right and it will turn your leather darker, when you have the leather in the slurry of BS/Water just work the water and BS all over and around the leather to make sure everything has been covered , the dark brown piece of test leather that I did, didn't need the baking soda, just Lexol and one coat of EVOO.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
:)Howdy TW,
I will agree with you 100% on everything you stated! I have been cooking one batch for 4 days now, I do have to add a little water every day because of the evaporation. Since I have nothing to loose, I am going to cook this batch 7 days, just to see what I get!! I have a bigger pot, but I don't have a lid for it! But what I am using works good for me, because me and the wife are Pepsi holics, we drink 8 -2litres a week, and that is what this pot cooks up and that is what I store my dyes in!
I am going to make a new batch of Vingagroon using white viniger, just to see if there is a diff. and the white is one fourth the price as the cider viniger! I think MW uses the white type with good luck!
Later
ACE
Quote from: Ace Lungger on July 19, 2008, 10:08:28 AMSince I have nothing to loose, I am going to cook this batch 7 days, just to see what I get!! I have a bigger pot, but I don't have a lid for it! But what I am using works good for me, because me and the wife are Pepsi holics, we drink 8 -2litres a week, and that is what this pot cooks up and that is what I store my dyes in!
Lessee, cookin' pepsi and drinkin yer dye.... I see a rather large investment in teeth whitener strips. LOL, just funnin'. ;D
I mentioned to my wife about looking for a large pot at a yard sale. She suggested I use a pot we already have. One of those big suckers that have a burner to stand on for cooking turkeys in oil. We've had it for a few years and never used it. Good idea, it saves me looking all over for a pot. Not only that, if I ever do cook a turkey, it'll be all dark meat. ::)
Yeah, I did use white vinegar. I don't think there's any difference in how it works and there's always a gallon or two of it on hand around here. It's good for cleaning things.
:)MW,
That Pepsi and a shot of Walnut Dye aint half bad :o :o even better with a shot of Crown ;D
I had though you posted that, and there is a lot of diff. in price :o So next tome i go to Wal Mart, I am going to get ne about 4 gallons.
You all have a good weekend!
ACE
Quote from: Johnny Dingus on July 17, 2008, 07:32:09 PM
You know when you see Chucks brown and you just fall in love with it you start trying everything to get that perfect Brown.
Man, that's where I am. Will Ghormley's brown is doing it for me too. TeN Wolves, I think you got it!!
OK, I finished the test holster. The color is really nice. It was too grey but the russet I added really warmed it up again. I'll be making a new batch without the steel wool in it. The design is a loose copy of a holster in Packing Iron. I had to make two new stamps to do the fern pattern. I'll be making one of these (without the errors) for my next rig. Here's a pic. Notice the Will G. floral stamp. That stamp is the same as the one that was used on the original.
Howdy MW,
AWESOME look, rght out of the book!! I like the color but I like the design better!!! :o Never thought of using the FJ stamps in that manor but with the roll over stamping around the bucket realy sets it off from the norm :)
It looks period correct, as much as I would love to learn to carve, and i am going to someday, the average cowboy didn't where a super flloral carve Holster! PLEASE no one get offended, because I love to see the art work that is done to a carve holster and respect the time and effort it took to do that and I hope to be there some day, but my comment was that MW new holster hear looks lihe a cowboy holster that would be worn.
Super great job MW :) :)
Thanks For Sharing!
ACE
Errors? What errors? I don't need see no stinking errors!
MW
That's a good lookin holster
WC
Thanks, pards. There are a few changes I'll make to the shape on the next one.
Wayne, that uses those two stamps I was telling you about where I had to make a right and a left.
Howdy Marshal Will
Your holster came out beautiful, thats what's nice about the walnut dye , there are so many colors and tones you can come up with , and you can use other dyes to get different looks just by adding to the color you allready have. I really like your holster, great design, and the tooling you used and design of pattern really makes everything stand out. Well done Will. ::) :o 8) :D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Howdy Gents
I know this might be boring for some of you pards , so I'll try to make this as short as possible.
I thought I would test another piece of scrap leather, in the walnut dye, I used some 8/9 ounce vegi-tan, I left the test sample in the walnut dye for 5 days submerged, you can see the line where the leather left the dye , almost like a line was drawn by a pen, after drying my test sample out , I conditioned with Lexol and let dry for a couple hours, and then I gave it a coat of EVOO and rubbed it in well, then I sat it in the sun for a while , the color didn't come out as dark as the other test piece, but this is because i didn't leave it in the sun as long, but it still produced a beautiful walnut brown, I finished it with Skidmores and buffed it up.
Bottom line I think I get better results by cooking the fresh GREEN WALNUT HULLS for at least three days, with the lid on and a low simmer, then after cooling , putting my leather work in a smooth bottom plastic container and cover with my walnut dye ( you have to cover or you will have light spots that don't get any dye at all ) after the leather is submerged , put the lid on it and come back in 5 days, it is alright to stir the dye up a little each day if you find you can't keep your hands off it , but leave it in for the 5 days, the longer you wait the more dye pigment gets into the leather. ( IMHO )
Ace is testing some scrap, where the dye had been cooked for six days , so we'll have to see the results he gets .
Thanks for stopping by and taking a look, maybe someday one of you might want to give this walnut dye a try too
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
I put a light coat of EVOO on my test holster and it came out a bit darker. Just about right, in fact. That was with 24 hours in the dye. As soon as the walnuts are ready around here, I'll gather a batch of hulls and cook up a much larger batch. I'm pleased with the reaults. Not only that, but the holster smells like a walnut orchard. If my gun shoots more accurately, I'll really be sold. ;D
;) ;D ;D I can just about guarantee you'll shoot better, because when you,s looks good you does gooder, I think, anyhow good luck on your walnut dye, there are so many variables, in making and using this dye, it makes it fun, SO HAVE FUN ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Well, I'm not too sure about looking good, though. I'll be hanging it on a black belt with a brown bullet pouch. On the other side, I have a brown belt with a black left strong side holster on it. None of the browns match. The two blacks don't either. It'll be a real outlaw rig. ;D
Marshal Will,
"real outlaw rig" ??? ??? Have youb been hiding something from us?? Now fess up, ya hear! :o ;D ;) ;D
Some things are better left unknown. :o :-X ;D I didn't always wear this badge...
Howdy Marshal Will
I think the the different colors and shades and tones, is what makes this so authenic, there must have been a lot of mix and match back in the day, and wearing a black holster on a brown belt and visiversa, would have the norm. I like the different colors of brown mixed in with holster and gun belt , I think it looks real and authenic and it's pleaseing to the eye.
Good luck in the outlaw world, i'll try to keep this from gettig out
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Quote from: Ten Wolves Fiveshooter on July 23, 2008, 11:26:47 AMI think the the different colors and shades and tones, is what makes this so authenic, there must have been a lot of mix and match back in the day, and wearing a black holster on a brown belt and visiversa, would have the norm. I like the different colors of brown mixed in with holster and gun belt , I think it looks real and authenic and it's pleaseing to the eye.
I agree. I'm tempted to do that on my next rig. Just slight variations of the same color. Two belts, two holsters and a pouch all done that way could look really interesting. That's still undecided, though. An easy way to accomplish it would be to asssemble each piece and dye them one at a time, the same color, leaving them in the dye for a slightly different amount of time.
Quote from: Marshal Will Wingam on July 23, 2008, 12:45:45 PM
I agree. I'm tempted to do that on my next rig. Just slight variations of the same color. Two belts, two holsters and a pouch all done that way could look really interesting. That's still undecided, though. An easy way to accomplish it would be to asssemble each piece and dye them one at a time, the same color, leaving them in the dye for a slightly different amount of time.
Thats the ticket Will, different times for each piece, or different amount of time in the sun , you can just about come up with what ever color , shade or tone you want, and you're right it will look interesting, and real period. 8)
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Go for it Marshall! The one trap we fall into doing reenactment and CAS stuff is looking too perfect. Think of the era and what was available for the money you made. Sure, mismatch that holster! Or even your vest.
OK, so here's the run-down. I shot using my outlaw rig today. Brown and black and brown and black and brown. I came in 5th out of 42 overall and 1st in my category. After the second stage no one made comments on my rig. I may never make another rig again. ;D Yeah, right. ::) The new holster design works great. I'll make a few changes as I was planning and that'll be the basic design for both of them.
Marshall, I wouldn't take it personal against yer rig. It may very well be the flashy wild rag yer wearin'. Everbody's busy lookin' at yer rag!!! ;D ;)
X Horse Pen
Quote from: HorsePen Henry on July 27, 2008, 09:52:27 PMMarshall, I wouldn't take it personal against yer rig. It may very well be the flashy wild rag yer wearin'. Everbody's busy lookin' at yer rag!!! ;D ;)
;D
Marshal,
Now I looked all over this site and unless my glasses are dirtier than I think they are I did not see your rig pictured any where. 8)
I don't think your pards here will give you a hard time and I am sure we would all like to see the "Outlaw Rig" that you shot in.
You know you won't get any ribbin from us. ::)
Johnny Dingus
OK, here's a pic. Don't pay too much attention to the details. This is mostly a collection of some old stuff that I really wouldn't want out there with my name on 'em. The new rig will certainly be as correct as I can make them.
Johnny,
Is that ribbin" or ribbon? I 'spect he'll get plenty of the former but none a the latter. ;D
X Horse Pen
I stand to be corrected by myself...Marshall there ain't nothin' wrong with them holsters or belts. I'll give ya a ribbon. Nice stuff. Keep it coming.
X Horse Pen
That is a respectable rig to shoot in. Doubt any cowboy from that period would have a complaint unless you had just outdrawn him and his number was coming at him.
Looks good Marshal.
Johnny Dingus
Thanks pards. I can't say I think it looks good, but it was fun to have something on that was not the normal CAS rig. Of course, I never have that anyway, this was just a step further away from it. I did find that I liked the test holster design so I'll make my next rig based on that. Now all I have to do is choose a historically correct cartridge pouch to go with it. I have a couple designs that I'm considering. It'll probably depend on my mood when the time comes. ;D
Ok gents. I boiled green walnuts most of Friday, Sat, and Sun. I got 2 nice peanut butter jars full of black walnut juice. I put a carved holster into 2 gallon size ziplock bags, and poured both jars into the bags. It is in the fridge where a kitty cat wont mistake the bag of dye for a midnight snack. >:(
Now we sit and wait. Will pull it out tomorrow night and have a look see, but it seems to be getting darker already.
As a side experiment, have any of you ever boiled leather? It turns rock hard, and kind of curls up. I am still trying to figure out a use for that. Also cracks when flexed.
DM
Aw Marshall, them other shooters is jest jealous, is all!
Funny how things work out. The Marshal starts this and then everybody jumps on the band wagon.
DM I found a park here in town where the walnut tree had droped green walnuts so Sunday me and the wife gathered some up and then went to walmart and bought some pans and boiled up some walnuts also. When I got home tonight I lit a fire under them again.
So end of the week I may have some Juice also.
Was thinking of freezing the left over walnuts for winter time. That is the green ones I don't use now.
Johnny Dingus
Johnny, I would reccommend cooking them all up at the same time. You'll wind up with a stronger dye that you can dilute if you want to. Put a bit of denatured alcohol in the mix and it won't go bad on ya.
X Horse Pen
He Dalton,
Boiled leather was used as armor, Cuir Bouille. People differ on its uses and preparation, I have heard of boiling leather in water and in hot wax, (usually just dipped). Molding into a very hard armor, especially for shield coverings. The native americans would boil/steam bison rawhide for their shields. The shield's ability to turn arrows gave rise to the general name of Parfleche for their rawhide containers. (parry fletching-parfleche)
:) I have to agree with HP, cook up all you can now, prep it for storage and you are good to go! I got 4 gallons done and I am going to keep cooking untill they are all gone! And then I am going to cook some of them when they fall of the trees(black hulls0 and see what i get!
I am only on my second batch of nuts, I cooked the first batch down to mush, I couldn't belive that! I got 4 gallons out of one panty hose full! I have a enough walnuts to cook a500 gallons easy ;D :D ??? ::) ::)
I don't think I need that much!
You all have a good Day!!!
ACE
Howdy Gents ;D ;D
Will I'm happy to see some of you Pards getting involved with making natural walnut dye, I think if you use it and try different ways of doing it , the more you,re going to like its lasting qualities, I really like the fact that this dye goes right into the leather almost through and through, but you can add different shades and tones, by mixing a little spirit dye with EVOO or Neatsfoot oil, with rubber gloves on , i'll take a rag and get a little spirit dye on it and then dab it in some oil, and then rub it in the leather, you can do this to change the color a little or to give it an antique look by varying the shade and tone in certain areas. there is no end to what you can come with. so good luck with this. ??? ::) :o 8) ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Ok gents. Here is 1 day (well not quite 1 day) of soaking in walnut juice. It has been out about 2 hours and is still plenty wet, so is dark yet. I am gonna try (TRY) to do a day by day comparison and see what happens.
DM
DAY ONE
Howdy Dalton ::) :o 8)
Nice job on the Dodge City holster, you did a nice job of putting it together, and you said you couldn't carve, will you can't say that anymore, it really looks good, good luck on picking the color your after. :D ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Thanks 10W. I have a walnut question. Do you guys put the walnut in whole and boil it? Or are you cracking them up somehow? Today I finally got the outer layer to peel off while boiling, so have what looks like boiling liver surrounded by rocks now. I will be adding this to the previous mix I had the other day, so it wont matter too much if its the same. DM
I have to agree with TW, great job Dalton!!! Can't wait to see what it look's like in the stages you doing! I am going to get another container tomorrow, and start testing as you are doing!
Dalton, i put my in a leg of a lady's hose, and cook it that away, it will boil down to mush, so you do not have to crack them up!
Once again
Great Job!!
ACE
Dalton, Ace pretty much covered what you were asking me, Just pick them up off the ground, put them in a ladys stocking, tie it off and put them in a pot , bring to a boil, and then reduce to a very low simmer.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Quote from: Johnny Dingus on July 29, 2008, 12:11:38 AMFunny how things work out. The Marshal starts this and then everybody jumps on the band wagon.
Actually, Chuck Burrows started it all with his post of how to do it. We can thank him for the great idea. All I did was start playing with it.
Quote from: dalton masterson on July 29, 2008, 06:55:46 PMThanks 10W. I have a walnut question. Do you guys put the walnut in whole and boil it? Or are you cracking them up somehow? Today I finally got the outer layer to peel off while boiling, so have what looks like boiling liver surrounded by rocks now. I will be adding this to the previous mix I had the other day, so it wont matter too much if its the same. DM
You only need the green hulls. I wait for them to split on the tree so the walnuts can fall out. Then I gather them up. I used dried ones for my first batch but that isn't as good as using the green ones. The next batch will be made with green ones.
Really great tooling, Dalton. That Dodge City holster is really nice. I agree, you have to lay claim to being able to tool leather, now. Nice work.
Well heck. The Walnuts I got were pulled off of the tree. They never hit the ground at all. Oh well. I finally got the green part mushy, and now its workin on the shell itself.
Darn, I have been telling people when they ask me to make a holster that I cant carve and will just do a border or stamping. Dang. ;D
DM
DM,
Yer in the big time now!! ;D And just think of fun you will have carving! WOW! ;D
Would any of you gents with walnuts sprinkling your lawn be willing to sell some to a guy in the desert? Like me?? I can't find the dang things even in the stores (well, the shelled ones I can find).
What part of Arizona are you in? When I was living in Kingman, all the side canyons on the East side of the Hualapai mountains were full of black walnuts. You may have some close by.
Well, I'm quite a few hours south (Tucson), but that info means they could be close by. I should try some roadside joints that sell nuts.
Remember, you don't want the nuts. Just the soft hulls around the outside of the shells. They don't come on the nuts when you buy them.
Santee , talk to Ace, he said he'd ship them to you for the price of shipping, and I don't take the green hull off on mine I use the whole nut just the way it feel of the tree, there isn't any work to this at all , just the time in cooking , just put them in a ladys stocking tie it off , put them in a pot , bring to a boil and the reduce to a simmer,with the lid on, cook for a minium of two days , although I've found you get a stronger dye if you cook it three or four days, cooling off between days . the color you get will depend on how long you leave your leather in the dye, submerged and covered and after the dye has cooled, you don't want to cook it. And MW is right Chuck Burrows is the one that shared this information with us, I'm just seeing how far we can go and how many levels we can take it.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
I checked the link that Major2 gave us a while back, but they don't seem to offer black walnut hulls any more. I did a search online to see about a source for them but haven't come up with anything yet. If anyone finds a place to get hulls in bulk, even hulls other than from black walnuts, be sure to post it here.
Howdy all
For those looking for walnut hulls, the web site below is where I got my first bag of hulls from , just go to this web site , and give them a call, this a good source of hulls for those of you that don't have black walnut trees around, or just want to have them brought to your door.
TW ;) ;D
http://www.kylecarrollart.com/walnutdye.html
Ok gents heres Day 2.
I am going to make a post of all the pics separately when this is done. Maybe the Marshall can put it up top in the stickied how to post. Might make a good chart to see how long you should leave them in for different colors.
Day 2 after 2 hours drying. There was also an abundance of sunshine on day 2 compared to the cloudy day 1. Is definately not as pale as day 1.
Deffinatley more color. Would be great to compare how long. But that will change for everybodys own mixture. We still could get an Idea if yours took 3 days to get to this color and mine took 5 days then the right color for me will be reached in 17 days....
give or take a couple. :D
Great Idea, how much liquid do you have out of how many walnuts that you cooked? And did you squeeze the remaining juice out of the walnuts each night or at the end of your cooking?
So far I've only been boiling for about 1/2 hour a night and tonight will be my 4th night.
The other thing that is going to be hard for me is soaking the product for 3 or 4 days when I want to be done with it. Gotta learn patience I guess.
Johnny Dingus
Great link, 10W. Thanks for that. I'll order some. It'll be interesting to compare the results between the black and English walnut hulls.
Dalton, that holster is taking on a real depth, now. It'll be interesting to see what day 3 produces. Your color should be rich and lustrous when you achieve the shade you want. Looking forward to more real-time pics. Thanks for sharing.
Johnny, this mix is not as strong as the one I am making now. I am using just a regular cook pot, a large coffee can full of the entire walnut, and enough water to start them floating. Boiled and boiled for basically 3-4 days off and on. If I was home, they were cooking. After that, they outer part was black, but it was still on the shell. That is the mix I am dying with now. I got 2 of the bigger peanut butter jars full of juice. All I did was scoop the whole walnuts out and pour into my jar. Its dark, but I can see light thru it.
The batch I bottled tonite was the leftovers from before. The outer hull became mush and the nuts were bare shell, but whole. I boiled them for a 2 days, but longer time. I got 1 peanut butter jar, but its VERY dark with no light thru it. Probably how it should be. I did put on rubber gloves and squeeze it into a strainer to get as much juice as possible.
The batch boiling now is the leftovers again, which are now mush. I also took the nut part and they broke easily into the pot, so I am gonna boil the shell and fruit into submission as well. Might as well I guess. :P Maybe I will get a different shade that way.
I would say you should boil then let it simmer until you go to bed. Just dont let it go dry. Keep adding a little water if needed.
DM
I just ordered some of the black walnut hulls and will also gather some of the English walnut hulls locally. I'm really interested to see how the colors compare.
Day 3. Out of the mix for about 4 hours today. Took it to work and laid it on my dash for a little suntanning. Is mostly dry for the picture, so is showing the finish color better.
It seems the cuts are getting darker, but the body is about the same as yesterday.
Day 3
That's starting to get some definition, Dalton. How dark would you like? You may have to boil it down more to get a darker shade. The cuts darkening are a nice look. It makes the pattern stand out. Remember that the color will be slightly darker after you oil it. That could be a great color without much else unless you are looking for a darker brown.
Thats kind of what I am thinking Marshall. The color now does look pretty good. Its a single holster, so it dont really matter what I make it look like. I think that tomorrow may be the last day of this test.
I need to get more walnuts as my mush is pretty much done for. The next one should be darker from the get go, as this dye is probably more water than walnut. DM
Thanks for the pictures along the way Dalton. It has been interesting following yer process. I am eager to see this holster when ya get it oiled and waxed up. It sure is a nice one.
Many thanks,
X Horse Pen
Think I'll go with Ace!
Ok gents. I pulled it out first thing this morning, and kept it on my dash all day turning it every once in awhile. At lunch, I gave it a shot of olive oil, and just gave it another coat of oil a few minutes ago. I will post some pics tomorrow after I give it a coat of skidmores and do my edges. DM
Sounds good, Dalton. It'll be nice to see it finished.
After umpteen years with the same photo, you change it. I looked at your post and thought, "Who's this?" Then I read your name. LOL, shows you how used we get to something. Maybe I'll try another photo one of these days.
Don't rush it Dalton, but I am lookin' forward to seein' it finished too.
Yep Marshall. Its hard for me to pick out my posts now too. If you look close and squint, there is actually a big fireball in the middle of that smoke from the left hand gun.
I am wearing the holster around now, and dont think I like the ride of the Dodge City too much. Just feels different to me. Oh well. DM
Well gents, here it is! I opted not (forgot) to sew the outer part of the loop, but its glued and edged, so.....
As neat as the Dodge City holster looks, it is not the style for me. I just dont care for the ride, and it seems hard for me to get a good grip on the gun to pull it out. Maybe the back is too high.
This is the final result with a good coat of Skidmores, then about 2 hours on the dash of my Galaxie cruisin around today.
Question for you experienced carvers.... Do you cut around the flower center??? I did, and think it looks terrible. Should I just bevel it and not cut? DM
That looks really good, Dalton. The color is just right. I never cut around flower centers, but in the picture, yours look fine. Nice work. I also like the look of the Dodge City holsters but find the Slim Jim is more comfortable IMO.
Howdy Dalton
Your Dodge City holster came out nice, and the dye gave you a nice shade, I have two holsters submerged in my walnut dye now, I'll take them out next Thursday, and hopefully I'll get the dark walnut color I'm looking for, I'll have to wait and see. Anyway good work Pard.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Dalton, that turned out real nice.
Flower centers? I don't cut or bevel them. I use a great big cammy to form the circle with a overlay of 4 placements and hits to make the circle then I use a seeder in there.
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d133/lennowenoxie/P7100060.jpg)
Don't mind the color reversals on the scrap. It was only an experiment. But....I think you can see how I treat the flower centers when using a seeder.
X Horse Pen
Thanks HP! That looks a lot better than my version! DM
Yer welcome, Dalton, and thank you for the compliment. I think this way makes the seeds look like they are down inside the petals and the petals come up and out from the seeds.
Maybe it's my wild imagination. ;D
Watchyerhair,
X Horse Pen
Quote from: dalton masterson on August 02, 2008, 09:45:13 PM
Well gents, here it is! I opted not (forgot) to sew the outer part of the loop, but its glued and edged, so.....
As neat as the Dodge City holster looks, it is not the style for me. I just dont care for the ride, and it seems hard for me to get a good grip on the gun to pull it out. Maybe the back is too high.
This is the final result with a good coat of Skidmores, then about 2 hours on the dash of my Galaxie cruisin around today.
Question for you experienced carvers.... Do you cut around the flower center??? I did, and think it looks terrible. Should I just bevel it and not cut? DM
Howdy
If I use a center stamp, I will use a camo around it. If it is a seed pod I will cut and bevel it.
WC
I have another batch of English walnut hulls cooking on the BBQ side burner. I need to stretch what I've already made so I can completely submerge a new holster I'm working on after it's finished.
Quote from: Marshal Will Wingam on August 04, 2008, 01:39:50 PM
I have another batch of English walnut hulls cooking on the BBQ side burner. I need to stretch what I've already made so I can completely submerge a new holster I'm working on after it's finished.
That's good Will, leaving it undisturbed while submerged will get you the best results, and when you get that package of Black Walnut hulls , you can take what you have left from your old batch, and use it instead of water to cook the new batch, it will just make it better, and richer. you don't have to worry if you added alcohol to that old batch , the alcohol will disappear after 5 min. of cooking. when it comes to drying , you want to only do your drying as little as possible, putting it in and taking it more than once is harmful to the leather, so you really want to do your testing on scrap for this, when you fine the amount of days it takes to get the color you want , then use that day figure to dye you project, but only dry once on your test pieces, if you test a piece of scrap for two days, dry it, see if you like it, but don't put it back in the dye again, if you are going to try a third day then start over with a fresh piece of scrap,too much in and out is just hard on the leather but it will also effect the color of the dye you will get into your leather. I have a couple of holsters submerged right now, and they will be there for 5 full days, the only thing i will do is everyday swish up the liquid a little and thats all, they will stay submerged the whole time.
Have Fun
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Good advice, 10W. I'll toss 5 test scraps in and pull one out each day. In 5 days or less, I'll have the color I want identified. Thanks for the tips.
Update, three days later.
I finished the last batch of dye from the English hulls and have a good gallon of dye. Certainly enough to get some completed holsters done. I have a small bowl with three scraps in it for testing. One will come out each day to see how it looks. The black walnut hulls arrived yesterday and I may start a batch of those soon. It all depends on how nice the existing stuff looks after testing. I have two Frazier holsters to do immediately and a whole rig after that. I'm not sure how to do a belt with such a small batch. If I coil it, it'll touch somewhere and cause a light spot. We'll see. Maybe I'll glue ends on a piece of pvc pipe long enough to take a whole belt and split it lengthwise.
Marshall, if you have a Brownells catalog, the bluing tanks might work. Might be a bit pricey tho. I havent looked in awhile. DM
Marshal, all you have to do is leave the dye in a pot/bowl/container that is high enough that you will be able to cover it with your dye, you can swish the dye up a couple times a day and also turn your belt over at the same time, try to stay with plastic or glass for doing this, when you put your belt in , just loosen it up a little and it will come out fine, I used a large tall wide plastic pitcher the last time , the kind workers use and have in ther trucks, and it worked great and allowed me to get the dye high enough to cover the belt without having to use very much liquid dye. Let me know how you do with this?
Have Fun ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Thanks, 10W. I'll see how that works.
I hadn't thought of a bluing tank, Dalton. Thanks, I may try that if 10W's idea doesn't pan out (no pun intended ;D).
Quote from: Marshal Will Wingam on August 07, 2008, 11:59:14 PM
(no pun intended ;D).
Yea, sure! OK, well, it is YOUR story! ::) ;D ;D
Just post us a picture when it's all ready, Marshall.
Quote from: Dr. Bob on August 08, 2008, 12:35:08 AM
Yea, sure! OK, well, it is YOUR story! ::) ;D ;D
:D Howdy Bob , So how do you like my story so far ? :D ;D ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Is it good fiction? ;D
I have my Frazier holster finished and waiting for my test scraps to be done so I'll know what to expect. Day one scrap is a nice, light to medium brown. I'm looking forward to see what tomorrow's scrap brings.
Howdy Gents
Will I finished my Cheyeene Holsters today, they were submurged in my walnut dye for five days, I then dried them after molding them to my guns, I conditioned them with Lexol, then a few coats of EVOO, and then a finish coat of Skidmores Leather Cream, I DIDN'T SUN TAN THEM THIS TIME BECAUSE I didn't want them to get too dark I'm going to show these pictures as the process happened. When I put these holsters in the container I first pulled them out of the loops so they would get even coloring, once in the container I put the lid on it and made sure my holsters were submerged.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
next this is the color they dried to after being in the dye for five days, and how they finished out, even though they appear to be light in color , the five days of soaking realy impregnates the dye into the leather, and when you add your oil of choice, the browns just pop out, they came out so well this time , that I chose not to put them in the sun , I feared they might turn too dark of a brown, so this is the color I got with just a few coats of oil and Skidmores, and lots of Lexol before I started the oil, you want to replenish any of the oils that were lost during the dyeing process, using Lexoil first to condition the leather real well, will help bring things back to normal, and then do your EVOO or Neatsfoof oil, several coats or to where your satisfied with the color, and then finish with Skidmores.
and here are some more pictures of the the same holsters, I really like the tone and shade I got this time. You probably noticed that I used two different shades of leather, the right hand holster had the lightest shade, so on this one I just added more coats of Evoo to bring more of the brown out, and it worked. Over all I think I prefer the darker colors of fresh veg-tan over the lighter, you seem to get better tones from the darker shades, but again it's up to you. These are the final colors after all the oil's and finish coat of Skidmores have dried.
You might have noticed that the edge stamping is different on both holsters, I just wanted to see which way I liked it best , sometimes you just have to think outside the box, and it looks fine to me , it kind of gives it Charactor, ( sorta like Forty Rod )
Thanks for stopping by and taking a looky loo
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Dang 10W! I like those. I need to make another something to test out my new better batch of dye. After looking at yours, mine really didnt pick up much walnut color. I think mine is more from the suntanning.
I like the differences in the holsters. Close enough to look the same at a glance, but different upon study. The slight color difference is nice too. One months pay saved to buy another holster. WTG. DM
Looks great, 10W. You also answered my question on the other thread so now I'll have to go over and edit that. Thanks for the run-down on the dye process. Yeah, those borders are nice. I like the way you made them a bit different, too. Fine work.
10 W the outer edges are darker than the inner part at least in my computer screen. If so what did you do to the outer 1/2" perimeter to get the darker shade? Was it just more coats of evoo?
Love the coloring and the holsters. Like I said on the other thread we need a test report from a shoot.
Johnny Dingus
Howdy All
Thanks everyone for the kind words, this has been a fun project and a learning one too, Dalton I think you will get darker results if you will leave your leather submerged and do not take it out to dry each day , plus that in, in out and back in is hard on the leather, just leave it in for the length of time you have desided on, and only swish the dye up and turn your leather over or around everyday and thats all. This works best. ( IMHO )
Marshal Will , I'm glad you found the info. you were looking for I was hoping you hadn't passed it up, I'm happy you like the border stamping.
Johnny Dingus, you guessed it , if you want what ever area darker just use a little more oil, I got this efect by useing a paint brush, with a 1/2" bristles, this way I was able to control where it went and how much I wanted to put on it. But just like the test I did on scrap, it you go 5 days in the dye, then do your conditioning and then your choice of oil, then you can make it even more of a darker brown, by putting it in the sun, but you have to keep an eye on it, or you will get a solid dark brown. ??? I like doing this , it gives you an antique look, without hurting the leather, and it's pleasing to the eye. ::) :o 8)
Thanks Pards for stopping by and taking a look ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
:)Hey TW,
Mine came out the very same color :o :) But they realy darken up when you treat them!! I hope to show mine today, just got them done yesterday, belt all done but a little hardware to put on, and havn't made up my mind on what for sure yet!
I am going to throw a piece of scrap in the tub, and do a 2 day test and finish and see if it is a little more golden, I will let you you all know!
Great lookin holsters there Pard!!
ACE
Howdy Gents :D
I thought I would try my new walnut dyed holsters out on a money belt I made a while back, to see how well the color would go along with the other browns, I think mix and match works well with the browns, so here they are toting my 5 1/2" NM Vaquero's.
Ace, I think your holsters came out fine , and thats your own pattern, you can be proud Pard, the color came out nice, and will only look better with time , LIKE US, ( LOL ) well maybe not that good, it shows you how deep and dark you can go with this walnut dye , can't wait to see your belt, I know they will look great together. ::) :o 8)
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
That mix and match looks good. It's more historically correct, too. Great rig, pard. ;)
Darn you tEN wOLVES.
You keep raising the bar everytime you post. ;)
That outfit looks great with the belt.
And now you are getting to be like Mr. Burrows with your staging of the picture. :)
I think the picture is great just wish I had all that creative talent right now. Instead of having to get better each time. :-[
You know us kids we want it all right now. ;D
Johnny Dingus
OK, here's my first shot at dying a full holster. It came out OK. The holster lightened where the pieces touched after I tucked the pouch into the skirt strap. I dont' know what that's all about, but I'll figure it out eventually. It did sit in the Sun for a couple hours initially so maybe that had something to do with it. This was one day in the dye, a coat of EVOO and a coat of Lexol.
Howdy Marshal Will,
Looks great. The color is one that I like a lot! Nice looking holster too!!
Howdy Will,
I think your holster looks fine, if you sun tan, just pull the body of the holster out of the loop, and you will get a more even coloring, although it looks fine the way it is, for only one day in the the dye, you won't get a lot of color, but it did give you a nice tint and an amber glow to it, you did a nice job on making your holster , I like this style for Auto's it still keeps it western.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
MW,
That looks great for a one day soak, the color fits the period of the gun! That is what is great about the walnut dye, one dye can give so many affects! At this time I have only 2 rigs that I want to make! And both are very complects for me, and i have to have my head clear to when I start either one of them!
I have been in a lot of pain lately with a week of real damp weather, that the moriphine isn't working, and then i take 3-4 vicoden and they make me so sleeping and tired that I don't want to mess anything else!
i did make me a bowie knife, let me re state that, i bought a bowie knife at a garage sale for a dollar (didn't have a handle, thats why I bought it). I put a deer antler for a handle, couldn't find a piece of brass in this po dunk town so I made one out of walnet, now I am working on a streath for it.
:( I tell you what is sad, I spent the whole afternoon with cased leather scraps, trying to figure out a border for a moumtain man knife! i guess like writers block.
Sorry that I got long winded and got off the topic, I realy like your 1911 :o
ACE
Marshall Will, variation in color doesn't bother me one bit. I kinda like it matter a fact. The holster turned out great for such a short little gem. ;) Thanks fer showin' it to us. Yer makers mark is a nice touch as well. You have the walnut dye thing down pretty good, I'm thinkin'!!!
TW, we're gonna have ta pass the hat and gitchya one a those tripod camera things for shootin' cowboys with their darlin's at some a these events. Real nice picture takin'. I like the still life ya set up. That money belt is real nice as well as the rest of the rig that we have seen before. I need a money belt so I guess that will be coming up shortly. Nice set of accelerators, too. Who made them?
Beans and Tacos,
X Horse Pen
Thanks for the compliments, pards. X-pen, I also like the color variation. It gives a time-worn look without roughing it up any. 10W, you confirmed what I was thinking about what causes the variation. I'll try one the other way soon. Right now, I'm making another one just like it because my cousin came by and claimed that one. ;D I'll do the same tanning method to get that variation. I life the keeper strap off because we're going to use these for Wild Bunch matches. For a hunting or a run-around holster, I'd put the strap on. Ace, the batch of dye I made is like what you'd find in the oil pan of an old farm truck. Almost sludge in the bottom. I boiled those hulls (last year's, dried ones) until they were mush and strained off the chunks.
Quote from: HorsePen Henry on August 11, 2008, 08:37:51 PM
Marshall Will, variation in color doesn't bother me one bit. I kinda like it matter a fact. The holster turned out great for such a short little gem. ;) Thanks fer showin' it to us. Yer makers mark is a nice touch as well. You have the walnut dye thing down pretty good, I'm thinkin'!!!
TW, we're gonna have ta pass the hat and gitchya one a those tripod camera things for shootin' cowboys with their darlin's at some a these events. Real nice picture takin'. I like the still life ya set up. That money belt is real nice as well as the rest of the rig that we have seen before. I need a money belt so I guess that will be coming up shortly. Nice set of accelerators, too. Who made them?
Beans and Tacos,
X Horse Pen
[/quote
Howdy XPen
Thanks for the flowers on my picture taking, it's kind of fun , and it makes things more interesting, and I use my pictures as background on my PC, this way I can study my work , and see wether there is anything I might change the next time, it's also a great way to visit your work, a lot easier than bringing out everything. The eccelerators I got from Colorado Saddlery, in Denver, I looked real close , but I didn't see any beans or taco's, although that South of the Border Silver is dang nice.
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Marshal Will :D
Your holster looks fine just the way it is , I hope you weren't thinking I thought different, the lighter and darker shades will happen naturally in time anyway, just from wear and being in the sun, but if you want to give the color the same start all around, just leave it out of the loop untill your done with the finish, and this same method is good for anything in leather you want to sun tan, unless you are going for that look from the get go. This is one of the nice things about the natural dyes, there are so many ways you can make your leather look. ::) :o 8)
Have fun Pard ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
Quote from: Ten Wolves Fiveshooter on August 12, 2008, 11:16:54 AMYour holster looks fine just the way it is , I hope you weren't thinking I thought different, the lighter and darker shades will happen naturally in time anyway, just from wear and being in the sun, but if you want to give the color the same start all around, just leave it out of the loop untill your done with the finish, and this same method is good for anything in leather you want to sun tan, unless you are going for that look from the get go. This is one of the nice things about the natural dyes, there are so many ways you can make your leather look. ::) :o 8)
You didn't give the impression you didn't like it. I was expecting one thing and got something else. The something else was actually nicer than what I was expecting. I just wanted to know why it did what it did so I could repeat it when I wanted to. On the second one, I put it in the sun for a short while before folding the pouch into the skirt strap. Then I carefully aligned it with the sun to minimize the area covered by shadows, turning it frequently. That gave a more even color, but still with the nice shaded effect. This is great fun playing with the natural stuff. I know what to expect with this second one so I'll probably try coffee as a second process to see what comes from that. Again, thanks for the help on this.
I had a rag-tag holster I made from garbage leather to test my Frazier pattern. I was going to toss it but decided to use it to test the coffee dying process. I soaked it for 5 hours and set it in the sun. OK, ever so slight coloration but nothing you'd notice after it dried. I took it inside and put it under a lamp to dry quicker. A little later I smelled coffee roasting. I checked and whoa, did that stuff start turning dark. OK, the lamp was a bit overboard but it was a good testbed. On a decent item, I'll be a bit more careful.
Howdy All :D
I just finished a Johnny McCrae, rifle butt cover for my 1874 Pedersoli Sharps Business Rifle 45/70, Johnny's idea of making a butt covers is top notch,I submerged my leather in my natural walnut dye for six days, and then finished in EVOO and Skidmores Leather Cream.
Thanks for taking a look ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
WOW!! That looks great! The color is wonderful. ;D
That does look good. Dr Bob is right, The color is really nice. The shading on it works for me. I'll bet that pad is just right, too. Good work. Now, let's see a target... :D
Howdy Pal
Butt cover came out great.
WC
Cover Looks real nice Ten Wolves..
Color just right..... :)
Johnny Dingus
Thanks All, for your nice comments, you gotta love this stuff ;D
tEN wOLVES ;) :D ;D
I just finished brewing up a batch of Natural Walnut Dye with the help and guidance of Ten Wolves. Attached are a few pictures of a sample test holster and a test swatch. Both pieces has been soaking for five plus days in the dye solution. The Holster is from a scrap of leather and will serve as just a cover for my Bride's .38 Smith & Wesson. After the dye process, I applied two coats of EVO to each piece. The Holster has Skidmore's as the final finish and the swatch has Bag Kote as the final finish. Learning this technique will give my work a new look. Now the fun will start experimenting with different methods of finishing etc.
I would like to give special thanks to Ten Wolves Fiveshooter for the personal help and encouragement he has given me in leather working and a variety of other subjects. He is always available to help a Pard. TW is an asset to this forum and CAS City.
Johnny
looking good there bud love the color wish we had walnut trees around here id love to make some of my own walnut dye but thats what happens when ya live in wyoming LOL maybe someday someone down south with acess to walnuts could send me some LOL
Cowboy316
That color is really beautiful, Johnny. Did you leave it in the Sun to tan at all? The natural finishes really look great. Your wife's 38 should be happy. Thanks for the pics.
Howdy Cowboy and Marshall Will,
Many thanks for the kind words.
Sunshine and warm weather have been a bit of scarce commodity here in Wisconsin lately. This one did not seen the sun yet.
Dang, that's such a rich brown! Nice job.